Oh geez. Next thing you know they will retool / restart the long dormant refinery in Nixon, Texas…..

honestly didn't know we had any of that type of industry stateside

CW Griswold said:

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Most American ship breaking happens on the Brownsville Channel. An oil refinery will probably be the cleanest thing over there.

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If Demorats win in 2028 this thing will be dead

HumbleAg04 said:

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Light sweet small refinery run by the Indians. I question if it will even get built or be profitable once it does.

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Reliance from India isnt a joke. They run the largest refinery in the world in Jamnagar, India.

They had to build a 50,000 person township just to house the workers and their families that run the refinery.

The Fall Guy said:

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HumbleAg04 said:

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Light sweet small refinery run by the Indians. I question if it will even get built or be profitable once it does.

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Called the America First refinery run by Indians.

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Dot or feather?

AgBQ-00 said:

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that is good news though. we need more capacity.

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I've heard that with another one of these gas prices will come down even more. Hopefully i heard correctly.

Port of Brownsville already has some large tank terminals, a small refinery will complement the crude and refined products industry that is already there. I suspect it has something more to do with SpaceX down the road, but that's just my 2 cents peasant input. They will need fuel supplies to send all those Strship rockets into space.

Gilligan said:

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The Fall Guy said:

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HumbleAg04 said:

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Light sweet small refinery run by the Indians. I question if it will even get built or be profitable once it does.

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Called the America First refinery run by Indians.

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Dot or feather?

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Well, they aren't refining firewater.

Dis gonna be good. A Board of Directors of the Port of Brownsville/Navigation District is the grandson of Juan N. Guerra, the founder of the Gulf Cartel (also in a runoff for Dem candidate for Cameron County judge). A true American success story.

Houston Lee said:

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HumbleAg04 said:

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Light sweet small refinery run by the Indians. I question if it will even get built or be profitable once it does.

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Reliance from India isnt a joke. They run the largest refinery in the world in Jamnagar, India.

They had to build a 50,000 person township just to house the workers and their families that run the refinery.

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Oh, cool, so it will be built and run by 500 hispanics...

AgBQ-00 said:

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honestly didn't know we had any of that type of industry stateside

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They were looking to expand operations down there pretty significantly.

Gilligan said:

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The Fall Guy said:

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HumbleAg04 said:

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Light sweet small refinery run by the Indians. I question if it will even get built or be profitable once it does.

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Called the America First refinery run by Indians.

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Dot or feather?

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Dot

Ag with kids said:

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Houston Lee said:

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HumbleAg04 said:

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Light sweet small refinery run by the Indians. I question if it will even get built or be profitable once it does.

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Reliance from India isnt a joke. They run the largest refinery in the world in Jamnagar, India.

They had to build a 50,000 person township just to house the workers and their families that run the refinery.

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Oh, cool, so it will be built and run by 500 hispanics...

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Ewwwww


Amirite!?

BTW, Marathon Garyville (outside New Orleans) and Motiva Port Arthur built "new refineries" next to their existing ones in the last 20 years that are much larger and more complex than this planned refinery. There have also been several new refineries planned in the U.S. that didn't get built.

However, with the permit already approved and Reliance behind it, this has a good chance to happen.

The Sun said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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Get down Pasadena and No Name BBQ.

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Pasa-get down-dena

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Am I listening to Moby in the Morning on 97 Rock?

Dan Scott said:

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I think they added 2 extra 0s to the price.

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As one who's job it is to estimate the cost of refineries, I can't imagine $300,000,000,000.00 for a refinery. Especially in Brownsville. Even if the government built it and ran the project, they probably couldn't spend that much.

When I first saw the headline, I was thinking 300,000 BPD.

HumbleAg04 said:

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JamesE4 said:

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Trump added a few extra zeroes, and it is called America First Refining now. Here is their website - https://americafirstrefining.com (not first American).

Someone high in their management said it was a $4 billion dollar refinery - I don't see any way they spend $300 billion.

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It's being funded and operated by Reliance Industries. Trumps investment numbers likely include prospective LNG and petrochemical projects this could help.

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Maybe a new football stadium added?

2 new refineries, 3 LNG, whatever other petrochemical projects won't get to $300 billion.

Some whacky numbers there.

GScience Denier said:

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HumbleAg04 said:

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JamesE4 said:

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Trump added a few extra zeroes, and it is called America First Refining now. Here is their website - https://americafirstrefining.com (not first American).

Someone high in their management said it was a $4 billion dollar refinery - I don't see any way they spend $300 billion.

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It's being funded and operated by Reliance Industries. Trumps investment numbers likely include prospective LNG and petrochemical projects this could help.

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Maybe a new football stadium added?

2 new refineries, 3 LNG, whatever other petrochemical projects won't get to $300 billion.

Some whacky numbers there.

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On X someone said the $300 billion represents the economic revenues over the life of the facility. Someone else implied it is total Indian investment in U.S., of which this is a small part.

SPI and the enviro-Nazis will be up in arms but there isn't ****-all they can do about it (see Next Decade LNG terminal). The Port of Brownsville owns approximately 50,000 acres of undeveloped land on either side of the ship channel and developing that is their responsibility. Whether is mars a 25-degree viewing window from SPI is irrelevant.

***edit to add a zero to the available acreage at the PoB

Question for the oil patch experts: Is a new refinery much improved via new technology or computers to provide a safer, more efficient or less expensive alternative to the old refineries we have in SE Texas?

Have 5 decades improved what we can expect from a new gen refinery?

I was growing up in the 60s in Houston. We would go to the shore often. Crabbing, fishing, etc. The Ship Channel was filthy. Mom always had alcohol (isopropyl type) to clean all of the tar off of us from being at the beach before getting back into the car to go home.

