quote:

---

Some of you need to check your biases at the door

---

Tell that to the GLBT Mafia.

"Check your biases"

Lmao. When in doubt, start accusing people of being biased. Thanks, Jesse Jackson.

quote:

---

"Check your biases"

Lmao. When in doubt, start accusing people of being biased. Thanks, Jesse Jackson.

---

When in doubt, accuse people of not knowing what's in the UCMJ without having any idea yourself

quote:

---

Why would the government give you a shot at being an AF officer, when there are thousands of younger and probably more qualified men and women?

---

Younger? Yes. More qualified? You haven't seen my resume. I'm pretty comfortable saying there are few OTS applicants with my level of experience and qualifications.

quote:

---

The government doesn't owe you anything

---

I agree. That's why I am competing against all other applicants on a merit basis.

quote:

---

When in doubt, accuse people of not knowing what's in the UCMJ without having any idea yourself

---

I love Article 134

There is nothing about Article 134 that applies to this.

No, there isn't, and it even states that it requires either non-judicial or courts martial proceedings, Article 134 does not apply to administrative discharges. For the barracks lawyers here, those can be found in AR 635-200 (for the Army, the discharges are the same criteria I just don't know the other services' regulation numbers)

Some of you seem to be under the impression that RTT is getting some kind of special treatment in his process to rejoin the Air Force. Please provide any evidence that you have that he is being pushed ahead of any other candidates and/or that the Air Force will make the determination of his acceptance based on anything other than merit or need.

Additionally, others of you seem to simply be a**holes.

[This message has been edited by pagerman @ work (edited 6/3/2014 4:13p).]

Didn't he say his age waiver was handled by the acting SECAF at the time? And that the SECAF assigned a Colonel to specifically handle his waiver package?

From a thread started by Ryan on 4/14:

quote:

---

Even though I am going through the BCMR process, SECAF cleared me to apply to OTS

---

I suspect he will be selected for OTS.

Cleared to apply does not mean selected. Age waiver in addition to an admin discharge and a RIF means he has an uphill battle; right alongside others who are competing to get in during a draw down.

i was not stating nor did i think that he was discharged under a violation of article 134, i was just implying that EVERYTHING is chargeable under the UCMJ. it was just a joke.

i dont really give a **** about this whole thing at all, but i do love all the righteous indignation on both sides.

quote:

---

Age waiver in addition to an admin discharge and a RIF means he has an uphill battle; right alongside others who are competing to get in during a draw down.

---

The discharge cannot officially be considered because my DD785 is nullified and my DD214 RE code is 1J. But you forgot non-STEM degree, and the fact that all OTS boards have been indefinitely suspended.

My chances of being selected are pretty narrow, but being the oldest 2Lt in the entire force would be interesting. I've got nothing to lose except for a couple of nights in a hotel in San Antonio, and if I don't get selected I will probably apply for an AF civilian position. I'm qualified for a level much higher than a 2Lt.

You aren't qualified to be higher than a 2ndLt unless you were already a 2ndLt.

Please tell me that isn't a serious comment.

fwiw, I'm the chief of staff of an organization with 700+ employees.

Congrats, you should keep doing that then. If you go back in the military, you're just another boot lieutenant.

quote:

---

If you go back in the military, you're just another boot lieutenant.

---

I'm okay with that.

If you genuinely mean that, then I hope it works out for you.

And I do.

Thanks.

quote:

---

I'm qualified for a level much higher than a 2Lt.

---

Yikes.

I think he meant as a GS employee he'd be qualified for higher than a 2LT equivalent (I think that's like a GS-9)

Pretty arrogant thing to say.

quote:

---

I'm qualified for a level much higher than a 2Lt

---

Make sure to tell this to your first CO. I'm sure he will be very impressed with this outstanding attitude.

quote:

---

Make sure to tell this to your first CO. I'm sure he will be very impressed with this outstanding attitude.

---

Last time I checked, a 2Lt was still a 2Lt and does what he gets told to do, but you're trolling, so it doesn't matter.

RtT

1945 - just after war's end - Navy class - most had signed up for " duration and 6 months " - classmate from Arkansas discovered that his recruiter had signed him up for 4 years - not a happy camper !

I think this whole application process is to prove a point and that you never should have need discharged to begin with... And are PO'ed to the point that if accepted, the next step is to be remunerated for all the list time and progress towards a military retirement - and may, just may - be willing to go to court to prove it??

Aggie1:

I may be recalling incorrectly, but I think you and I discussed this already. If not, here are the facts:

- I am applying for OTS along with the rest of the pool of applicants.

- I am eligible for selection to one out of only nine available slots.

