SunrayAg said:

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Hopefully he gets prison yard stomped to death, as slowly and painfully as possible, long before the needle.

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Yeah, I'm hoping for this as well. I hope every day he's in prison is an absolute hell for him, but he's probably going to be alone in his cell for at least 23 hours a day. Don't think he'll have much contact with the GEN pop.

DannyDuberstein said:

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I am 100% fine with it being retaliatory. Call it justice. Call it retaliatory. Just kill this evil piece of **** for what he did.

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I am too. Cause-and-effect. You kill someone then, you should be killed. We need a little more Wild West justice. I don't understand why anyone would have a problem with it being retaliatory.

Probably would feel different if it was their child.

TAMUallen said:

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Should be sentenced to cruel and unusual

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If a punishment is done often enough, then it ceases to be "unusual" by definition.

aggiehawg said:

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cevans_40 said:

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My problem with the death penalty is the cost to taxpayers. We need to revisit the process and make the appeal timeframe quicker and more efficient. Get it over with and get the guilty under the ground as soon as possible and lessen the taxpayer burden.

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Might be able to streamline the appeals process. Other than that due process requires a full investigation and trial. Defense counsel have one job, delay, delay, delay. That goes for pretrial proceedings and post conviction as allowed under appellate process.

The appellate process could be expedited by legislative action solely for DP cases.

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I don't necessarily have an issue with the original trial. It is more the appeal process and how long they sit waiting on the taxpayer dime before we finally put them to death. Right now the average in Texas is 11 years. What does that cost the taxpayers?

cevans_40 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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cevans_40 said:

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My problem with the death penalty is the cost to taxpayers. We need to revisit the process and make the appeal timeframe quicker and more efficient. Get it over with and get the guilty under the ground as soon as possible and lessen the taxpayer burden.

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Might be able to streamline the appeals process. Other than that due process requires a full investigation and trial. Defense counsel have one job, delay, delay, delay. That goes for pretrial proceedings and post conviction as allowed under appellate process.

The appellate process could be expedited by legislative action solely for DP cases.

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I don't necessarily have an issue with the original trial. It is more the appeal process and how long they sit waiting on the taxpayer dime before we finally put them to death. Right now the average in Texas is 11 years. What does that cost the taxpayers?

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There are people who have been sitting on Death row for almost 50 years. There is zero justification for that, imo.

The death penalty for Tanner Horner needs to be fast tracked.

annie88 said:

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SunrayAg said:

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Hopefully he gets prison yard stomped to death, as slowly and painfully as possible, long before the needle.

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Yeah, I'm hoping for this as well. I hope every day he's in prison is an absolute hell for him, but he's probably going to be alone in his cell for at least 23 hours a day. Don't think he'll have much contact with the GEN pop.

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Outside of being escorted around by the guards I doubt he'll ever have physical contact with another person.

I still say his "appeal" should be wrapped up in a week and from there he should be taken off shore and drowned, towed to the ocean bottom by a boat anchor.

This guy will out live me as his case crawls thru the halls of justice.

cevans_40 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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cevans_40 said:

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My problem with the death penalty is the cost to taxpayers. We need to revisit the process and make the appeal timeframe quicker and more efficient. Get it over with and get the guilty under the ground as soon as possible and lessen the taxpayer burden.

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Might be able to streamline the appeals process. Other than that due process requires a full investigation and trial. Defense counsel have one job, delay, delay, delay. That goes for pretrial proceedings and post conviction as allowed under appellate process.

The appellate process could be expedited by legislative action solely for DP cases.

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I don't necessarily have an issue with the original trial. It is more the appeal process and how long they sit waiting on the taxpayer dime before we finally put them to death. Right now the average in Texas is 11 years. What does that cost the taxpayers?

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Ask Robert Springsteen.

My beliefs...
The "appeal" should be nothing more than a panel that looks at
The case in general
All of the evidence
Evidence used in the trail, not used, and any evidence that was thrown out or otherwise withheld along with the reasoning for it.
Qualifications and adequacy of the defense council.

