I am for any changes that results in grown men not wearing such getups as this:

shiftyandquick said:

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FrankK said:

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I am curious. A pay increase for scouting graduates would be warranted if their performance, effectiveness, or "time to get to fighting strength" is superior to those who aren't. Also, the relation may no longer benefit the DoW as it used to as well.

Perhaps the qualitative or quantitative benefits don't merit pay differences any longer. Those would be a deciding factors. We shouldn't perpetuate relationships just for sentimental reasons.

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You'd like data, huh? Do you think Pete Hegseth has data? Do you think Hegseth cares about data?

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Why would you think otherwise?

Teslag said:

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shiftyandquick said:

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Mormons quitting BSA was a knife to the back. They lost more than 30% of their membership in one fell swoop. Because Mormons being, frankly, anti-gay. But I think that they couched it in terms of making sure that their programs were the same in the US as compared to other countries.

My son's troop is male-only. He is doing service hours -- community volunteering -- to try and rank up (he has been poorly motivated before, but seems motivated now). I think Scouting is making him a better person. And is helping him.

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I think for the bolded what you meant to say was mormons are following christian doctrine.

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Exactly.

How dare a religion stand up for their moral convictions....

ALSO

You must address Joe as Joeline at work and use his pronouns that he can choose to change AT ANY TIME or you will be written up by HR and/or you will be fired.


Can't have it both ways.

I was involved with three Mormon boy scout troops. They did evangelize just a little, but mostly just promoted good family values. I dropped out because I could tell I was treated differently by the leaders because I wasn't Mormon, but I did learn how to build a fire very well, how to start a fire without matches, get clean water without using a fire, set up a tent, protect food from raccoons in the wild, handle a snake bite (unfortunately), and trap fish in rivers using sticks.

I would be all about supporting an organization that focuses on that. I do not believe that BSA does that anymore.

I would support a girl scout troop where the initiation was learning how to clean fish. If a girl is interested in how to clean fish, a girl scout troop would probably be good for her.

agent-maroon said:

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Quote:

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Just curious: Are the girls in scouting what we used to call "Tom-Boy" back in the day, or are they feminine young girls who just happen to be into scouting?

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I have relatives who have their girls in scouting. They're parents are the stereotypical libs that you read about here everyday and they're pretty much pushing their girls into scouting to promote their lib DEI agenda. The girls are just as likely to be wearing a shirt supporting things trans as they are scouting. Last family pic I saw had one of the girls wearing a "girls, guys, and them" (or something like that) event t-shirt.

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That sucks that the girls didn't want to go into scouting on their own. And their parents pushing them into it just so they can pollute the waters, which is really what they're doing, is pathetic.

Thanks for sharing. I hope this isn't the case with most girls in scouting.

The next time they are in office this will be the least of any concern.

BusterAg said:

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I was involved with three Mormon boy scout troops. They did evangelize just a little, but mostly just promoted good family values. I dropped out because I could tell I was treated differently by the leaders because I wasn't Mormon, but I did learn how to build a fire very well, how to start a fire without matches, get clean water without using a fire, set up a tent, protect food from raccoons in the wild, handle a snake bite (unfortunately), and trap fish in rivers using sticks.

I would be all about supporting an organization that focuses on that. I do not believe that BSA does that anymore.

I would support a girl scout troop where the initiation was learning how to clean fish. If a girl is interested in how to clean fish, a girl scout troop would probably be good for her.

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Currently they have an organization that teaches them how to sell cookies, I think one of the main reason why BSA went co-ed.

Ellis Wyatt said:

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SanDiegoAg12 said:

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It's a travesty what's happened to BSA as evidenced by the need to change the name.

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Robert Gates should never be allowed to live it down. Disgraceful.

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He'll be associated with its downfall for sure.

Back around 2015 someone reached out to our troop and wanted to hire a Boy Scout to dog sit their dog. My son volunteered and I would bring him to their home.

