Pouring your own backyard patio slab

9,822 Views | 92 Replies | Last: 16 days ago by AggieArchitect04
Corps_Ag12
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AG
"The bitterness of pour quality remains long after the sweetness of a low price is forgotten."

- Benjamin Franklin


If you have never finished concrete before, then you're taking a big chance in it looking like ***** And if it does look like **** you'll either be taking a hit when you sell the house or you'll be tearing it out.
jamesf
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I've saved money DIYing on plenty of things on my house (remodel bathroom, electrical, shelves, insulation, etc.) Concrete is not something that I would want to DIY. It is very unforgiving when you make mistakes.
Skywalker18
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All quotes in my area have come back around 3500 bucks.
Howdy Dammit
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Skywalker18 said:

All quotes in my area have come back around 3500 bucks.

Yeah. For those small jobs the quotes vary like crazy. We had numerous ranging from 15-30/sf.
TexAg1987
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Skywalker18 said:

Definitely planning to till it up. adding a base needed even if its a good clay there?

No such thing as "good clay" under a slab.

Clay, by nature, absorbs water and swells, moving the slab. Ideally, you want something that doesn't absorb the water but drains well.

Slope it away from the house at 1/4" per 1'

Make sure you have good reinforcing in the slab. Soils that move will put a lot of stress on the flat slab and make it crack. Reinforcing will help hold it all together.

I think you can do it yourself if you take your time, but you will save time and effort bringing in the pre-mix concrete in a truck rather than mixing it yourself. That will give you more time to work it and get the finish right. If you have to mix and place it, you will be fighting the setting of the concrete while trying to mix and pour.

Like others have said, the cost may not be that much different in the long run by the time you rent a mixer and buy concrete by the bag and you can concentrate on finishing. You will still save by doing the formwork and placing yourself.






akaggie05
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Won't doing it bag by bag over a period of days result in tons of cold joints? Agree with what others have said, this will turn out looking like hell most likely.
TexAg1987
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If you really want to experiment on a DIY job, look up some videos on 'dry pour' or 'dry place' concrete.
KDubAg
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I got nothing to add but start taking and alternating Tylenol and ibuprofen every 3-4 hrs before and while your working.

jt2hunt
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TexAg1987 said:

If you really want to experiment on a DIY job, look up some videos on 'dry pour' or 'dry place' concrete.



I don't think this is a good method at all
agcivengineer
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There is some good advice in this thread, and some bad advice, so be careful. Im a concrete engineer who works for one of the largest concrete companies in the US. Ive also done a lot of DIY concrete.

If you want to mix yourself, you need atleast 3 more friends, this will break your back, and im not joking. You need 2 guys mixing and 2 placing and finishing. You also need someone who has finished concrete before or understands it atleast as time / temperature is a factor while placing it. Concrete begins to lose workability within an hour, so that is a factor. If you get a truck, have 3 friends with wheelbarrow or rent a powered concrete mini hauler.

Youll also want to learn how to get the right amount of water in the mix. Too much as your concrete will "bleed" and delay finishing, too little and placement becomes harder. When mixing it yourself, every load can change.

Don't underestimate the challenge with finishing concrete. You might do a "test area" to learn before you do this project.

Do not tie into your slab with dowels or tie bars. You need an "expansion joint" there. You can just put a piece of cedar fence picket full depth placed against the slab. The tie bars just prevent the slab from sliding away from the house, but there is enough friction with the base that shouldn't be an issue.

It should be 4" thick. You can assume concrete will weigh about 145 lb / cubic foot (150 to be conservative include waste) to estimate # of bags.

If mixing the concrete, be prepared to put in a construction joint in more regular intervals as you tire out and cant keep mixing fast enough. If concrete is delivered, you will want a joint every 8 - 10 ft (either a construction/saw cut/ tooled joint).

Rebar isn't exactly needed, but doesn't hurt. You shouldn't get any cracking on such a small slab, but since you inexperienced cracking may happen due to bad placement. So Id suggest using welded wire mesh, or a #3 bar at 18" on center placed at mid depth.

Placing it on your compacted clay is fine. Yes, clay can shrink / swell and for big projects we stabilize the soil, but that doesnt do much in this application, unless water is draining towards this slab.

I hope this goes well, just dont underestimate it.
Skywalker18
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FINALLY, someone here with Knowledge! You have eased me and really answered all of my questions! Thank you!