If all of that mess could be cleaned up, I'm not too concerned about new generation of refineries all of these years later.

WestAustinAg said:

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Question for the oil patch experts: Is a new refinery much improved via new technology or computers to provide a safer, more efficient or less expensive alternative to the old refineries we have in SE Texas?

Have 5 decades improved what we can expect from a new gen refinery?

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It's safer because it's not all bandaids and rubber bands holding everything together.

Science Denier said:

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WestAustinAg said:

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Question for the oil patch experts: Is a new refinery much improved via new technology or computers to provide a safer, more efficient or less expensive alternative to the old refineries we have in SE Texas?

Have 5 decades improved what we can expect from a new gen refinery?

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It's safer because it's not all bandaids and rubber bands holding everything together.

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JFC, the visuals. LOL

TX_COWDOC said:

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Oh geez. Next thing you know they will retool / restart the long dormant refinery in Nixon, Texas…..

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https://www.blue-dolphin-energy.com/operations


sarcasm or have they closed it again? For years they scammed millions from the SBA saying they would reopen but then eventually did in 2012 I think?

guessing 300k bbl/day would be $6BB - $8BB depending on units. Maybe the $3bb if minimal processing for the sweeter blends

$300bb is more than a refinery

not sure I see this happening unless there is some surge of production planned from Eagle Ford that I am out of the loop on, which I could be.

WestAustinAg said:

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Question for the oil patch experts: Is a new refinery much improved via new technology or computers to provide a safer, more efficient or less expensive alternative to the old refineries we have in SE Texas?

Have 5 decades improved what we can expect from a new gen refinery?

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Slightly safer, not cheaper.

Only other factor I can think of is building on an underused port could have some benefits of adding refining capacity without increase ship traffic.

WestAustinAg said:

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Question for the oil patch experts: Is a new refinery much improved via new technology or computers to provide a safer, more efficient or less expensive alternative to the old refineries we have in SE Texas?

Have 5 decades improved what we can expect from a new gen refinery?

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Ehhh, CDUB is in a temporary, err, ummm, timeout.

That being said, generally no.

All of the large refiners have spent significant amounts of money upgrading safety systems and control systems throughout their plants. Even less sophisticated refiners are being forced to update. While there still is variance, the entire industry is much safer and more efficient than it was even just 25 years ago. Between OSHA regulations, environmental regulations, injury lawsuits, and rebuilding costs, the industry finally figured out that it was MUCH cheaper to spend capital money which can be depreciated than spending it on fines, settlements, and rebuilds.

Also, while no new refineries have been built, many refineries have expanded operations within their existing property lines and tagged onto existing air and other environmental permits. So, in reality, refining capacity has kept up with demand.

Anything in Brownsville is supply the export market anyway. So it will certainly make some investors in America very great indeed. Not nearly enough demand in South Texas to make that worthwhile, nor in the cross-border or barges to Northern Mexico market.

This all just sounds like creative marketing to get some federal money.

BDUB95 said:

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Also, while no new refineries have been built, many refineries have expanded operations within their existing property lines and tagged onto existing air and other environmental permits. So, in reality, refining capacity has kept up with demand.

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Exactly. When all the O&G CEOs were at the WH, Trump asked Marathon's CEO if we needed new refineries and she said (correctly) 'no.'

The article says the life of the refinery is 20 years. It also says it will process 1.2 billion barrels of oil during it's life. Doing the math that's about 60 million barrels of oil per year and about 165,000 barrels per day. The total capacity in the United States (EIA) as of last week refining capacity wise is 18 million barrels per day that's about .9% of the capacity.

So this will help …but Its not earth shattering. Trying to figure out the 300 billion expenditure must include everything. That refinery shouldn't cost more than $5-$7 billion. They say it will process 1.2 billion barrels during its life. That would be another 72 billion (at $60/bbl) of oil. The total cost must include operating expenses and the other facilities that will be built by the investors. Also pipelines from the Permian must be that figure.

I wonder where that "20 year" life expectancy comes from? I can assure you with no hesitation that the Valero, Citgo,and Flint Hills refineries have been along the CC ship channel a lot longer than that.

AggieChemE09 said:

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WestAustinAg said:

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Question for the oil patch experts: Is a new refinery much improved via new technology or computers to provide a safer, more efficient or less expensive alternative to the old refineries we have in SE Texas?

Have 5 decades improved what we can expect from a new gen refinery?

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Slightly safer, not cheaper.

Only other factor I can think of is building on an underused port could have some benefits of adding refining capacity without increase ship traffic.

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I seriously doubt this refinery gets built. There is a reason we haven't built a new refinery in the US in 50 years and meantime we have closed almost half of the refineries we had in 1982. We have plenty of capacity already as refineries are great at debottlenecking and the economics don't come close to justifying a new build.

As for safer, maybe a touch but it won't be a lot given the safety rates of US refineries is already unbelievably good these days.

B-1 83 said:

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I wonder where that "20 year" life expectancy comes from? I can assure you with no hesitation that the Valero, Citgo,and Flint Hills refineries have been along the CC ship channel a lot longer than that.

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It's a standard industry timeframe. In theory, every new unit/plant is built for a 20 year lifespan as rated in process rates, specifications, etc. Kind of making a point in time and say, "if nothing at all changes, then. 20 years."

Reality is that plants will debottleneck/expand and keep the train rolling, replacing pieces and parts along the way.

RGV AG said:

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Dis gonna be good. The port director of the Port of Brownsville is the grandson of Juan N. Guerra, the founder of the Gulf Cartel (also in a runoff for Dem candidate for Cameron County judge). A true American success story.

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Please check your facts as there is plenty of misinformation already on this thread. The Port Director is William Dietrich, a Seattle native, Army veteran and former Brownsville PD Commander. You are conflating Port Director with BND commissioners.