It was an older couple and they were transplants from Pennsylvania. Turns out the husband was an executive for BSA. The wife was a raging lib and constantly brought up politics to my son, who was about 14 at the time. They multiple Hillary yard signs in their yard situated in Castle Hills near The Colony. They were only in Texas a few years but knowing that family told me a lot about where the organization was headed.

Even their damn dog sucked. It was a Corgi and would lay down and refuse to walk. I had to pick my son up a half mile away from their home because their damn dog was too lazy and spoiled to walk.

Buck Turgidson said:

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bobbranco said:

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Ranger65 enabled a merry band of gays in the C-Suite to ruin the BSA. Congratulations.

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We all used to think he was great at A&M. He sure became a disappointment after he left College Station.

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He was a disappointment in CS, too. Look at what happened to the University.

Buck Turgidson said:

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bobbranco said:

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Ranger65 enabled a merry band of gays in the C-Suite to ruin the BSA. Congratulations.

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We all used to think he was great at A&M. He sure became a disappointment after he left College Station.

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I can assure you that not "all" liked what he did at A&M. Far from it with my Ag family & acquaintances.


ETA - people don't really change much after they reach a certain age. He held the same values at A&M as he did at the organization formerly known as BSA. He just had more subtle marketing at A&M .

BusterAg said:

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I was involved with three Mormon boy scout troops. They did evangelize just a little, but mostly just promoted good family values. I dropped out because I could tell I was treated differently by the leaders because I wasn't Mormon, but I did learn how to build a fire very well, how to start a fire without matches, get clean water without using a fire, set up a tent, protect food from raccoons in the wild, handle a snake bite (unfortunately), and trap fish in rivers using sticks.

I would be all about supporting an organization that focuses on that. I do not believe that BSA does that anymore.

I would support a girl scout troop where the initiation was learning how to clean fish. If a girl is interested in how to clean fish, a girl scout troop would probably be good for her.

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My understanding is that girl scouts is much less outdoor focused.

Recently I went on a Philmont trek with my son and his troop. If you knew what that was, you wouldn't have made this post.

So is it possible to start a new organization named Boy Scouts of America that would be just for boys, and had the traditional values of the prior BSA org before it was ruined?

TAMUallen said:

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I miss Indian Guides. The version of boy scouts that was just hanging out, doing some outdoorsy **** and dads probably drinking beer.

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Agree. I was in Indian guides as a kid and had my boys in it until 2016 when the Houston YMCA shut it down.

Hill Country Ag said:

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So is it possible to start a new organization named Boy Scouts of America that would be just for boys, and had the traditional values of the prior BSA org before it was ruined?

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Email Erika Kirk and tell her TPUSA needs an outdoor survival training program.

But I think Scouting America kept the trademarks for BSA so restarting it may pose issues.

flown-the-coop said:

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Hill Country Ag said:

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So is it possible to start a new organization named Boy Scouts of America that would be just for boys, and had the traditional values of the prior BSA org before it was ruined?

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Email Erika Kirk and tell her TPUSA needs an outdoor survival training program.

But I think Scouting America kept the trademarks for BSA so restarting it may pose issues.

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What about Trail Life USA? I believe that's where many of the Mormons moved to.

https://www.traillifeusa.com/start?https://www.traillifeusa.com/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=002%20-%20Boys%20Scout%20Alternative&utm_term=tr


https://www.traillifeusa.com/find-a-troop/

I am unaware of them but appreciate the links and a brief look seems like a good replacement.

Even for non-Christian's, your children can benefit from Christian-based organizations and programs. It does NOT mean your child will be brainwashed and converted to a bible-thumping baptist who thinks dancing is a mortal sin.

Again, thanks for sharing!

Ferg said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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Hill Country Ag said:

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So is it possible to start a new organization named Boy Scouts of America that would be just for boys, and had the traditional values of the prior BSA org before it was ruined?

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Email Erika Kirk and tell her TPUSA needs an outdoor survival training program.

But I think Scouting America kept the trademarks for BSA so restarting it may pose issues.

