AvidAggie said:
The fact that they are finding potential treatments are encouraging.
Who cares about the potential unlikely severe side effects if you are about to die from CV
No kidding.
Hydroxychloroquine...........
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Last: 11 mo ago by Jabin
No kidding.
New data. I think it's real. Not overly impressive due to low numbers. But . What to we do? If this turns into Italy soon.
Marcus Aurelius said:
New data. I think it's real. Not overly impressive due to low numbers. But . What to we do? If this turns into Italy soon.
36 outta 36 seems pretty skrong
I posted a message on Linkedin regarding this very topic last week. Physicians in South Korea have been prescribing HCQ with Zinc and having fantastic results. Zinc has shown to be extremely effective at hindering viral RNA polymerase once in the cell but the challenge is that enough zinc cannot effectively pass through the cell membrance to slow down this viral strains replication process due to Zinc's chemical structure. HCQ allows the ionization of the cell membrane specifically for zinc to efficiently pass through the cell and hinder the replication process.
This has been tested in vitro years ago (numerous papers) and has worked in vivo during this outbreak with superb results. Everyone should be excited as this is truly working to cure many that have contracted the virus.
This has been tested in vitro years ago (numerous papers) and has worked in vivo during this outbreak with superb results. Everyone should be excited as this is truly working to cure many that have contracted the virus.
Great stuff thx. Wasnt aware of the zinc data. Will Rx it. Beautiful use of TexAgs.
Will as well for highly suspect cases.
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It doesn't cause that much qt prolongation. Not much of a concern if pt not already on qt prolonging drugs.cisgenderedAggie said:Marcus Aurelius said:
Hydrochloroquine has essentially no side effects. Remdesivir - not alot of data. Anectodally - nothing . Contraindicated with increased LFTS.
Hydroxychloroquine can cause irreversible retinal damage and sudden cardiac death.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Pelayo said:It doesn't cause that much qt prolongation. Not much of a concern if pt not already on qt prolonging drugs.cisgenderedAggie said:Marcus Aurelius said:
Hydrochloroquine has essentially no side effects. Remdesivir - not alot of data. Anectodally - nothing . Contraindicated with increased LFTS.
Hydroxychloroquine can cause irreversible retinal damage and sudden cardiac death.
Can't a bunch of stuff cause long QT? Like ciprofloxaxin and other antibiotics?
Yes but in my experience it's minimal. Can always do an ecg to see what the qtc is and make a risk benefit judgment call.Exsurge Domine said:Pelayo said:It doesn't cause that much qt prolongation. Not much of a concern if pt not already on qt prolonging drugs.cisgenderedAggie said:Marcus Aurelius said:
Hydrochloroquine has essentially no side effects. Remdesivir - not alot of data. Anectodally - nothing . Contraindicated with increased LFTS.
Hydroxychloroquine can cause irreversible retinal damage and sudden cardiac death.
Can't a bunch of stuff cause long QT? Like ciprofloxaxin and other antibiotics?
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Yes. They bain of hospital docs / pulm. Classics are quinolones. Then macrolides. Amio. Sotolol. HMGA CO reductase inhibitors too. Annoying.
Pelayo said:Yes but in my experience it's minimal. Can always do an ecg to see what the qtc is and make a risk benefit judgment call.Exsurge Domine said:Pelayo said:It doesn't cause that much qt prolongation. Not much of a concern if pt not already on qt prolonging drugs.cisgenderedAggie said:Marcus Aurelius said:
Hydrochloroquine has essentially no side effects. Remdesivir - not alot of data. Anectodally - nothing . Contraindicated with increased LFTS.
Hydroxychloroquine can cause irreversible retinal damage and sudden cardiac death.
Can't a bunch of stuff cause long QT? Like ciprofloxaxin and other antibiotics?
Yeah that's what I was saying, doesn't sound like a big deal
I have RA and take HCL - get my eyes check every year and have no issues. Actually, RA has been in decline and I stopped taking it. I'm going to have the prescription reissued ASAP
But. For me bottomline. A severe COVID pt. Im not concerned about QT unless they are on amio or LVQ?
Only after long periods of usage.cisgenderedAggie said:Marcus Aurelius said:
Hydrochloroquine has essentially no side effects. Remdesivir - not alot of data. Anectodally - nothing . Contraindicated with increased LFTS.
Hydroxychloroquine can cause irreversible retinal damage and sudden cardiac death.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydroxychloroquine
"People taking 400 mg of hydroxychloroquine or less per day generally have a negligible risk of macular toxicity, whereas the risk begins to go up when a person takes the medication over 5 years or has a cumulative dose of more than 1000 grams"
I have some of both from my travel to India. Just in case.Buck Compton said:That's why I asked. Look at the graph posted above. It states HCQ + Azithromycin94chem said:Buck Compton said:Thanks.Marcus Aurelius said:
Man hate to sabotage to "Aggie Revellie" thread re this. But - I believe the hydrochloroquine data. I recommend it. For anyone requiring supplemental O2. FYI for the million time I am a compassionate BCS pulm/CC doc.
I've been reading up a lot, but can you briefly explain the science behind this potentially working? Especially in combination with azithromyacin?
