I wish we still had Gregg, or Bruce…

What about Bradley?

Can I get a Bob Bradley already!!?!

aggiebird02 said:

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I wish we still had Gregg, or Bruce…

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Right. Let's rehire the dude that took over only to watch us not make the WC.

No. Just no.

aggiebird02 said:

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What about Bradley?

Can I get a Bob Bradley already!!?!

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Let's get Bora!

Woof.

2 turds in 2 games.

Adams was weak tonight. He did not help against the pressure like he normally does.

We couldn't break the high pressure. They knew it and pressed. That will be a lot different with Jedi and Dest, but it was pathetic tonight.

Scally is not a bad player. Not great, but he is not the weak link.

Luna was the lone bright spot. I like his game.

Agumang, or whatever, is not the answer. He is big, and that is something, but no touch and no anticipation.

What was wrong with CP10? Not even sure he was on the pitch.

Just another **** game. Boo.

I saw that man, Landon Donovan, score a hat trick in Tampa Bay for the USA against Ecuador.

I trust in Landon, and Meola & Dempsey, and Lalas! Da Bruce, and what the Nats meant back in the day! Gimme one Gooch or Beasley, just one Frankie Hejduk or Cobi Jones!

Where are the fighters!?! They wear our jersey, but they don't play like they care about the jersey…

Are we even getting out of our group as the World Cup host!?! With this coach!?

I'm not hating on the man, I'm being serious…

Maybe we'll get lucky with the group draw.

A year is a long time in international soccer so don't think it's worth getting into hysterics but I will say this...

Between the players, former players, coaches, federation, media, and fans, following the USMNT has become a thoroughly unenjoyable experience. Not one redeeming aspect in that group as far as I'm concerned.

We're like the New World version of the England men's team vibe. So congratulations are in order I guess. We've done what many wanted us to do. We're England except only all the worst parts and without the top tier club league to distract us.

The last couple years of USMNT is like Aggie football in November on repeat.

Poch is undoubtedly a good coach (you don't do what he did at Espanyol and Southampton if you aren't) - but he certainly might not be a good international coach.

But that is a moot point right now. I think the biggest problem is what has always been the biggest problem: soccer is stuck behind the Big 3 and hockey in men's sports.

In the past, that meant we didn't have talented players. We've significantly improved on that front. And I'd like to think that that signals that sentiment towards the sport is shifting… parents are putting their kids in the sport and both parents and kids are sticking with it and progressing. There are other factors at play (demographics, for one), but I do think overall attitude to the sport is changing and there are a lot more curious casuals as opposed to people just writing it off completely. Or perhaps I'm just biased because I myself am an adult "convert" to the sport.

We're now in an awkward phase I think… we've got some talented players playing at the highest level of the game, but then they come back here and play in empty stadiums. Or worse, they play in cow pastures on tropical islands.

Why did Ggg always beat Mexico? Here's my simple answer: the stadium was full so it felt like a real game to our elite players. And I'm not blaming the players for their reaction. It's human nature. They go from playing in top facilities filled with rabid fans to … well, this. It doesn't matter if it's even our fans… just having a full stadium makes the game seem important.

Until we fill stadiums, we'll continue to see this. I think USSF's strategy is backwards in scheduling venues. They need to stop giving these WC venues practice games and use MLS stadiums until we consistently fill them. If they have any influence over CONCACAF scheduling they need to make them do that too. We also need to find windows to go abroad to play in front of a packed house (it's hard with these infernal Nations Leagues happening). And I'll probably get blasted for this - but I think we need to stop picking the "safe" middle-America venues and pick the big coastal cities where immigrants will show and fill the place. I firmly believe our guys play better in a packed house, even if most of the place is against them.

And while I appreciate Landon's take on the attitude issue, I think the flip side is also true… when these guys come and play in NFL stadiums that are mostly empty, while all of sports media is tuned in to college basketball it's a double slap in the face. So yeah - go out there and represent our country - whose people would clearly much rather be paying attention to other things than you.

