Holliday will be over 20 HR's and 100 RBI by season's end. He's now on a team that has a pulse and something to play for.

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Not arguing the fact that it is certainly a pitchers park, but what pitchers have gone there to help their ERA?

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I do recall a guy named Barry Zito who suddenly sucked once he left oakland

Didn't Zito leave once the steroid era hit its peak? I wonder if that had anything to do will Zito's stellar numbers in Oakland

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Didn't Zito leave once the steroid era hit its peak? I wonder if that had anything to do will Zito's stellar numbers in Oakland

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He left Oakland after the 2006 season. A change in steroid habits had nothing to do with anything.

I'm not really sure why, but Zito's strikeouts fell off a lot his last year in Oakland and his first two years across the bay.

What is also beyond my comprehension is how from his last year in Oakland to his first year in San Francsico, his K/9 went down by only 0.1, BB/9 went down by 0.2, HR/9 stayed the same, WHIP went down 0.7, etc...

...yet his ERA went up by 0.70.

That's just strange if you ask me.



This year, his K/9, BB/9, WHIP, etc... are all almost identical to his 2004 numbers in Oakland...and well, look at his ERAs.

4.47 in Oakland
4.48 in San Francisco

his fastball went from 91 to 80 from his last year in oakland to his first year in sanfran

what the hell

His strikeouts didn't fall any considerable amount from his last year in Oakland to his years in San Francisco.

They did after 2005 and stayed the same up until this year, in which they've made a huge bounce back up.

It goes further than the velocity he's been gradually losing...

Also, is there any explanation on why a guy in his late 20's started losing so much velocity and command...Zito is only 31 right now!

[This message has been edited by TXAggie2011 (edited 8/3/2009 2:25p).]

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Also, is there any explanation on why a guy in his late 20's started losing so much velocity and command...Zito is only 31 right now!

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its mind boggling

August was a very good month for Holliday (.303, 7 HR, 24 RBI) as he showed his past form that earned him a $14 million salary for this season. With about 30 games to go, here are his numbers:

BA ---> .308
HR ---> 19
RBI --> 86
OBP --> .392
SLG --> .513
OPS --> .905

Due to the poor 1st half with Oakland, his season HR & RBI numbers still project 15-25% lower than his 06 & 07 seasons at Coors Field.

However he may have done enough in St. Louis to net a big free agent contract in the offseason (btw he is a Scott Boras client). Ironically if his September is as good as his August, the cardinals may be priced out of the market for 2010 and beyond.

I thought he couldn't do anything without Coors Field?

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at the all-star break, ol' W is looking golden on this one.

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What flavor is the crow?

I'm actually impressed that he even posted on this thread again. I assumed he would leave it buried and pray that everyone forgot about it.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/mlb/players/7311/index.html

Holliday is batting .367 with 8 homeruns, 32 rbi's in 34 games with the Cards. He has a .430 OBP, .672 Slugging and 1.101 OPS

DAMN TYPOS!



[This message has been edited by Justntexas07 (edited 9/1/2009 2:01p).]

I'm pretty sure you copied you're stats wrong. For one, the math doesn't add. Also, I'm betting his slugging is much better than .372, which would be quite pedestrian.

FIXED.

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he may have done enough in St. Louis to net a big free agent contract in the offseason

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Gee ya think?

This thread is a joke.

by the way, I just realized that the Cardinals only played 3 games in the entire month of August vs. teams with a winning record. (3 vs. the Dodgers)

and believe it or not the second best team record-wise that St. Louis played in August was the astros.

wow, Holliday better have had a great month vs. those terrible pitching staffs.

The final numbers are in for Holliday:

First the Oakland stats:
.286 BA, 11 HR, 54 RBI, .454 SLG, .832 OPS

Then the St. Louis numbers:
.353 BA, 13 HR, 55 RBI, .604 SLG, 1.023 OPS

And the combined season stats:

BA --> .313
HR --> 24
RBI --> 109
OBP --> .394
SLG --> .515
OPS --> .909
Salary --> $14 million

The Colorado benchmarks:

2006 --> .326 BA, 34 HR, 116 RBI, .586 SLG
2007 --> .340 BA, 36 HR, 137 RBI, .607 SLG
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Still a Coors Field rockstar. Not to the degree it appeared at the all-star break, but for the season, well short of the power numbers from 06 and 07. Holliday was great in the 2nd half of the season for the redbirds no doubt. It was indeed good to hit in the same lineup with Pujols even if it was behind him instead of in front of him.