- There is a very high probability I will NOT be selected

- If I am selected, my career will proceed as though the last 14 years never existed. I will commission as a 2Lt with 3 years, 11 months, 22 days time in service.

- If I am not selected, I will be ineligible to reapply for OTS and will continue with my civilian career accordingly. I have the ability to apply for a direct commission in Health Services Administration, but have not yet decided if it is an appropriate path to pursue.

- I am not seeking any return to active service that will involve anything retroactive. The BCMR can order retroactive reinstatement, including backpay and additional TIG/TIS, but I am not seeking it.

- I committed to the Secretary of the Air Force in writing on day one that I will not use the courts to circumvent the OTS application process or otherwise seek reinstatement. Nobody wins in that scenario except the lawyers.

The only thing I have to prove is that I want the opportunity to continue serving our great nation as a commissioned officer. I don't see what is so difficult to understand about someone just wanting to serve, but I recognize that a lot of people on TexAgs allow their own presuppositions to assume the worst about people. If it doesn't happen, it doesn't happen and I move on and appreciate the second chance I got. That's honestly all there is to this.

Why would I want retroactive time in service, anyway? It would basically force my retirement in less than five years. I don't want to be forced out in five years, I want to spend as much time as I can back in the Air Force having a long and fulfilling military career.



[This message has been edited by Ryan the Temp (edited 6/9/2014 12:52p).]

Admirably spoken - but you still did not answer my question about proving a point. And, you would be foolish to agree and say so in writing as it could come back to haunt you later - but if I were in your shoes it certainly would be in my thought process. You are trying too hard for a career with fewer and fewer perks and a built in bias against your personal behavior - definitely a burden!

As pointed out above 2nd Lt's are not supposed to be movers and shakers (unless pilot qualified) - and are supposed to be quiet and pay attention until about midway Captain when you can let your light shine.

When I went from E-6 to 2Lt my pay doubled but expectations of my performance was maybe half - or less...

Yes. We have had several conversations since you first started down this road and I still don't understand your perseverance - unless to prove a point... You have exercised your rights as a citizen but appealed to a level far beyond what you could if you were still an active service member. To most service members this is an unfair and this is an abuse of the system. And, the replies you have received - and shared - are political correctness personified in our new world of never saying anything that could come back to haunt. If indeed there are no OTS selections going on what's the point? And if there are, those biases will likely come in the form of a nay vote and you will never understand who - but you know very well why.

quote:

---

I still don't understand your perseverance - unless to prove a point...

---

My perseverance exists as a product of a burning desire to serve our nation. The only thing I have to prove is that I can be a good officer. I know, given my political history, that it will always be difficult for some people to understand that my desire to serve transcends all other things, but there really is no ulterior motive here.

quote:

---

You have exercised your rights as a citizen but appealed to a level far beyond what you could if you were still an active service member. To most service members this is an unfair and this is an abuse of the system.

---

I did not contact SAF. He contacted me. How that happened is a long story, but I agree the attention being paid to my case and the involvement of some in it is far beyond the norm. I started through regular channels like anyone else.

quote:

---

And, the replies you have received - and shared - are political correctness personified in our new world of never saying anything that could come back to haunt.

---

I'm not sure how to respond to that.

quote:

---

If indeed there are no OTS selections going on what's the point?

---

I have nothing to lose and everything to gain. I owe it to myself and everyone who has stood with me over the years to fight for this as hard as I can to the bitter end. Churchill said to never give up on something you cannot go a day without thinking about. I've thought about this every day of my life for 14 years.

quote:

---

And if there are, those biases will likely come in the form of a nay vote and you will never understand who - but you know very well why.

---

Yes. That is a very real possibility. Some people very close to the process have expressed a different opinion about that, but I pray for the best and expect the worst.

DADT was repealed in 2010. Why did you not start the process at that point? Just curious since you are going all out. Starting then would have given you a couple more years age wise.

Repeal wasn't certified until September 2011 and this process has been ongoing for about a year so far. We didn't realize it was a possibility until I got some paperwork from AFPC, then we started the ball rolling immediately. Even if I had started immediately in 2011, I wouldn't have seen a board until 2012, and it still would have been my one and only chance.

I'm glad it worked out that way because I lost 70 pounds in 2013.

quote:

---

As pointed out above 2nd Lt's are not supposed to be movers and shakers (unless pilot qualified) - and are supposed to be quiet and pay attention until about midway Captain when you can let your light shine.

---

You can choose to slack off and skate through claiming to be a new JO and be treated accordingly, or you can raise to the expectations of an officer and begin leading even as an O-1 and be treated accordingly.

"supposed to be quiet and pay attention until about midway Captain when you can let your light shine"