Sorry for the Ted talk, but I'm just trying to make sense of it all and this is the best I've come up with. This team looks pretty dang good when the occasion is good (Mexico, Uruguay in Copa, WC) and looks like ass when the occasion is ass. I'm not sure how that can be fixed, but to me that's the real problem.

Umm they played in a coastal elite city and no one showed up.

USSF screwed up by rehiring Ggg and wasting 2 years of this cycle. We need to pick an identity and stick with it.

TRM said:

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Umm they played in a coastal elite city and no one showed up.

USSF screwed up by rehiring Ggg and wasting 2 years of this cycle. We need to pick an identity and stick with it.

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It was 1 ticket, 2 games.

90% of LA soccer fans are el tri fans.

They showed up, but just for the team they bought the tickets to.

They need to stop the 1 ticket 2 games in predominately Mexican descent areas. But it's concacaf not US.

Dre_00 said:

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A year is a long time in international soccer so don't think it's worth getting into hysterics but I will say this...

Between the players, former players, coaches, federation, media, and fans, following the USMNT has become a thoroughly unenjoyable experience. Not one redeeming aspect in that group as far as I'm concerned.

We're like the New World version of the England men's team vibe. So congratulations are in order I guess. We've done what many wanted us to do. We're England except only all the worst parts and without the top tier club league to distract us.

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Yeah, it's all around a pretty dull product at the moment. Ticket prices are high, team isn't playing particularly well, venue choices are suspect, too many lower tier Cup competitions to keep up with, etc.

Pahdz said:

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Add in the fact that we keep getting the manager wrong.

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I've been on the Oscar Pareja train since before GGG. he'd get the best out of these players.

jessexy said:

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Pahdz said:

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Add in the fact that we keep getting the manager wrong.

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I've been on the Oscar Pareja train since before GGG. he'd get the best out of these players.

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I'm honestly not sure anyone gets the best out of these players. It's so much easiest to do a NT in Europe where the players are all close to their national teams and not playing different leagues on different calendars.

Rudyjax said:

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TRM said:

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Umm they played in a coastal elite city and no one showed up.

USSF screwed up by rehiring Ggg and wasting 2 years of this cycle. We need to pick an identity and stick with it.

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It was 1 ticket, 2 games.

90% of LA soccer fans are el tri fans.

They showed up, but just for the team they bought the tickets to.

They need to stop the 1 ticket 2 games in predominately Mexican descent areas. But it's concacaf not US.

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Matches in Houston are similar (but also a lot of fun).

fig96 said:

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Rudyjax said:

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TRM said:

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Umm they played in a coastal elite city and no one showed up.

USSF screwed up by rehiring Ggg and wasting 2 years of this cycle. We need to pick an identity and stick with it.

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It was 1 ticket, 2 games.

90% of LA soccer fans are el tri fans.

They showed up, but just for the team they bought the tickets to.

They need to stop the 1 ticket 2 games in predominately Mexican descent areas. But it's concacaf not US.

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Matches in Houston are similar (but also a lot of fun).

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It was like that last year in DFW too.

But the crowd wasn't nearly as small for US, but much larger for Mexico.

Yeah, almost everything USSF currently does with the NTs is contrary to the goal of "growing the game." They view the players as a money-making tool and big stadium games as the only suitable venues for showcasing them. It's maddening.

I'd like to think that the players aren't very influenced by media, but I'm probably wrong.

You're spot on about the differences between now and the days when these guys played though. You could also add:

1) In addition to playing more games, the overall intensity of each individual game has increased. Players are basically 10% faster than they were 15 years ago. (The fastest player in the 2010 World Cup was Chicharito at 32.15 kph; in the 2022 World Cup it was a dude from Ghana at 35.7 - it's also worth noting that both these speeds are less than what happens in real leagues where big money is on the line, but the trend follows at that level too).

2) The political climate has also changed a lot in the last 15 years. I taught 20 year olds a couple years ago (at a conservative Christian college I will add), and I can confidently say that this generation is a whole lot more jaded/wary of patriotism than I was at their age (especially after 9/11). So rightly or wrongly, "playing for the badge" doesn't mean as much to any player this age; it's not just a problem with these particular players. So to your point Dre, it's not helpful for Landon to call them out for something that their entire generation is doing. And also, I'll just add that we now have a lot of guys who play in Europe. I won't speculate on how much political talk they hear from teammates/fans/media, but whatever amount it is, I doubt it helps foster a sense of national pride.

