It's also interesting that all of the guys we have retained from Lovie's staff have positional cover from a new coach as well...

Slowik was a college WR
Burke is a DL (and LB) coach
Undlin is a DB coach

IrishAg said:

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So per that report we're looking at:

OC - Bobby Slowik
QB - Jerrod Johnson
RB -
WR - Ben McDaniels (from Lovie's Staff)
TE - Jake Moreland
OL - Chris Strausser
DC - Matt Burke
DL - Jacques Cesaire (from Lovie's Staff)
LB - Chris Kiffin
CB - Dino Vasso (from Lovie's Staff)
DPGC - Cory Undlin
S - Stephen Adegoke
ST - Frank Ross (from Lovie's Staff)
COS - Nick Kray

Maybe I missed it but haven't seen anything on RB coach

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eff it, I'll coach the RBs.

chjoak said:

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It's also interesting that all of the guys we have retained from Lovie's staff have positional cover from a new coach as well...

Slowik was a college WR
Burke is a DL (and LB) coach
Undlin is a DB coach

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Might be a, see if they can cut it, if not someone we really want will be available next year. Since we can't go interview and steal guys on contract for the same position (at least I'm pretty sure we can't).

I think the Texans need to start talking to Detroit about trading pick 2 for picks 6 and 18 which would give us 6-12-18 but possibly no QB. Let the Bears know that both top defensive players will go 2-3 so a trade down to 4 with Indy could be a disaster for them. They really want one of the two top defenders.

Max good points on the QBs. Young might be more like Tua and less like Kyler. But he will be small and Bama QBs other than Stabler and Namath have not been great in the NFL. Same with The Ohio QBs.Stroud is more of a passer than Fields I agree. But at 2 I would rather see Will Anderson. If we don't pick a QB at the top of round 1, we do still have draft capital next year.

On Levi's, college results don't always trsnslate. Mahomes and Josh Allen didn't win much in college. I saw a clip when Mahomes was picked and they were surprised he went before Watson. If Levis or Stroud can be our Josh Allen, draft them at 2. I trust the coaches.

Why would Detroit need to trade up?

Ags #1 said:

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Why would Detroit need to trade up?

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I agree with Ags #1, I don't think there's a need for Detroit to trade up. But I also don't think we need to push a trade angle to accomplish scaring Chicago. We need to establish we have 2 targets, our top QB and Will Anderson. From what I've heard Chicago currently believes that if they trade down to 4 they'll still be able to get one of the top 2 players (there is a big drop off after Carter and Anderson). So, if we push the narrative that we're not completely sold on a QB outside of our top choice, then I think it is completely realistic that people would believe DeMeco would grab Anderson if someone trades up and takes the QB we want (I actually do believe there is a chance that DeMeco would push that too). And since it's realistic, then Chicago will have to realize that there is a chance if they trade down they might miss on both of the elite defensive players in the draft, which would be a major loss for them.

IrishAg said:

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Ags #1 said:

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Why would Detroit need to trade up?

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I agree with Ags #1, I don't think there's a need for Detroit to trade up. But I also don't think we need to push a trade angle to accomplish scaring Chicago. We need to establish we have 2 targets, our top QB and Will Anderson. From what I've heard Chicago currently believes that if they trade down to 4 they'll still be able to get one of the top 2 players (there is a big drop off after Carter and Anderson). So, if we push the narrative that we're not completely sold on a QB outside of our top choice, then I think it is completely realistic that people would believe DeMeco would grab Anderson if someone trades up and takes the QB we want (I actually do believe there is a chance that DeMeco would push that too). And since it's realistic, then Chicago will have to realize that there is a chance if they trade down they might miss on both of the elite defensive players in the draft, which would be a major loss for them.

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With you 100% on this, another reason we shouldn't engage in any trade talks with Chicago. Don't give them a reason to think we're dead set on a particular player. If Indy goes up, it's only to get a QB. Arizona is going to take Carter or Anderson at number 3 if no one tries to trade with them. Chicago needs to have a legit fear that they will miss on those two guys if they trade back, and they should. If Indy trades up and takes Young, then we take Anderson at 2, Arizona takes Carter at 3...who does Chicago take at 4? Myles Murphy? Tyree Wilson? Devon Witherspoon? All of those guys are a step below Carter and Anderson.