That shouldn't take long. It's not too redeterine guilt, but just verify what all aspects of the trial and findings were to legal standard.

After that, let this chapter in the victims live be forever closed

HTownAg98 said:

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cevans_40 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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cevans_40 said:

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My problem with the death penalty is the cost to taxpayers. We need to revisit the process and make the appeal timeframe quicker and more efficient. Get it over with and get the guilty under the ground as soon as possible and lessen the taxpayer burden.

---

Might be able to streamline the appeals process. Other than that due process requires a full investigation and trial. Defense counsel have one job, delay, delay, delay. That goes for pretrial proceedings and post conviction as allowed under appellate process.

The appellate process could be expedited by legislative action solely for DP cases.

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I don't necessarily have an issue with the original trial. It is more the appeal process and how long they sit waiting on the taxpayer dime before we finally put them to death. Right now the average in Texas is 11 years. What does that cost the taxpayers?

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Ask Robert Springsteen.

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Thats a problem with the original trail and nothing that was saved by our current timeline.

The three prisoners executed this year had been on Death Row for 26, 12, and 15 years.
The three scheduled for execution this year have been there for 20, 25, and 22 years.

I was reading some stuff this morning about Death Row inmates filing appeal after appeal for "ineffective assistance of counsel" as a delay tactic, but using the longest serving inmate, Harvey Earvin, as an example, his last appeal was denied in 1989, and he's still alive, 36 years later.

Kenneth_2003 said:

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My beliefs...
The "appeal" should be nothing more than a panel that looks at
The case in general
All of the evidence
Evidence used in the trail, not used, and any evidence that was thrown out or otherwise withheld along with the reasoning for it.
Qualifications and adequacy of the defense council.

That shouldn't take long. It's not too redeterine guilt, but just verify what all aspects of the trial and findings were to legal standard.

After that, let this chapter in the victims live be forever closed

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Appellate courts can only review what is presented on appeal. So those evidentiary rulings have to be raised for the appellate court to consider them. However, appellate courts are not there to substitute their findings of fact for those of the jury. What they can do is remand for a retrial IF legal errors were made.

As to ineffective assistance of counsel claims, for the last decade or more, defense counsel (even from Public Defender offices) have to be certified as a DP practitioner. it is a specialty practice. Those defense attorneys so certified also have teams of investigators, forensics, psychologists, etc that are also specialists in their respective fields.

So let me put it this way. If the defense team has the education and experience to qualify as an expert witness, they are not ineffective at their job.

I'm generally opposed to the death penalty mainly because you can't undo it if the state got it wrong. But this isn't that. This is as black and white as it gets. He pled guilty. The facts aren't in dispute. And the facts require the state's harshest response. If you don't use the death penalty for this case, then just abolish it.

I had a 7 year old daughter at the time of this crime about 30 miles from the crime scene, and at the time and even today I can barely even allow my mind to think of this case, as it just ruins my day. It's pure evil, and the agony and torture he put on this little girl and the little girl's family forever is too awful to comprehend. I'm not even a particularly good Christian, but I pray for this family daily for comfort and peace.

This isn't about deterrence. It's about justice. You simply can't do this and be allowed to continue living.

Don't wait. Do it today. Preferably with bleach.

I waffle on whether I am in favor of the death penalty. Only because of the number of innocent people wrongfully executed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrongful_execution
-At least 200 people have been exonerated from death row in the U.S. since 1973, with official misconduct and perjury/false accusation being the leading causes of wrongful convictions.

Scalp him, hammer scalp into his mouth with a wooden spike, flip him over and bisect him from groin to head with a dull knife. Bone Tomahawk style death is what this guy needs.

ErnestEndeavor said:

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The Texas delivery driver who kidnapped and murdered a 7-year-old girl was sentenced to death by the jury today.

The state refused to offer life without parole as part of a plea deal, so he pled open and the jury determined his fate.