This is not an excuse, but that field was incredible narrow allowing both teams to bunker.

We still should've won both games, but it made it harder.

Rudyjax said:

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This is not an excuse, but that field was incredible narrow allowing both teams to bunker.

We still should've won both games, but it made it harder.

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Yeah I've wanted to bring this up. It does favor the team that wants to play defense. But I agree it's not an excuse. Honestly, I feel we were also a bit unlucky in that first half of Panama. We could've/should've scored a couple times.

But what's alarming is how much worse we looked in the 2nd half. No intensity. No creativity.

But speaking of the field, it is shameful that once again, CONCACAF didn't pony up to make a proper pitch. They could easily have paid for the stadium to widen the field like they will for the WC, but they went cheap. Which is similar to what happened in Copa… they could've bought out Hard Rock for the entirety of the event, but instead they allowed them to rip up the field for a concert and then re-sod it for the finals (and it was a hot mess).

I don't think players are influenced by what Landon Donovan says specifically, but I do think they are influenced by the media landscape in general. You clearly see it in England between their players and their media. Their toxic media landscape is a clear burden those players shoulder. It's often well beyond constructive criticism.

Now clearly the scope and volume of US soccer media is far less than that of English media. But my guess is that it's nearly as toxic. I say guess because I don't really engage with US soccer media anymore but pretty comfortable that I'm right if people like Alexi Lalas still have prominent platforms and also because toxicity in general drives engagement and profits whether you're talking about soccer media or any other form of visual media. A lot less people are covering the USMNT than those covering England's team but other than that, the media landscapes themselves are quite similar.

Thanks for the clarification and yes I wholeheartedly agree with that.

Dre_00 said:

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I don't think players are influenced by what Landon Donovan says specifically, but I do think they are influenced by the media landscape in general. You clearly see it in England between their players and their media. Their toxic media landscape is a clear burden those players shoulder. It's often well beyond constructive criticism.

Now clearly the scope and volume of US soccer media is far less than that of English media. But my guess is that it's nearly as toxic. I say guess because I don't really engage with US soccer media anymore but pretty comfortable that I'm right if people like Alexi Lalas still have prominent platforms and also because toxicity in general drives engagement and profits whether you're talking about soccer media or any other form of visual media. A lot less people are covering the USMNT than those covering England's team but other than that, the media landscapes themselves are quite similar.

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Heck, you can go look at how Men in Blazers has devolved over the past decade. Used to be mostly positive overall but now a lot of their content is trolling fans for negative reactions.

I forget who wrote the article, but part of the problem is that our current "core" group definitely view themselves as locks for the team. So where is their impetus to show out in this window to make sure they are on th world cup roster, when to this point they KNOW they are.

Poch needs to consider shaking things up in the summer, but we also dont have many games left to successfully do that.

PatAg said:

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I forget who wrote the article, but part of the problem is that our current "core" group definitely view themselves as locks for the team. So where is their impetus to show out in this window to make sure they are on th world cup roster, when to this point they KNOW they are.

Poch needs to consider shaking things up in the summer, but we also dont have many games left to successfully do that.

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Who is better than Pulsic, Jedi, McKennie, Weah, Yunus, Adams?

I'd only consider your first 2 good enough to be all-the-time locks. There's never a time when I say to myself "we should've tried using someone else rather than Pulisic/Jedi."

But for the rest, there's been at least one time when I could say that about them. I love Adams and he's got the right level of talent and attitude, but I don't like him in certain situations, namely when our opponent is parking the bus. McKinnie is talented enough to be a lock, but I've seen him check out too often.

Weah and Musah should probably be starting more often than not, especially considering their versatility - but more than the others on this list, I think we've got options to replace (especially with guys like Luna and Tessman emerging).