Max Power said:

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IrishAg said:

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Ags #1 said:

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Why would Detroit need to trade up?

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I agree with Ags #1, I don't think there's a need for Detroit to trade up. But I also don't think we need to push a trade angle to accomplish scaring Chicago. We need to establish we have 2 targets, our top QB and Will Anderson. From what I've heard Chicago currently believes that if they trade down to 4 they'll still be able to get one of the top 2 players (there is a big drop off after Carter and Anderson). So, if we push the narrative that we're not completely sold on a QB outside of our top choice, then I think it is completely realistic that people would believe DeMeco would grab Anderson if someone trades up and takes the QB we want (I actually do believe there is a chance that DeMeco would push that too). And since it's realistic, then Chicago will have to realize that there is a chance if they trade down they might miss on both of the elite defensive players in the draft, which would be a major loss for them.

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With you 100% on this, another reason we shouldn't engage in any trade talks with Chicago. Don't give them a reason to think we're dead set on a particular player. If Indy goes up, it's only to get a QB. Arizona is going to take Carter or Anderson at number 3 if no one tries to trade with them. Chicago needs to have a legit fear that they will miss on those two guys if they trade back, and they should. If Indy trades up and takes Young, then we take Anderson at 2, Arizona takes Carter at 3...who does Chicago take at 4? Myles Murphy? Tyree Wilson? Devon Witherspoon? All of those guys are a step below Carter and Anderson.

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Exactly! And I'm surprised it hasn't been talked about more by the draft pundits. Once you get past Anderson and Carter, you really get into a huge grouping of 10-15 defensive players that are all around the same level that's I've seen go as high as the 4/5th pick and as low as in the 20s, and no offensive players outside of the QBs and Bijan (who is a RB which is the opposite of QBs on draft position scale) that are top 10 players. In reality, losing on Carter and Anderson would be a massive fail by the Bear's front office, even if they get an extra 1st next year.

I know I am in the massive minority here, but I feel that if you are not 100% sold on the idea that the QB you are taking with 1st or 2nd or top 5 pick is not a sure fire hit or better option than your present QB, you don't draft him.

If I have chance to take a sure fire impact starter on the defensive side of the ball, vs rolling the dice on a QB that may or may not pan out, then I go with D pick every single time.(I would have taken Garrett over any of these QB's in this draft) I do not think it is wise to gamble with such a draft pick if you know believe there is a top flight starter for multiple years in another position like OT, or DL pass rusher.

And from my vantage point I don't see any QBs worth a top pick or even top 3 in this draft. Not only that I can not guarantee that they will be better than what we already have!

I think we are judging Mills too harshly based upon the last two seasons. I don't believe any rookie or 2nd year QB would of faired much better.

This was a horrid offense, very predictable, weak OL. meh receiving corp. = it's just so easy to roll all the blame down to Mills. That is just layman fan reaction.

I am not ready to just toss him aside yet and I have a feeling the DeMeco and the Texans may not be ready to either.

If it was clear that Mills sucks (AND IT IS NOT CLEAR) and it was clear that there was a sure QB pick at one or 2 (and there is not) then you go with a QB pick, I myself would go Allen or Carter. and then maybe look to trade up to get one of the QBs..

I just think we have other more pressing needs rright now then QB.

Anyone else here think it was be funny to draft Anderson or Carter purely to prove the draft pundits wrong and the ensuing chaos? I enjoy listening to Kiper and McShay, but I also enjoy when they have to eat crow. They get as much bad intel as they do good intel, the teams use them to their advantage both in terms of getting opinions on guys, but also as a means of disseminating false information in terms of who they like. Even if the team isn't sold on Mills they can't deny the value of guys like Anderson and Carter. Picking one of those two also turns the entire draft on its ear. It changes the entire landscape of the draft. Indy would be tickled to have their pick for a second but as soon as Arizona realizes they get neither of the top 2 defensive prospects then they are going to start fielding calls from teams like LV and Carolina trying to get in front of Indy. Also, what if Houston passed on a QB at 2 but moved up from 12 to take Richardson or Levis? Houston has the most picks in the 2023 draft, 11, they have some flexibility to play around if they want to.

