big week for DC Films folks' screenshots of the Notes app

— Todd Vaziri (@tvaziri) December 15, 2022

This sounds about right to me...

Prediction - THE BATMAN 2 and Gunn’s SUPERMAN will hit theaters in 2025

2023: wrap up the DCEU as we know it with SHAZAM!, THE FLASH, BLUE BEETLE + AQUAMAN

2024: gap year, with the exception of the JOKER sequel

2025: THE BATMAN sequel + the first film(s) produced by DC Studios

— Johnny Sobczak (@JohnnySobczak) December 15, 2022

Was hoping for no gap year, but I guess you'd have to immediately start filming in the new year to have a chance.

Plus Marvel's 2024 slate isn't that great, so it would be a perfect opportunity to start the new universe.

Brian Earl Spilner said:

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This is exactly my issue. Cavill could've continued in his own separate storyline, easily explained as an alternate timeline split off from Flashpoint. I think Cavill was probably the one thing most people agreed on as being good in the DCEU. Maybe along with Gadot as WW.

Oh well. I admit I'm pretty bitter about this as I've been clamoring for it for years along with Porkchop, then they dangle it in front of us and immediately take it away.

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This is a bit of speculation on my part, but it seems to me that, going forward, DC's two crown jewels - Superman and Batman - each get one "alternate" iteration outside of the "primary" Gunn/Safran DC Studios arc. In other words, there will likely be the Gunn/Safran iterations of Superman, Batman, and whatever other characters they choose to inhabit that universe, but then Reeves' Batman franchise, and Abrams'/Coates' Superman franchise, will each exist as two separate universes outside of the Gunn/Safran universe. Which obviously means no room for a third iteration of Superman, led by Henry Cavill.

After 2023/2024, the DCEU franchise, along with Phillip's Joker franchise, will cease to exist, and then, starting in 2025, each year will see one of the three franchises above release two or three movies between them.

- Reeves' Batman will feel distinct because it was established first, and by the end of 2025, will have two movies and at least two HBO Max series comprising it, an entire cinematic universe unto itself.

- Abrams'/Coates' Superman will obviously be distinct because it will be a black version of the character, almost as a "What if..." iteration, just on a blockbuster level.

- Then I imagine Gunn's/Safran's Superman will be white, and their Batman different enough from Reeves', that there's never any confusion between the "primary" DC Studios iterations (which will, again, share a universe with all other DC superheroes) and the "alternate" iterations of characters mentioned above (which will each be in their own, siphoned off universes).

I of course could be wrong, and things are obviously still in flux, but reading between the lines, and given all the context clues, this is what WB's plan is looking like as of now.

liam hemsworth fighting netflix execs to keep the geralt role now that henry cavill unemployed pic.twitter.com/OrDlnFEk11

— ceo of kory (@korysverse) December 15, 2022

My favorite Saturday morning cartoon growing up was The Superfriends, especially the battles against the Legion Of Doom. It finally seemed like DC was getting their sh** together and bringing in actors that fit the parts. Love Cavill as Superman, Gadot as WW, and even liked Affleck's Batman. At the end of Justice League, the scene with Wayne and Prince in the future Hall Of Justice gave me goosebumps - finally here comes The Superfriends on the big screen. And top it off with the credit scene in Black Adam - Cavill's coming back !!

Way to totally crap all over that - I have absolutely no excitement going forward for anything coming out of DC.

CoppellAg93 said:

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My favorite Saturday morning cartoon growing up was The Superfriends, especially the battles against the Legion Of Doom. It finally seemed like DC was getting their sh** together and bringing in actors that fit the parts. Love Cavill as Superman, Gadot as WW, and even liked Affleck's Batman. At the end of Justice League, the scene with Wayne and Prince in the future Hall Of Justice gave me goosebumps - finally here comes The Superfriends on the big screen. And top it off with the credit scene in Black Adam - Cavill's coming back !!

Way to totally crap all over that - I have absolutely no excitement going forward for anything coming out of DC.

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They also alluded to the Superfriends at the end of that Arrow Crisis on Infinite Earths crossover thing, even had a monkey sound at the very end.

CoppellAg93 said:

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My favorite Saturday morning cartoon growing up was The Superfriends, especially the battles against the Legion Of Doom. It finally seemed like DC was getting their sh** together and bringing in actors that fit the parts. Love Cavill as Superman, Gadot as WW, and even liked Affleck's Batman. At the end of Justice League, the scene with Wayne and Prince in the future Hall Of Justice gave me goosebumps - finally here comes The Superfriends on the big screen. And top it off with the credit scene in Black Adam - Cavill's coming back !!

Way to totally crap all over that - I have absolutely no excitement going forward for anything coming out of DC.