Azithromycin? Is the pneumonia from secondary bacterial infection? Most docs get ticked if somebody suggests treating a viral infection with an antibiotic.
My wife has RA and takes this. Thank you for posting this. This will help to cool some anxiety.
Antidysrhythmics seem to be the biggest riskMarcus Aurelius said:
But. For me bottomline. A severe COVID pt. Im not concerned about QT unless they are on amio or LVQ?
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Malarone which is a combination of 2 anti-malaria drugs may be effective. Had to take it 2 days before and a week after returning from a malaria area. May work faster on this virus.
https://www.rxlist.com/malarone-side-effects-drug-center.htm#
https://www.rxlist.com/malarone-side-effects-drug-center.htm#
Snap E Tom said:Only after long periods of usage.cisgenderedAggie said:Marcus Aurelius said:
Hydrochloroquine has essentially no side effects. Remdesivir - not alot of data. Anectodally - nothing . Contraindicated with increased LFTS.
Hydroxychloroquine can cause irreversible retinal damage and sudden cardiac death.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydroxychloroquine
"People taking 400 mg of hydroxychloroquine or less per day generally have a negligible risk of macular toxicity, whereas the risk begins to go up when a person takes the medication over 5 years or has a cumulative dose of more than 1000 grams"
This.
It's a cumulative dosage effect and even after 5 years still a rare finding. If you already suffer from macular degeneration you could be more susceptible to plaquenil maculopathy but I've only ever seen two cases.
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Interesting. I still have a 15 dose prescription for a trip to west Africa a year ago that was cancelled.74Ag1 said:
Malarone which is a combination of 2 anti-malaria drugs may be effective. Had to take it 2 days before and a week after returning from a malaria area. May work faster on this virus.
https://www.rxlist.com/malarone-side-effects-drug-center.htm#
Saw this a couple of weeks ago. I'm not a doctor, but this guy does a great job of explaining how this process works that even I could understand it.
Where can we buy it??
If you don't have symptoms, why would you even want to? You can get it from a pharmacy when you actually have a doctor prescribe it to you.1/2 Man 1/2 Amazing said:
Where can we buy it??
COVID seems to be causing sudden cardiac death in a lot of folks, thought to be viral myocarditis. So the risk from the drug seems worth it.
People who have existing meds that prolong QTc might be at higher risk, but again, those folks likely on higher risk anyway.
People who have existing meds that prolong QTc might be at higher risk, but again, those folks likely on higher risk anyway.
Is hydoxychloroquin something that is ready available at pharmacies? I assume the Zpac would be easily available?Moxley said:
COVID seems to be causing sudden cardiac death in a lot of folks, thought to be viral myocarditis. So the risk from the drug seems worth it.
People who have existing meds that prolong QTc might be at higher risk, but again, those folks likely on higher risk anyway.
Yes it is...and available in generic form.....but they would have to ramp up production. It's not really a hospital drug though. So hospital pharmacies would have to stock up.
Drug has been around since 1940s. It's for malaria, but most take it for RA, lupus.
Drug has been around since 1940s. It's for malaria, but most take it for RA, lupus.
I wonder how difficult a ramo up would be? Saw Bayer talking about having a large quantity of it to donate.
I thought it was older than the 40s? Would still be pretty impressive if a nearly 80yo drug got back in the ring for round two with a globally destructive disease.
Edit: meet you in the middle, I thought 20s, you said 40s, discovered in '34.
I thought it was older than the 40s? Would still be pretty impressive if a nearly 80yo drug got back in the ring for round two with a globally destructive disease.
Edit: meet you in the middle, I thought 20s, you said 40s, discovered in '34.
Hard meh, on this. It's promising, and I'll probably still use it for moderate to severe cases, but until we have RCTs demonstrating efficacy, I'll remain skeptical of the benefits. I've lost count of the number therapies that make sense biochemically and/or physiologically, work in vitro, but then demonstrate no or minimal benefit on RCT.
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Dr. Not Yet Dr. Ag said:
Hard meh, on this. It's promising, and I'll probably still use it for moderate to severe cases, but until we have RCTs demonstrating efficacy, I'll remain skeptical of the benefits. I've lost count of the number therapies that make sense biochemically and/or physiologically, work in vitro, but then demonstrate no or minimal benefit on RCT.
South Korea has been using it since early February. They have the lowest cfr in the world with this. But hey you do you.
Where can you buy these?
Username checks outDr. Not Yet Dr. Ag said:
Hard meh, on this. It's promising, and I'll probably still use it for moderate to severe cases, but until we have RCTs demonstrating efficacy, I'll remain skeptical of the benefits. I've lost count of the number therapies that make sense biochemically and/or physiologically, work in vitro, but then demonstrate no or minimal benefit on RCT.
Marcus, along with the treatment of hte virus, have you had any anecdotes on utilizing Tocilizumab to treat the cytokine storm? This is another method that was highly utilized in S. Korea and they garnered success with it.
Nevermind, just saw it's not approved for use in the USA. I guess in the US they're testing Kevzara due to the similar mechanism of action.
Nevermind, just saw it's not approved for use in the USA. I guess in the US they're testing Kevzara due to the similar mechanism of action.
Italy has been using it as well, hows that going for them? This is how science works. You need to prove a medication is actually effective.
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