Max Power said:

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Anyone else here think it was be funny to draft Anderson or Carter purely to prove the draft pundits wrong and the ensuing chaos? I enjoy listening to Kiper and McShay, but I also enjoy when they have to eat crow. They get as much bad intel as they do good intel, the teams use them to their advantage both in terms of getting opinions on guys, but also as a means of disseminating false information in terms of who they like. Even if the team isn't sold on Mills they can't deny the value of guys like Anderson and Carter. Picking one of those two also turns the entire draft on its ear. It changes the entire landscape of the draft. Indy would be tickled to have their pick for a second but as soon as Arizona realizes they get neither of the top 2 defensive prospects then they are going to start fielding calls from teams like LV and Carolina trying to get in front of Indy. Also, what if Houston passed on a QB at 2 but moved up from 12 to take Richardson or Levis? Houston has the most picks in the 2023 draft, 11, they have some flexibility to play around if they want to.

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I would be perfectly ok with them taking Anderson or Carter if they fell like it's the best pick. I've mostly been against a QB at #2 in this draft because I don't think there's a QB that is a great fit, so I just want us to draft a player who will be able to be a game changer for the next 10 to 15 years. If they feel like a QB will fit that, then I'll be good, but I don't want them to do the classic we don't have a franchise QB so we HAVE to draft one even if we feel there are better players for the team. So if we stay at #2 and take Young or Stroud, I'll be good (and give the staff the benefit of the doubt), if we stay at #2 and take Anderson or Carter, I'll be very happy, if we trade down I'll be happy, but....I won't be happy, and will start to question this staff, if we trade up to #1 to take a QB.

OPAG said:

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I know I am in the massive minority here, but I feel that if you are not 100% sold on the idea that the QB you are taking with 1st or 2nd or top 5 pick is not a sure fire hit or better option than your present QB, you don't draft him.

If I have chance to take a sure fire impact starter on the defensive side of the ball, vs rolling the dice on a QB that may or may not pan out, then I go with D pick every single time.(I would have taken Garrett over any of these QB's in this draft) I do not think it is wise to gamble with such a draft pick if you know believe there is a top flight starter for multiple years in another position like OT, or DL pass rusher.

And from my vantage point I don't see any QBs worth a top pick or even top 3 in this draft. Not only that I can not guarantee that they will be better than what we already have!

I think we are judging Mills too harshly based upon the last two seasons. I don't believe any rookie or 2nd year QB would of faired much better.

This was a horrid offense, very predictable, weak OL. meh receiving corp. = it's just so easy to roll all the blame down to Mills. That is just layman fan reaction.

I am not ready to just toss him aside yet and I have a feeling the DeMeco and the Texans may not be ready to either.

If it was clear that Mills sucks (AND IT IS NOT CLEAR) and it was clear that there was a sure QB pick at one or 2 (and there is not) then you go with a QB pick, I myself would go Allen or Carter. and then maybe look to trade up to get one of the QBs..

I just think we have other more pressing needs rright now then QB.

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As I just put above, I'm right there with you and I hope they don't cave to media pressure to take a QB to "keep momentum" if they don't feel like there's a franchise QB at #2.

IrishAg said:

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Max Power said:

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Anyone else here think it was be funny to draft Anderson or Carter purely to prove the draft pundits wrong and the ensuing chaos? I enjoy listening to Kiper and McShay, but I also enjoy when they have to eat crow. They get as much bad intel as they do good intel, the teams use them to their advantage both in terms of getting opinions on guys, but also as a means of disseminating false information in terms of who they like. Even if the team isn't sold on Mills they can't deny the value of guys like Anderson and Carter. Picking one of those two also turns the entire draft on its ear. It changes the entire landscape of the draft. Indy would be tickled to have their pick for a second but as soon as Arizona realizes they get neither of the top 2 defensive prospects then they are going to start fielding calls from teams like LV and Carolina trying to get in front of Indy. Also, what if Houston passed on a QB at 2 but moved up from 12 to take Richardson or Levis? Houston has the most picks in the 2023 draft, 11, they have some flexibility to play around if they want to.