This is one of the few circumstances that make me question my general opposition to the death penalty. The jury had to endure some horrific evidence including an audio recording of her murder. After about 3 weeks of evidence the jury returned a verdict in a matter of just a few hours.

Personally, I think the death penalty is a bit overused in Texas and I don't necessarily think it's a great deterrent, but I'm not going to lose sleep over this guy. If anyone deserves it it's him.

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Don't really care what the jury had to endure, much more concerned about what a helpless and innocent 7 year old girl had to endure. This POS should be executed soon, and I wish it could be done very slowly and painfully.

The death penalty is not used often enough in Texas and I wish more crimes were eligible to carry a death sentence.

richardag said:

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I waffle on whether I am in favor of the death penalty. Only because of the number of innocent people wrongfully executed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrongful_execution
-At least 200 people have been exonerated from death row in the U.S. since 1973, with official misconduct and perjury/false accusation being the leading causes of wrongful convictions.

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There has to be a line drawn between the use of the death penalty before DNA analysis became accepted as science allowed to be used in a courtroom. And that was not until the 1990s.

Hell, even DNA legal guru Barry Scheck of OJ fame was arguing back then that DNA results were ONLY RELIABLE IF THEY EXCLUDED SOMEONE.

Forensics has come a long way in the past 30 or so years. Trace DNA, fiber and hair analysis, cell phone tracing, car GPS tracking, surveillance video even ring doorbells. All of that evidence cannot easily be faked without detection. (Spare me the AI arguments here,)

So the chances of a wrongful conviction in a DP case these days is pretty damn small.

ErnestEndeavor said:

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There's a myriad of reasons.

I think life in prison is simply worse punishment for some people. In this case it might actually be preferable for him to be on death row where he would be given his own cell.

I don't think the death penalty has proven to be a deterrent.

I also think despite the numerous appeals and chances to find errors in the evidence or the process, mistakes can still be made. I do believe Texas has executed people who might have been factually innocent.

LWOP protects society just as well as death row, IMO.

But again, not going to lose any sleep over this guy.

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If life in prison were worse than the death penalty, I wonder why most of those serving life in prison don't beg to be executed. I mean, since it is worse (in your opinion).

The death penalty is a punishment, not a deterrent, though 100% of those executed never committed another crime. (Nor had to be housed, fed, and given medical care.)

Under the current system you can't both want someone on Death Row and want them to suffer prison justice. As has been mentioned before, DR inmates are heavily guarded and in their own cells.

Although to be honest even if he was in gen pop prison justice like you hope for is still a rarity because:

-Prisons tend to house similarly heinous people together to avoid this type of scenario
-Now that prisoners can have tablets with messaging and entertainment, they don't want to risk losing tablet privileges, especially over a stranger

You cannot be pro-life and pro-death penalty.

Every person deserves the opportunity to atone for their sins, regardless of how heinous their crimes are.

Was he deserving of death? Yes, and I don't think anyone here is arguing against that. But I don't believe the state should have the power to execute anyone.

WaltonAg18 said:

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You cannot be pro-life and pro-death penalty.

Every person deserves the opportunity to atone for their sins, regardless of how heinous their crimes are.

Was he deserving of death? Yes, and I don't think anyone here is arguing against that. But I don't believe the state should have the power to execute anyone.

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Lolz. Not this **** again

I cases like this I question God more than the death penalty.

WaltonAg18 said:

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You cannot be pro-life and pro-death penalty.

Every person deserves the opportunity to atone for their sins, regardless of how heinous their crimes are.

Was he deserving of death? Yes, and I don't think anyone here is arguing against that. But I don't believe the state should have the power to execute anyone.

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This has to be the dumbest argument I've heard.

Was Athena offered life?

Dude made a choice and the state said your choice was so egregious he needed to be put to death.

Kenneth_2003 said:

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annie88 said:

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SunrayAg said:

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Hopefully he gets prison yard stomped to death, as slowly and painfully as possible, long before the needle.