And also worth mentioning that the Rockies made the playoffs this year. The trade for Huston Street paid major dividends.

After the postseason it will be interesting to see whether the GM's focus on the Coors Field numbers, the 3 months in Oakland, or the 3 months in St. Louis with Pujols. I suspect someone will offer him a contract in the range of 5 years and $75 million.

Definitely doesn't have the same power numbers, but he still hit over .300 on the road this season, AL and NL time combined. He had a slow start and really started lighting it up about A2 weeks before the trade to STL. He's a legitimate hitter in any ballpark, he has more than proven that. Just didn't quite have the power numbers outside of Coors. This season seemed more that he couldn't hit in Oakland's ballpark than anything else, until his slump in late June early July before he caught fire.

I wasn't sold on him and was happy the Rockies traded him, but since leaving he ahs proven to be a solid hitter. I expect him to hit .320 and 30+ HR next year, probably hit 40 doubles again as well.

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First the Oakland stats:
.286 BA, 11 HR, 54 RBI, .454 SLG, .832 OPS

Then the St. Louis numbers:
.353 BA, 13 HR, 55 RBI, .604 SLG, 1.023 OPS

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Maybe it can be ammended as Matt Holiday - another National League Rockstar?

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Maybe it can be ammended as Matt Holiday - another National League Rockstar?

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Back back back...gone!

NL Rockstar, you could say that if you ignored details and facts. Holliday batted over .500 in the month of July. He got hot, and was traded to the Cards on July 18th 2 weeks later. I don't think he was facing NL pitching for those first two weeks of his hot streak still in Oakland. Somebody who knows what they're talking about will realize that the man got hot, Oakland traded him while the stock was high to a playoff contending team, and he now has an easier time with Pujols in the lineup also. His AL team just didn't have a good enough hitter to help him, and Oakland plays in a pitcher's park. You can look at how much their trio of great pitchers struggled after leaving that pitcher's sanctuary.

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His AL team just didn't have a good enough hitter to help him, and Oakland plays in a pitcher's park. You can look at how much their trio of great pitchers struggled after leaving that pitcher's sanctuary.

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This.

The dude is a monster.

HAHAHA!

The guy is mediocre to serviceable in the AL and is an obvious all star in the NL but it has nothing to do with the competition level he is now facing and more to do with who hits behind him and the park he plays in? Really?

He raises his average nearly 70 freaking points but it has nothing to do with the opposing pitching? RIGHT!!!!! Ask Brad Penny what he thinks the difference is between the AL and the NL.

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Oakland plays in a pitcher's park.

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yeah, supposedly, citi field is also a pitcher's park, but the yankees were the first team to hit an opposite field home run in that park, and they did it 3 times in one game. They homered quite a bit in the mariners' ballpark, with jeter even hitting a 420 foot bomb to the deepest part of the park.

The rangers owned the a's ballpark this year, yet matt holliday can't do it?

i think its because the AL is much tougher than the NL

The AL is obviously tougher than the NL HOWEVER Holliday screwed with his swing at the start of the season. His leg kick was gone. I'm pretty sure that had a lot more to do with his slump than anything else since when he brough the kick back he began to tear it up IN THE AL.

Good job tonight Holiday. You lost the game by yourself on your ****ing error in the 9th.

Nice trade cards. Probably cost you your season because your left fielder cant catch a fly ball.

OMG, the dude got hit square in the nutz! OUCH! Most outfielders don't wear a cup so that had to hurt!

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/sports/columnists.nsf/berniemiklasz/story/8734E53B994140B98625764A0012F87B?OpenDocument

St. Louis media starting to chew on Holliday and the Cardinals. Comparing them to the Cubs.

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St. Louis media starting to chew on Holliday and the Cardinals. Comparing them to the Cubs.

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StL--2006
Cubs--1908

I'm sure they made some other kind of comparison, but those dates are all you really need to know in comparing the two teams.

um they are talking about the 2008 cubs...

that is a legit comparison

...and what about Milton Bradley being an AL All-Star last year but a complete disaster in the NL this year? Anecdotal evidence and ingrained opinions can go both ways.

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I'm sure they made some other kind of comparison

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There you go Yankees. Maybe it makes sense the 2nd time.

...and the 08 Cubs got killed by the Dodgers. The Cardinals are losing close games off various blunders. Not really a good comparison if that's what it was.

The Cubs also opened up at home against the Dodgers.

So if the article compared them because they were both losing to the Dodgers, then i'm sure it's a journalistic masterpiece.

a loss is a loss my man, no one remembers the scores of the 2001 world series, only that mariano rivera blew it