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I would be perfectly ok with them taking Anderson or Carter if they fell like it's the best pick. I've mostly been against a QB at #2 in this draft because I don't think there's a QB that is a great fit, so I just want us to draft a player who will be able to be a game changer for the next 10 to 15 years. If they feel like a QB will fit that, then I'll be good, but I don't want them to do the classic we don't have a franchise QB so we HAVE to draft one even if we feel there are better players for the team. So if we stay at #2 and take Young or Stroud, I'll be good (and give the staff the benefit of the doubt), if we stay at #2 and take Anderson or Carter, I'll be very happy, if we trade down I'll be happy, but....I won't be happy, and will start to question this staff, if we trade up to #1 to take a QB.

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I'm not opposed to trading up to 1 IF:

A. They are convinced that there is ONE quarterback in this draft who is going to be elite and that they need to go get that guy, AND

B. The price isn't just egregious. The MOST I would be willing to give is one first rounder OR a second and a couple mid-rounders. It might be worth it to Chicago to add that and still be able to get the defender of their choice, or even trade down again.

I don't want to do that. Knowing that we're running the Shanahan offense, I'm content to take either Young or Stroud b/c I think are accurate and smart enough to be successful in that offense. However, if the scouting department believes one guy is clearly better than the other, and they don't want to risk seeing that guy go right in front of them (probably to the Colts), I understand.

I would also totally understand taking Anderson or Carter because you feel like they are THE best prospect in the draft and you don't want to miss on them b/c you're reaching for a quarterback you're not crazy about. Problem is they NEED a QB, and even though next year's QB market is forecasted to be strong, a whole lot can change in a year (remember Spencer Rattler?), and you have no idea where you'll be drafting.

I would be just fine with them keeping a poker face until the draft, then taking Anderson or Carter and blowing the whole damn thing up. Not taking a QB this year and saying "we went best player available."

Funny that we're discussing all these situations like we'll actually know why they chose who they chose.

They will probably surprise everyone and acquire a veteran QB right before the draft and take best defender at 2 and TE Mike Kittle Meyer at 12. Jimmy G and Mills will be studying tape of Mahomes.

Devon achane and John Metchie will add speedy new weapons and they will sign a Mattison or singletary to further strengthen their rb room.

This team will be fun to watch if they do even half of this.

Not sure how angry face got on there.

Ag_07 said:

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Funny that we're discussing all these situations like we'll actually know why they chose who they chose.

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HA! Guessing is all the fun, and no one knows for sure outside of the org in good times and bad. Biggest thing is how much we like and/or trust an org correlates to how much we express our approval or disapproval on the decisions. Aka, with hindsight when they make a good decision we either say "look how smart they are" or "they were just lucky" and bad decisions "that was just unlucky" to "they are morons".

I like DeMeco as a coach, and I try to give the organization some level a trust in their decisions because of that, which is where I think most fans are. So I think most of us are just trying to define what we feel are the rare decisions in this draft that would make us skew towards the "they are morons" thoughts

No I know and I'm with you.

It's just funny reading the takes of 'I'm OK with Anderson as long as it's not out of panic that they need a QB at #2' when we'll have no idea why they picked him.

Hell they could pick him and he becomes the next Pat Mahomes and we're thrilled but in reality they actually did pick him because regardless of their doubts they thought they had to have a QB at #2 while they had the high pick.

Just interesting

Ag_07 said:

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Funny that we're discussing all these situations like we'll actually know why they chose who they chose.

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NFL Combine starts next week, free agency doesn't open until March 15th, and the draft is on 4/28. This is all we have until then.