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Yeah, I'm hoping for this as well. I hope every day he's in prison is an absolute hell for him, but he's probably going to be alone in his cell for at least 23 hours a day. Don't think he'll have much contact with the GEN pop.

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Outside of being escorted around by the guards I doubt he'll ever have physical contact with another person.

I still say his "appeal" should be wrapped up in a week and from there he should be taken off shore and drowned, towed to the ocean bottom by a boat anchor.

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We should let him and that freak Kronenberger be put in the same small Cell and see who comes out alive.

WaltonAg18 said:

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You cannot be pro-life and pro-death penalty.

Every person deserves the opportunity to atone for their sins, regardless of how heinous their crimes are.

Was he deserving of death? Yes, and I don't think anyone here is arguing against that. But I don't believe the state should have the power to execute anyone.

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Yeah, they should. You're wrong, but entitled to your opinion.

And they did plenty of that in the Bible.

You might feel differently if it was your family member. I would never forgive someone if they had done that to my daughter. Ever. And if they'd give me the gun to blow his head off myself, I would do it. Hell, I would offer to be the one that hits the plunger when they shoot the drugs in him or shoot him in the heart or whatever the hell he's gonna pick.

ErnestEndeavor said:

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Personally, I think the death penalty is a bit overused in Texas and I don't necessarily think it's a great deterrent, but I'm not going to lose sleep over this guy. If anyone deserves it it's him.

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Used too much? In the last 5 or 6 years, hasnt it been less than 5 per year?? What is too much to you?

What a tragic way to live your life. To be filled with such vitriol and hatred.

If you are a Christian, then you believe Jesus died for all of our sins - including this man's.

If you aren't, since you're allegedly conservative, you should believe in the limited power of the state.

These guys have plenty of time to repent before we kill them. Doesn't mean they still don't have to pay the price. you bleeding hearts should be happy for them as the truly repentant get to leave prison and go to Heaven in spite of what they did. Maybe you'll get to tiptoe thru the heavenly tulips with Tanner Horner one day

WaltonAg18 said:

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What a tragic way to live your life. To be filled with such vitriol and hatred.

If you are a Christian, then you believe Jesus died for all of our sins - including this man's.

If you aren't, since you're allegedly conservative, you should believe in the limited power of the state.

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LOL. Not how the DP works but thanks for your attempt a la Vengeance is mine says the Lord weak argument. Maybe you get a consolation prize.

Death penalty is not against our Constitution. Furman v. Georgia created that for a de facto reason. Which was kind of odd at the time as they created a new aspect to the 8th.

aggiehawg said:

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WaltonAg18 said:

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What a tragic way to live your life. To be filled with such vitriol and hatred.

If you are a Christian, then you believe Jesus died for all of our sins - including this man's.

If you aren't, since you're allegedly conservative, you should believe in the limited power of the state.

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LOL. Not how the DP works but thanks for your attempt a la Vengeance is mine says the Lord weak argument. Maybe you get a consolation prize.

Death penalty is not against our Constitution. Furman v. Georgia created that for a de facto reason. Which was kind of odd at the time as they created a new aspect to the 8th.

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Just ignore the person and move on. No matter what arguments you bring, they will believe whatever talking points that are handed to them

I am on the fence on the DP. Jesus redeemed Peter despite the betrayal. But Judas didn't repent while alive. Yes anyone can be saved by Jesus, but that doesn't mean society forgives.

Aww...
Bless your heart. A skilled theologian you are not.

Quote:

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Just ignore the person and move on. No matter what arguments you bring, they will believe whatever talking points that are handed to them

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Okay. I had my struggles with the DP in my teens but then I was an employee at a law firm. This was after I graduated from A&M and before I went to law school. I read those trial transcripts. I read those medical and autopsy reports.

Today, too much is sanitized for public consumption. The media won't show that. BUT they will show Chauvin with a knee on George Floyd back on a loop forever