If you've been reading the auto board then you know the consensus on add-ons that weren't agreed upon during initial sales negotiations Especially when the Keating dealership intentionally gouges elderly people.

"Everybody does it" sucks as an excuse. Absolutely sucks. I would imagine most people here expected a better defense. But I'm sure it's part of the company culture at this point.

Appreciate the clarification.

This is what sucks about car dealerships. There's a few good ones out there but it feels like the large majority are out to screw customers.

People are just looking out for other people because we feel so powerless.

I have a 2008 Duramax I'm probably going to have to replace in 2-4 years. I dread the experience because dealerships seem to want to complicate the process and squeeze every last dime they can.

I just want to get the truck I want at a fair price with a smooth process.

It's a dealership's right to make money but it's also the consumer's right to band together and help each other out so they don't get screwed.

There's a fair balance.

Keating Dealerships have some past sins that every dealership has to deal with. Based on what I've read, it was way more earned than given.

And Ben Keating is always welcome on here to address those sins directly.

Until then, it's going to be hard for a lot of people on this site to want to set foot in a Keating dealership.

Generic posts ain't gonna fix it.

FLATOUT said:

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Sorry for derailing this thread any more that it already was, and I would rather not get into a bunch of back and forth in Aggielands thread. I really just wanted to come in here because of the great job that Greg does at Aggieland and because my name came up.

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We welcome your comments.

My problem with your dealership is as follows:
Daughter totaled her car in the spring of her freshman year at TAMU 2022. I found a used Elantra on your website and drove 120 miles mid week to buy it after working out the details online. Sitting down with the finance guy, I found about three thousand dollars worth of dealer add ons that I didnt want and were not disclosed previously. Finance guy said tough. You had us over a barrel and you knew it. I bit the bullet, because she needed transportation. I don't care how popular you are on here. Your dealership sucks.


ETA. This is for Flatout. College Station Hyundai.

FLATOUT said:

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Chewy said:

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I'm curious if Aggieland Chevrolet pre-installs Apex Protect on every vehicle.

For the benefit of the customer, of course.

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If you are referring to our GPS theft recovery product, of course. That's how we track our own inventory if it gets stolen. Damn near every dealer in the US installs some sort of theft recovery device the minute a new or used vehicle gets put on their lot. How do you think we recover stolen vehicles when that inventory is our livelihood. When most of you think of Grand Theft Auto you think of a video game or a buddies car that got stolen out of the local apartment complex, when in fact the most sophisticated car theft rings target dealers. They'll come in a pick off cars, and they'll be in Mexico before you know it.

I have consistently read on this board that we somehow have this expansive data base of real time data logging through these devices on all sold units. Do you have any idea how illegal that is? The minute a vehicle leaves our store that device is transferred to the customer. In my career I have had two instances where I desperately needed the info on where a vehicle that we recently sold was due to fraud and I was denied access even as a Partner in the store that sold it. Both times I had to write off the complete value of the vehicle because I couldn't get to it quick enough because I couldn't get the GPS data because it had already been transferred to the new "owner". Conspiracy theories are more fun to read and talk about but it's ridiculous.

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How many vehicles were stolen from your bryan dealership in 2023 ?

How many so far this year ?

FLATOUT said:

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maroon barchetta said:

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If you've been reading the auto board then you know the consensus on add-ons that weren't agreed upon during initial sales negotiations Especially when the Keating dealership intentionally gouges elderly people.

"Everybody does it" sucks as an excuse. Absolutely sucks. I would imagine most people here expected a better defense. But I'm sure it's part of the company culture at this point.

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Why would anyone choose to buy something that wasn't agreed upon? You do have a choice to purchase or not purchase something.

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And there is the culture of Keating coming out.

Why would your minions add on things that weren't initially agreed upon and force people to negotiate them off?

Because your entire business model is predicated on trying to screw the consumer at every turn. Sales. Service. Financing. Trade-ins.