Rudyjax said:

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PatAg said:

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I forget who wrote the article, but part of the problem is that our current "core" group definitely view themselves as locks for the team. So where is their impetus to show out in this window to make sure they are on th world cup roster, when to this point they KNOW they are.

Poch needs to consider shaking things up in the summer, but we also dont have many games left to successfully do that.

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Who is better than Pulsic, Jedi, McKennie, Weah, Yunus, Adams?

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Do you think these 3 have been playing well enough to be locks?
Not even saying they should be replaced, just that we need to be challenging them to prove it

I think it's ironic that 15 years ago, the general consensus was that USMNT players need to play in Europe because it was the only place that could give them big game experience. Klinsmann pushed that narrative quite a lot but I don't recall many people disagreeing with him. MLS games and WCQ were great and all but playing the San Jose Earthquakes and Trinidad and Tobago weren't going to prepare you for Ghana or Portugal or Germany in the World Cup. 2-3 games against Mexico wasn't enough to give you that experience.

Now it seems like we're seeing the other half of that equation. If you are playing 10 games a year against the top club teams in the world in high pressure league, European, or domestic cup games, then kind of natural to have the inverse problem where all that big game experience maybe doesn't serve you as well when you have to come back and play Panama in front of 10,000 people in a competition that was created like 3 years ago.

Either way you do it, you're going to have a problem because the USMNT calendar is never going to be filled with high pressure games against high quality opponents. CONCACAF is never going to be UEFA and its unlikely to ever combine with CONMEBOL.

So what is the ultimate goal here? To set us up as much as possible for success in the World Cup or to dominate CONCACAF? Strong argument to be made that the two are not independent of one another and I agree to an extent. However I think it's also clear that, in some ways, the two goals are counter to one another.

Rudyjax said:

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PatAg said:

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I forget who wrote the article, but part of the problem is that our current "core" group definitely view themselves as locks for the team. So where is their impetus to show out in this window to make sure they are on th world cup roster, when to this point they KNOW they are.

Poch needs to consider shaking things up in the summer, but we also dont have many games left to successfully do that.

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Who is better than Pulsic, Jedi, McKennie, Weah, Yunus, Adams?

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This is what triggered the post above. If there were clear options of other players getting PT and succeeding on teams that were playing against elite teams in elite competitions, then it would be much easier to try them as options.

But right now, a lot of the options would be MLS players or players not getting the same level of competition as the ones above. And yeah, a motivated, talented MLS player might very well be a better option against Panama than a less motivated, more talented European based player. Could probably even get to the knockout rounds of the World Cup with a team of mostly the former type of player. We've done it before after all.

But when you get to the World Cup, who do you want to rely on? Seems to me that the former has a lower ceiling and I think we've mostly aligned on the priority of setting ourselves up for the deepest World Cup run possible...but that probably comes with a lower floor especially in certain scenarios.

Years ago I suggested we needed to start guys (like Acosta) who were outside the top 11 when we play CONCACAF minnows.

And I don't think that's crazy. I know the top European nations frequently rotate guys when they're playing the Montenegros of UEFA.

But the flip side of that is that we have precious few games against anyone with a pulse, so we can't do that every time or our first team will lack cohesiveness.

So I think we need to have perhaps a "away" team and a "home" team. Send a hungry B team to play on an island mudhole, and then play the A team in US stadiums that'll be as full as possible.

To that end, USSF needs to stop trying to wring out every dollar possible by preying on loyal fans (high prices for half-full stadiums at best). They need to slash prices and pack the house. Grow the game.

And also - at the risk of beating a dead horse - they need to go where our opponents' fans live. For Panamanians, LA is actually really low on the list. NYC, Orlando (to draw from Tampa/Jax/Miami), TX triangle, shoot even Philly or DC would be better choices than LA. And yes I know it was CONCACAF's choice here, and in this case it was scheduled before we knew the opponent, but I'm just giving an example of how it's not always obvious where the immigrant population is… but it's never KC or Minnesota or Columbus and it seems like we always play there - to avoid away fans. I used to think avoiding away fans was a good idea, but I'm 180 against it now. We need to make these games a spectacle and feel like they're important. Our players are big boys who play in rough away situations… they'll embrace it.