I'm still not remotely stressed about the draft mainly because I'm 100% on board with DeMeco. If we were looking at another year of Lovie I would be much more stressed out about it. Just the fact we got DeMeco back feels like we won the offseason to me. Draft and free agency speculation is just fun.

We haven't discussed free agency much, got a wish list?
DL: Javon Hargrave/Daron Payne
WR: Jakobi Myers, JuJu Smith Schuster
CB: James Bradberry/Jamel Dean/Jimmie Ward
DE: Marcus Davenport/Yannick Ngakoue
OL: Dalton Risner/Isaac Seumalo
QB: Jacoby Brissett

Prediction:
If they spend real money on anything it's going to be the defense, I think we get a solid DE/DL like Davenport or Hargrave, I could also see them adding a CB to go opposite Stingley.

Offensively Brissett makes a lot of sense to bring into the QB room. I also think they get a mid level WR. Need RB depth as well, a guy like David Montgomery or Devin Singletary who can contribute but also allows Pierce to be the feature back. Need to add some OL depth as well.

Lots of places they can spend money but my gut feeling is only defense will get top dollar in free agency based on who's out there.

Ag_07 said:

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No I know and I'm with you.

It's just funny reading the takes of 'I'm OK with Anderson as long as it's not out of panic that they need a QB at #2' when we'll have no idea why they picked him.

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That's not true. Caserio and DeMeco will have press conferences after this is over and they'll explain some of what their rationale was. It may not be the whole truth, but they will publicly try to justify why they made whatever moves they did or did not make. There will be a big post mortem by NFL reporters on why some teams made the decisions they did, and you can draw a lot of healthy inferences based on the reports that will surface after the draft is over, as well as just by the overall manner in which the teams attack both the draft and free agency.

If you have "no idea," then you're not really paying attention.

You actually think the GM and/or the coach is going to stand at a podium and say 'Well we picked Bryce because we don't anticipate having a top pick in the next draft and so we thought this was the best time to take a QB while we had the #2 pick'?

I can tell you exactly what they're gonna say...We think he's the best QB and player in this class. We like his decision making and leadership skills. What he lacks in size he makes up in physical ability and heart. He makes this team better and they're happy to add a player him to roster.

There's only one of who knows what goes on during these decisions and even that's been up for debate a few times.

Ag_07 said:

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You actually think the GM and/or the coach is going to stand at a podium and say 'Well we picked Bryce because we don't anticipate having a top pick in the next draft and so we thought this was the best time to take a QB while we had the #2 pick'?

I can tell you exactly what they're gonna say...We think he's the best QB and player in this class. We like his decision making and leadership skills. What he lacks in size he makes up in physical ability and heart. He makes this team better and they're happy to add a player him to roster.

There's only one of who knows what goes on during these decisions and even that's been up for debate a few times.

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Of course, they're going to spin. But, you combine what they say with what is being reported and the results of the draft and have a pretty good idea.

bilbobag said:

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Just something to chew on.

DHop and the Texans talking..

DeMeco the head coach..

Stranger things have happened.

Since his PEDs violation his no trade clause is null and void.

Still has his place here and was out about at the cook off..

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Can we just swap Nuk and Cooks?

I hope Hopkins can throw the ball to himself, cuz otherwise he's just another blocker.

Does Hop have anything left in the tank?

Seriously I never did keep up with him after he was shipped out of town.

I would love for him to come back. His ability to get open and high point are elite even if his speed is dropping.

I would be ok dumping Cooks to someone and getting DHop back, as long as we don't give more than what we're getting for Cooks

2023 is year 11 in the league for Hopkins.

I believe he has 2 years left on his contract.

Spotrac says this:

In 2023, Hopkins will earn a base salary of $19,450,000, while carrying a cap hit of $30,750,000 and a dead cap value of $22,600,000

IrishAg said:

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I would be ok dumping Cooks to someone and getting DHop back, as long as we don't give more than what we're getting for Cooks

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At this point given the crap he pulled last year I would assume that what they get back for Cooks won't be near what he's worth.

No assistant to the traveling secretary named yet?

I'm assuming Bill Lazor is some sort of cyborg.