Farmer1906 said:

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mathguy86 said:

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Another bump at 241 votes (56.8%).

Chipper (98.3%)
Vlad (94.6%)
Thome (93.4%)
Hoffman (78.8%) Holding steady.
Edgar (77.2%). Good news is Edgar is +11.5% over this same time last year. Bad news is his trajectory is downwards the last couple of days. He's not going to make it unless the unwashed masses of undisclosed voters come thought. And those are mostly idiots.

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Mussina (70.5%) He's gaining roughly 15% year over year to date each of the last 2 years. Seems pretty clear hes in next year.
Bonds and Clemens (64.3%)
Shilling (59.8%)

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That's unfortunate.

His 3.68 ERA would be in the bottom 4 of HOF ERA.

0 years with a 7+ WAR

Never came close to winning a Cy Young

Only won 20 games once

vs Shilling who will likely never get it

3.46 ERA, 3.23 FIP

4 years of 7+ WAR

Cy Youn Runner-up 3x 4th 1x.

3x 20+ game winner

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Mussina is only going to get in because he played for those great Yankee teams in the late 90s.

Hall of very good, not Hall of Fame.

3.68 ERA, c'mon man.

RetiredAg said:

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How on earth do you justify voting for Clemens, but not Bonds? Both should have been in a long time ago, and it's starting to not look too good for them right now, but I just don't get the logic behind leaving only one off the ballot while voting for the other. They were both locks before PEDs ever came into the picture for them, with Bonds even more of a lock than Clemens.

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During the voting, they jockeyed back and forth with 1-2 votes of each other. It was a case of voters getting up against the 10 vote limit and wanting to vote for both but needing to take one off to vote for someone else.

That may be the case. Right now, in the Thibodaux tracker, there's 4 guys that voted for one or the other, but not both. 3 of those had a 10-man ballot, so that very well may be the case. I would be curious as to Peter Gammons' logic though. He voted for Bonds, but not Clemens, and only had 9 on his ballot.

My guess there is: Gammons = Boston = butthurt = no vote for Clemens.

These voters hold grudges for years. Even Gammons. However, Gammons is pretty open about his ballot and he likely gave his reason. I'm just too lazy to look.

Username checks out.

Mussina played for the Yankees from 01-08, just missing out on two different WS titles, but he was a part of losing two WS with the Yankees in '01,'03.

My vote is Montreal. While he did win the MVP in Anaheim, his numbers were slightly better in the Expos uniform and he spent 8 years in Montreal vs 6 in Anaheim. Oh, and I hate the Angels.

RetiredAg said:

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My vote is Montreal. While he did win the MVP in Anaheim, his numbers were slightly better in the Expos uniform and he spent 8 years in Montreal vs 6 in Anaheim. Oh, and I hate the Angels.

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Agree. Expos all the way.

Its not Vlad's call. The HOF makes the decision now. Thank you Wade Boggs.

The Hall has said they'll still consider people's wishes. But not necessarily grant them. Gary Carter is an expo despite wanting to be a Met. I think they agreed to let LaRussa and Maddux not have a logo.

mathguy86 said:

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Its not Vlad's call. The HOF makes the decision now. Thank you Wade Boggs.

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And Nolan Ryan.

RetiredAg said:

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What an obtuse decision

Do we know what Vlad's wishes were?

ChipFTAC01 said:

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RetiredAg said:

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What an obtuse decision

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Well played

TXAggie2011 said:

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Do we know what Vlad's wishes were?

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This tweet sounds like the decision is consistent with what he wanted, although who knows:

Well, sounds like it was his choice and he went w/ the Angels.

should have been an Expo. Better stats and longer tenure in Montreal.

_lefraud_ said:

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Username checks out.

Mussina played for the Yankees from 01-08, just missing out on two different WS titles, but he was a part of losing two WS with the Yankees in '01,'03.

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Ah ok, wasn't he on the Orioles?

Point remains though, he's a Yankee and that seems to make a huge difference for voters. Not a Hall of Famer imo.

Forum Troll said:

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_lefraud_ said:

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Username checks out.

Mussina played for the Yankees from 01-08, just missing out on two different WS titles, but he was a part of losing two WS with the Yankees in '01,'03.

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Ah ok, wasn't he on the Orioles?

Point remains though, he's a Yankee and that seems to make a huge difference for voters. Not a Hall of Famer imo.

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He's had a steady increase in votes since he's been on the ballot. I don't think there's anything that points to that increase being a result of his years w/ the Yankees. He's a classic borderline guy. Has 270 wins, which will always garner attention, especially since he spent his career in a brutally tough division. I have waffled on the guy, and if I had a ballot I probably wouldn't vote for him, but I can at least understand that some like him for the HOF.

Heck, looking at the Yankees that are currently in the HOF, it looks like that since 70's, only Goose Gossage and Dave Winfield have been elected by the BBWA, and Winfield went in as a Padre. "Borderline" guys like Posada (1st ballot) and Bernie Williams (2nd ballot) rightfully dropped off very early. If there was some pro-Yankees bias at play, surely key names to the late-90's dominant championship teams would have gotten more consideration. They have a ton of HOFers because they're the greatest franchise in baseball history, so naturally they'll have more guys in.

Quote:

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And Nolan Ryan.

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5000th K. 300th victory. 2 no-hitters. Retired there. Why should he have to wear the uni of a team he hadn't played for in 20 years (at time of induction)? I don't know if it would have made any difference if Gene Autry had still been alive (look him up)

94chem said:

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Quote:

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And Nolan Ryan.

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5000th K. 300th victory. 2 no-hitters. Retired there. Why should he have to wear the uni of a team he hadn't played for in 20 years (at time of induction)? I don't know if it would have made any difference if Gene Autry had still been alive (look him up)

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Ks
Mets - 8.6%
Angels - 42.3%
Astros - 32.7%
Rangers - 16.4%

Wins
Mets - 9.0%
Angels - 42.6%
Astros - 32.7%
Rangers - 15.7%

All Star
Mets - 0%
Angels - 62.5%
Astros - 25.0%
Rangers - 12.5%

Games
Mets - 13.0%
Angels - 36.1%
Astros - 34.9%
Rangers - 16.0%

ERA
Mets - 3.58
Angels - 3.07
Astros - 3.13
Rangers - 3.43

He should have been an Angel. If not Cali then Houston. The Rangers had him at age 42-46. It would be like Clemens retiring as an Astro. It makes no sense.