Did you see the picture I posted? Any reason to level it out more or dig down? I was also planning to put an expansion joint in the middle. Was going to buy those at the local hardware store. My wife has convinced me to go the truck route instead of bags even though I had a group willing to help as long as the cooler stayed full. Any other tips or tricks would be greatly appreciated.
agcivengineer
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You need to determine what you want the top elevation of your slab to be and then work down 4" from there in terms of where you want the top of your dirt to be. You will want to make sure it slopes away from the house for drainage, but it doesnt need to be severe.

Make sure and compact the dirt, the hand compactor you have is good. You dont want any grass, etc in that material, which i think you have removed.

You can just use cedar fence pickets for your expansion joint. However, you dont need an expansion joint in the middle of your slab, unless you just want one. For a construction joint, if you need one due to your placement capacity, etc then use a form until it the concrete hardens, and then pull that form and pour right up against it the next day (or few days) using the hardened concrete as your next form. If you want to reduce steel, then you will want rebar going across that joint. Rebar is deformed and is used to hold concrete together after it cracks or across joints. You would want that "tie bar" to be #3 bar 30" long spaced at 15 - 18" apart placed across the joint. Or if you run steel in the slab ( #3 bar 18" on center), you can have the steel go across that joint, but obviously that can be a challenge with forming. An expansion joint isn't needed, you donr have enough concrete to have an "expansion issue". Adjacent to your house slab we are "isolating" the house concrete from the patio to prevent one cracking the other as they will move different from each other due to the environment.

Best advice is to get a few bags of concrete and build some 1.5' x 1.5' steps to learn how to finish concrete before hand. Its harder than you think it is. Practice getting the right finish (broom, carpet, etc). You dont want to "over finish" it either. Get it flat with a 2 x 4, get it relatively finished, wait for bleed water to finish, then trowel it and broom it. After a few hours, keep it damp with water to cure it for a few days.

Don't forget that time, temperature, and wind impact concrete behavior. It has an expiration on it, you dont have a ton of time to mess around with it.

For concrete, look up volumetric trucks, I think concrete on demand might be a company you could use. They make the concrete right there on the spot for you. or Houston Shell and Concrete is a traditional ready mix truck as they tailor to small projects. If you go that route, order a bit more than you calculate you will need. You dont want to be short here. This is where a volumetric truck is nice.

You will want to ask for 3000 psi concrete with a target slump of 5". If they offer to use a admix******er or water reducer, those arent bad but may add some cost. They arent critical, but dont hurt. The admix******er will slow the set down giving you a but more working time and the water reducer will allow more workability with less water which will reduce bleed water. As the heat picks up, those become more important.
agcivengineer
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Howdy Dammit
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What year did you graduate CVEN. I was 2016.
agcivengineer
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Undergrad 2003, Masters 2005

My dad teaches in the dept, usually 342...
agcivengineer
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I forgot to add, you will want to have a method to consolidate the concrete. You might be able to rent a vibrator from home dept, if not, use a piece of rebar and rod it up and down a bunch, especially on your edges and corners. Higher slump will reduce the need for this, but that can cause issues especially if that slump iant achieved with admixtures.
SnowboardAg
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#thingsIwouldntdo
mts6175
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Rent a buggy, order a truck.

https://www.homedepot.com/c/concrete-buggies-rental
tgivaughn
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All close but no cigar and all appreciated all righty
Future reference, let's say a bit more complicated ala a closet addition 6x12ft interior
  • Foundation - DIY dig beams, set forms, avoid utilities BUT HIRE the rest, dowel to house slab
  • Framing, roofing/flashing, interiors BUT hire flooring pros, be it tile/reif.mat or even carpet
  • DIY electrical lF only outlets and can-do a window AC
  • No plumbing DIY
Love your youth, esp if teaching kids but Might Be a Too-Much if 1st time out there

When Aggies go out 1st time to learn to place concrete flatwork/steps real time in college, the teacher asks ... do you really have your gold rings still on?

Insider joke? NO?

Photos please?
We all still learn from others, esp in Golf!
God speed
Gotta draw since me got no grammar MasterArch '76
62strat
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All I know, this OP is out of effin mind if he thinks he can do this by himself. I work in construction and my company pours just a few million sf of slab a year.