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What about Trail Life USA? I believe that's where many of the Mormons moved to.

https://www.traillifeusa.com/start?https://www.traillifeusa.com/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=002%20-%20Boys%20Scout%20Alternative&utm_term=tr


https://www.traillifeusa.com/find-a-troop/

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The LDS church did not join or associate with Trail Life USA. No relationship there.

LDS church has its own youth program now that is not an outdoor program at all. It's a DIY figure it out with the boys program, with high variability in terms of what is happening in each group, because there really is no proscriptive plan. And because it generally relies on adults, my perception is that they are doing much less than they did before with the scouts.

I have never met an LDS person that chose to be in Trail Life. Although I suspect that there are some out there. I know many LDS families that are still involved in scouts, but the % of LDS that chose to remain involved with scouts in my estimation is quite low. Probably less than 5%. Which shows the level of dedication to scouts that existed before the divorce, and why the scouting programming in LDS troops often sucked.

Bird Poo said:

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aggiez03 said:

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My kids were in scouts and was a scout leader as well.

We were actually at summer camp in Texas when leadership from DFW came in and told the scout leaders directly:

If you had an untapped market in your business where you could double your revenue, would you just ignore it? We saw all the sisters of scouts and other girls where we could bring them into the fold and generate more revenue.

Shortly after allowing girls in boy scouts (in and of itself ridiculous), they decided to 'go woke' with a required Diversity merit badge and a whole host of other things along with that. I had one kid pre-Diversity Scout manual and one after, so it was clear to see what they intent was.

At that point, COVID hit and our meetings got canceled for 2-3 months, and we never went back.

Long story short, Scouts would not take a stand against gay leadership and it cost them the Mormons who bolted and they decided to take girls to try and make up the lost revenue.

We haven't been involved in 5+ years, but I doubt the leadership got any better, so I don't blame the gov't for severing ties based on the direction it was headed.

That being said, to say NPR and OP have an agenda, would be the understatement of the year.

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This.

I have 2 Eagle Scouts and my two other sons are about to get Eagle.

Texas Boy Scout camps are pretty traditional, but when you get to camps in CO, it's a whole different organization. Blue hair and piercings all over the staff. Trans everywhere.

Yes, girls are separated, but they're a total distraction. They still camp at the same time at the same camps. We had 14 year old boys whose main focus was to get phone numbers instead of working on merit badges.

Our troop is dissolving in the spring.

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My boys are 22, 10, and 7. With my eldest, we were with the BSA. Trail Life sprung up in that time frame, but we elected to keep up with the BSA up until he aged out. He earned Eagle. We had an excellent troop with incredible volunteers for the most part. Parents and volunteers kept the new national level policies at bay. For that reason and that my son indicated he gained much value from the older boys in the troop as mentors, we stayed. (He would have been the oldest boy in the Trail Life troop if we had bolted.)

My younger two boys are in Trail Life now and enjoying it very much.

FrankK said:

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shiftyandquick said:

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FrankK said:

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I am curious. A pay increase for scouting graduates would be warranted if their performance, effectiveness, or "time to get to fighting strength" is superior to those who aren't. Also, the relation may no longer benefit the DoW as it used to as well.

Perhaps the qualitative or quantitative benefits don't merit pay differences any longer. Those would be a deciding factors. We shouldn't perpetuate relationships just for sentimental reasons.

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You'd like data, huh? Do you think Pete Hegseth has data? Do you think Hegseth cares about data?

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I didn't ask Pete for data, dumba$$. Unlike you, I don't trust data from anyone doing a self-evaluation. That kind of data would come from a third party. But thank you for making this a politically biased thread rather than discussing the issues.

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This move is all about virtue signaling to the MAGA base. It has nothing to do with data or outcomes. This is indisputable.

Quote:

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This move is all about virtue signaling to the MAGA base. It has nothing to do with data or outcomes.

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It is definitely that.