"Let's confuse the ones we can and let's wear down the ones we can't", like the guy above who caved and bought a vehicle for his daughter.

Do you y'all keep the Alec Baldwin "Always Be Closing" clip from Glengarry Glenross playing on a loop in the break room, or is it only for monthly staff meetings?

"GET THEM TO SIGN ON THE LINE WHICH IS DOTTED!"

How anyone can support Flatout after the way he runs his dealership is beyond me,.

Dogdoc said:

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How anyone can support Flatout after the way he runs his dealership is beyond me,.

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Wow, guess I haven't been visiting the auto board long enough to know all the history here. Only opened the thread when I saw 45 replies on a sponsor thread and figured something must be going on inside. Not that I'm in the market but good info for future reference.

easttexasaggie04 said:

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Is there a list of the dealerships yall own? Curious if you own the Ford place in Marshall.

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https://www.keatingauto.com/

highpriorityag said:

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Imagine you own 29 dealerships that move 100 to 150 units a month x $300 profit on each apex installed?

Love him or hate him Ben is freaking killing it

JP76 said:

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highpriorityag said:

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Imagine you own 29 dealerships that move 100 to 150 units a month x $300 profit on each apex installed?

Love him or hate him Ben is freaking killing it

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This....These add-ons are all about the easy money made by the dealership management off each unit sold, not about how they are saving the customer. To give any other reason is simply disingenuous.

Here's a list of the Keating Auto dealerships with a map at the bottom:

https://www.keatingauto.com/

Their Nissan dealership in College Station tooled me around when I was shopping for a Titan. Ended up getting one from Garlyn Shelton in Temple. Cut a decent deal online, they delivered the truck to my house and we closed the paperwork in my dining room. No tricks or last minute BS changes or add-ons.

I also had a rough experience with the Conroe Nissan dealer many years back when I was just out of college. Not sure if that was a Keating dealership back then or not (it is today).

FLATOUT said:

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dubi said:

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We never paid for the Apex system on any of our Hyundai's so i give you a pass on this. Folks just need to say no when presented with that product on the sales worksheet.

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Or maybe just understand the product and how it can actually be beneficial if your vehicle gets stolen. I wouldn't spend the time and money to put them on every one of the vehicles my store owns if it hadn't saved our ass time and time again.

The vehicles in dash stuff doesn't contact a 24 hour theft call center that then works with local law enforcement to get the vehicle recovered. You'll simply get to watch it disappear in your phone while you track it in an app. It's our job to present and explain what the product actually does so that you can make an informed buying decision and frankly we don't always do a great job of that.

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The customer shouldn't have to foot the bill to save your ass.

FLATOUT said:

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maroon barchetta said:

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If you've been reading the auto board then you know the consensus on add-ons that weren't agreed upon during initial sales negotiations Especially when the Keating dealership intentionally gouges elderly people.

"Everybody does it" sucks as an excuse. Absolutely sucks. I would imagine most people here expected a better defense. But I'm sure it's part of the company culture at this point.

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Why would anyone choose to buy something that wasn't agreed upon? You do have a choice to purchase or not purchase something.

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This response does you no favors. We all know the common practice is that after a customer has likely spent hours at the dealership by now, they've agreed to a deal, and at this point, they are mentally invested in the vehicle they chose and the deal they made. Then, as they near the finish line on paperwork, they get presented with additional items that "can't" just be waived because "they've already been added to the car" or "they came with the car".

Walking at this point is very difficult for a customer, and you know this because that's why it is often done this way. Seems to be very common practice to get the customer as far as possible in the process before springing these profit-driving nuggets on them

It's shady and predatory. But sure, the customer has a choice. Their choice should be to never set foot in one of your dealerships to buy something. I agree with you on that

AS I HAVE REPEATEDLY SAID NEVER NEVER NEVER DO BUSINESS WITH A KEATING DEALERSHIP.

Pay money to texags for sponsorship only to get destroyed on said sponsorship post. Brutal.