I had a 21x10 slab done in my backyard by my subs.. It took 5 flatworkers who do this daily to get this done and it took them 5-6 hours (form and pour). And that was using a pump (with 2 more guys), no wheelbarrows.

I didn't read every reply, maybe first half page, but young man who posted this, take the advice of those here.

You do not want to do your first DIY concrete on a 200+ sf slab. I did a 30"x30" (with a 24" deep 18" caisson in the middle) with a mixer and a buddy and it took a few hours, but I also borrowed high quality floats and trowels. I had the 'big' rotater/mixer and it only could take 2-3 bags.

Your short load truck will be ~$600-700 in concrete which has to be nearly equal if not cheaper than your 100+ bags.. Find your own flatworkers (call it $300 for each guy, 3 should be enough if you pump, 4-5 if wheelbarrows) and you'll get this way below your $3500 quote and it will be done right. Pump will be maybe $500 but you'll save a guy or two.





Skywalker18
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If only you were smart enough and continued reading. Thanks for offering nothing bud!
RogerFurlong
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Skywalker18 said:

If only you were smart enough and continued reading. Thanks for offering nothing bud!

Haha. When are you planning on starting this project? I'm excited to see the results.
Skywalker18
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Already started. Hoping to do the pour sometime this month or beginning of next! Working on leveling the ground and putting forms up with rebar right now.

I'll have everything ready and will only have the pour and finish to focus on.
62strat
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Skywalker18 said:

If only you were smart enough and continued reading. Thanks for offering nothing bud!

your most recent post indicates you are still doing DIY (albeit, luckily with a truck delivery).. so not sure what you're talking about.

https://texags.com/forums/61/topics/3602748/replies/72159990

How many people have said on here it's not a good idea for your first concrete attempt to be your large back patio?
Skywalker18
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75% of your post was about using bags…… If you're taking the time to make a post on here then read the forum!
Milwaukees Best Light
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I have now flipped. I am squarely on team Do It Yourself. I'm rooting for you. I want to see pics of you and your buddies drinking beer and smoking big ass cigars on the new porch. You got this. If a bunch of halfwits with a grade school education can do it, surely you can watch a couple YouTubes and get close to their level. Pour baby, pour!!!
Skywalker18
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Milwaukees Best Light said:

I have now flipped. I am squarely on team Do It Yourself. I'm rooting for you. I want to see pics of you and your buddies drinking beer and smoking big ass cigars on the new porch. You got this. If a bunch of halfwits with a grade school education can do it, surely you can watch a couple YouTubes and get close to their level. Pour baby, pour!!!
we will be sure to only drink Milwaukees best while sweating our asses off too!
The Pilot
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Milwaukees Best Light said:

I have now flipped. I am squarely on team Do It Yourself. I'm rooting for you. I want to see pics of you and your buddies drinking beer and smoking big ass cigars on the new porch. You got this. If a bunch of halfwits with a grade school education can do it, surely you can watch a couple YouTubes and get close to their level. Pour baby, pour!!!

Same. Mixing bags of concrete is easy stuff, you can do it.
62strat
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Skywalker18 said:

75% of your post was about using bags…… If you're taking the time to make a post on here then read the forum!

uhh... no it's not?

I gave you example of a project and how long it took in my yard with several flatworkers using a pump.
Then I piled on the bandwagon of suggesting you don't DIY such a large first pour.
Then I gave pricing of a truck and laborers to show you can save from the quotes you got, in addition to throwing a pump suggestion out there instead of wheelbarrows.

Looks like the word bags shows up all of twice in my post.

Corps_Ag12
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Milwaukees Best Light said:

I have now flipped. I am squarely on team Do It Yourself. I'm rooting for you. I want to see pics of you and your buddies drinking beer and smoking big ass cigars on the new porch. You got this. If a bunch of halfwits with a grade school education can do it, surely you can watch a couple YouTubes and get close to their level. Pour baby, pour!!!


I'm on team can't wait to see how bad it is.
jja79
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Let's do this. Hire someone to film it please.
AggieOO
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i know nothing of pouring concrete. please let me know if you need assistance. it seems as though I'm quite qualified for your team.
Skywalker18
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Skywalker18
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Now onto making it not look like crap
Milwaukees Best Light
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Hell yeah! Almost Miller Time.
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