It seems so short-sighted. Both my kids eagled, and that process requires you to camp, demonstrate physical fitness, interact with local city and state leaders, learn first aid, and so many other things that are just vanishing amidst a new generation of obese, sedentary kids addicted to phones and gaming consoles.

The BSA adventure opportunities from Philmont to Boundary Waters to Sea Base are all first rate, unique experiences.

Everything is fair game in the culture wars, however.

I generally concur with the disappointment in changes BSA has made from my childhood. But I'm involved in a Pack with my son and its all-boy. The troop is also all-boy. I have several friends who have sons that are in the troop or have earned their Eagle. From my interactions, they've developed as much of what I learned if not more from scouting. They are outdoor focused, leaders, with great futures in front of them.

By allowing the charter organization to make some specific determinations, they've allowed many boys across the country to still experience scouting as we knew as kids.

As to the girls, I have met many young women who have earned their Eagle and they are far from liberal. They got involved because in the area, there was no comparable outdoor focused program like scouting. In most of the cases, the dads were scouts and they had no sons.

Its easy to generalize but there's still a ton of great kids coming out of scouts with the lessons we learned as kids.

Another great option is the Civil Air Patrol Cadet Program.

They have three types of Squadrons.

Senior(Adults only), Cadet and Composite. The Composite Squadron is Georgetown is great,

For those not familiar, its for kids 12 to 18, and its Coed. They learn a lot about Aerospace, as well as how to drill, and there is also a PT aspect. They can up to 4 flying lessons also as Cadets.

One of my sons was in the Cadet Squadron at Camp Mabry, and was qualified for ground searches. His squad participated in the search for the remains of the Space Ship Columbia,

My Grandson was active in the Georgetown Squadron and went into the Air Force after high school. Because of how far he went in CAP, he skipped E2 when he go out of bootcamp.

shiftyandquick said:

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Ferg said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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Hill Country Ag said:

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So is it possible to start a new organization named Boy Scouts of America that would be just for boys, and had the traditional values of the prior BSA org before it was ruined?

---

Email Erika Kirk and tell her TPUSA needs an outdoor survival training program.

But I think Scouting America kept the trademarks for BSA so restarting it may pose issues.

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What about Trail Life USA? I believe that's where many of the Mormons moved to.

https://www.traillifeusa.com/start?https://www.traillifeusa.com/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=002%20-%20Boys%20Scout%20Alternative&utm_term=tr


https://www.traillifeusa.com/find-a-troop/

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The LDS church did not join or associate with Trail Life USA. No relationship there.

LDS church has its own youth program now that is not an outdoor program at all. It's a DIY figure it out with the boys program, with high variability in terms of what is happening in each group, because there really is no proscriptive plan. And because it generally relies on adults, my perception is that they are doing much less than they did before with the scouts.

I have never met an LDS person that chose to be in Trail Life. Although I suspect that there are some out there. I know many LDS families that are still involved in scouts, but the % of LDS that chose to remain involved with scouts in my estimation is quite low. Probably less than 5%. Which shows the level of dedication to scouts that existed before the divorce, and why the scouting programming in LDS troops often sucked.

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sorry if i got the trail life connection wrong.

Trail Life is Christian.

Mormons not so much.

Quote:

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Both my kids eagled, and that process requires you to camp, demonstrate physical fitness, interact with local city and state leaders, learn first aid, and so many other things that are just vanishing amidst a new generation of obese, sedentary kids addicted to phones and gaming consoles.

The BSA adventure opportunities from Philmont to Boundary Waters to Sea Base are all first rate, unique experiences.

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Every bit of that is still in place.

I will post it again, as an Eagle Scout product from the book of old, I give this pledge:

If I ever come across F you, lottery style money, it will become my mission to rebuild the BSA. I will acquire all BSA assets and go back to the original intent of the organization. #1 rule, No Women allowed. the pedo crap and transie crap is auto-out. Lawyers by the convoy. Boys will become young men and those young men will have a leg up on life while owning a soul.