Holy sh/t this might be the most tone deaf comment I've ever read on the internet. Congratulations

Jock 07 said:

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Pay money to texags for sponsorship only to get destroyed on said sponsorship post. Brutal.

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Wagers on when the sponsor calls TexAgs to pull this thread?

You know it's coming.

DannyDuberstein said:

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FLATOUT said:

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maroon barchetta said:

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If you've been reading the auto board then you know the consensus on add-ons that weren't agreed upon during initial sales negotiations Especially when the Keating dealership intentionally gouges elderly people.

"Everybody does it" sucks as an excuse. Absolutely sucks. I would imagine most people here expected a better defense. But I'm sure it's part of the company culture at this point.

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Why would anyone choose to buy something that wasn't agreed upon? You do have a choice to purchase or not purchase something.

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This response does you no favors. We all know the common practice is that after a customer has likely spent hours at the dealership by now, they've agreed to a deal, and at this point, they are mentally invested in the vehicle they chose and the deal they made. Then, as they near the finish line on paperwork, they get presented with additional items that "can't" just be waived because "they've already been added to the car" or "they came with the car".

Walking at this point is very difficult for a customer, and you know this because that's why it is often done this way. Seems to be very common practice to get the customer as far as possible in the process before springing these profit-driving nuggets on them

It's shady and predatory. But sure, the customer has a choice. Their choice should be to never set foot in one of your dealerships to buy something. I agree with you on that

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My wife and I have been in that "last minute position". However, we let the finance guy... salesman... whomever. know that we're not spending more than an hour - one hour - and if we don't close a deal in that hour... we're walking. Further, if at the time of signing there are additional charges added, and the bottom line isn't what we agreed upon... we're walking.

We've walked on several occasions. I have no problem telling dealership employees to "**** right off" as I'm walking out the door. Why people sit there for several hours ****ing around with the finance guy... I can't understand. The Internet makes it a one-hour-effort.

Keating? I've been reading about them on this forum since 2017. I wouldn't step foot on their lot. It's 2024 Keatng. Enough with the PR efforts.

Even that sounds like too much.

We have several good reps on TexAgs for various brands. I use one of them, work out the deal ahead of time, and they don't do the games.

Im relatively new to the Keating Dealership drama. I've seen a couple threads in the past

Is FLATOUT Ben Keating?

Picard said:

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Darby said:

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Im relatively new to the Keating Dealership drama. I've seen a couple threads in the past

Is FLATOUT Ben Keating?

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No

Darby said:

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Im relatively new to the Keating Dealership drama. I've seen a couple threads in the past

Is FLATOUT Ben Keating?

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Nope, just one of his apologists

Dogdoc said:

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easttexasaggie04 said:

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Is there a list of the dealerships yall own? Curious if you own the Ford place in Marshall.

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https://www.keatingauto.com/

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Tomball Ford. That certainly explains a lot.

Pre-loads like Apex are exactly the kind of thing that invite heavy handed regulation like the CARS Rule onto dealerships.

If you, FLATOUT, need a product to help locate and deter theft of your cars, awesome. By all means buy it.

If I, the consumer need the same thing, I will buy it on my own. I do not need the dealership to dictate which device and service I use by pre-installing a hard wired system. I certainly don't want to buy your device for you. That's ridiculous.

Next, you don't disclose it on your website listings of the cars. It's an unpleasant surprise 100% of the time when the consumer visits the dealership to see the car.

Lastly, we all know that this is packed-in profit that starts the baseline of the negotiation. During covid when inventories were low, dealers happily ****ed over buyers on price because you had the upper hand. Fine. It's a free market system, all that. Now that you have to sell cars at a loss, these Pre-loads pad the price in your favor and force the customer to focus on haggling at the margins.

I hope the CARS Rule comes down like a ton of bricks on Keating stores. Not because I'm a fan of government regulation. I'm not. But because you guys made your own bed and will have to lie in it. Maybe it will help level the playing field by forcing you to at least be honest about your pricing online.

I'm probably too optimistic, though.