---

Given what Zach Snyder's plan was, I doubt we would have ever seen anything resembling Superfriends (also my favorite Saturday morning cartoon growing up), although he certainly seemed inclined to have the Hall of Justice as a big part of the story, at least until Darkseid showed up with his armada and layed waste to everything. Synder's vision would have been very dark, think TESB on steroids, with Superman twisted to evil after the gruesome death of Lois Lane, and the remaining JL members hunted. I would have loved to see this play out on the big screen, but alas, that is not to be.

TCTTS said:

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This is a bit of speculation on my part, but it seems to me that, going forward, DC's two crown jewels - Superman and Batman - each get one "alternate" iteration outside of the "primary" Gunn/Safran DC Studios arc. In other words, there will likely be the Gunn/Safran iterations of Superman, Batman, and whatever other characters they choose to inhabit that universe…snip.

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Man, I think you are right, but this seems like such a terrible idea.

The viewing public at large is not going to understand this at all. They will need to do some solid branding on this to make it work.

The more I think about it, DC should (they won't do this) make their first movie an epic Endgame style movie. Have Booster Gold and Blue Beetle (or other DC characters) as the main characters. Start with the existing DCU crew fighting Darkseid…then Booster screwing up the fight with time travel shenanigans and then the movie is them putting the timeline back together. Make it a tribute to all the previous DC series and movies. Just absolute bonkers.

Then end it with the new Batman/Superman/whoever emerging to start their adventures. Like the last scene of the movie is the first scene of their future movies.

Post credit scene is the first Thanos level villain and another tongue in cheek about Mamoa going from Aquaman to Lobo.

Make it a huge event. Probably dumb but it could be awesome and set them apart from Marvel

TCTTS said:

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Brian Earl Spilner said:

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This is exactly my issue. Cavill could've continued in his own separate storyline, easily explained as an alternate timeline split off from Flashpoint. I think Cavill was probably the one thing most people agreed on as being good in the DCEU. Maybe along with Gadot as WW.

Oh well. I admit I'm pretty bitter about this as I've been clamoring for it for years along with Porkchop, then they dangle it in front of us and immediately take it away.

---

This is a bit of speculation on my part, but it seems to me that, going forward, DC's two crown jewels - Superman and Batman - each get one "alternate" iteration outside of the "primary" Gunn/Safran DC Studios arc. In other words, there will likely be the Gunn/Safran iterations of Superman, Batman, and whatever other characters they choose to inhabit that universe, but then Reeves' Batman franchise, and Abrams'/Coates' Superman franchise, will each exist as two separate universes outside of the Gunn/Safran universe. Which obviously means no room for a third iteration of Superman, led by Henry Cavill.

After 2023/2024, the DCEU franchise, along with Phillip's Joker franchise, will cease to exist, and then, starting in 2025, each year will see one of the three franchises above release two or three movies between them.

- Reeves' Batman will feel distinct because it was established first, and by the end of 2025, will have two movies and at least two HBO Max series comprising it, an entire cinematic universe unto itself.

- Abrams'/Coates' Superman will obviously be distinct because it will be a black version of the character, almost as a "What if..." iteration, just on a blockbuster level.

- Then I imagine Gunn's/Safran's Superman will be white, and their Batman different enough from Reeves', that there's never any confusion between the "primary" DC Studios iterations (which will, again, share a universe with all other DC superheroes) and the "alternate" iterations of characters mentioned above (which will each be in their own, siphoned off universes).

I of course could be wrong, and things are obviously still in flux, but reading between the lines, and given all the context clues, this is what WB's plan is looking like as of now.

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Has this been cast?

No, still in development. There's a script, but that's about it, apparently.

Cinco Ranch Aggie said:

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CoppellAg93 said:

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My favorite Saturday morning cartoon growing up was The Superfriends, especially the battles against the Legion Of Doom. It finally seemed like DC was getting their sh** together and bringing in actors that fit the parts. Love Cavill as Superman, Gadot as WW, and even liked Affleck's Batman. At the end of Justice League, the scene with Wayne and Prince in the future Hall Of Justice gave me goosebumps - finally here comes The Superfriends on the big screen. And top it off with the credit scene in Black Adam - Cavill's coming back !!

Way to totally crap all over that - I have absolutely no excitement going forward for anything coming out of DC.

---

Given what Zach Snyder's plan was, I doubt we would have ever seen anything resembling Superfriends (also my favorite Saturday morning cartoon growing up), although he certainly seemed inclined to have the Hall of Justice as a big part of the story, at least until Darkseid showed up with his armada and layed waste to everything. Synder's vision would have been very dark, think TESB on steroids, with Superman twisted to evil after the gruesome death of Lois Lane, and the remaining JL members hunted. I would have loved to see this play out on the big screen, but alas, that is not to be.

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That gets back to my big problem with almost all of the big bads in DC so far (Steppenwolf, Darkseid, Ares), they're all pretty interchangeable.

I have no idea what their powers are other than "big strong guy who kills everything" and they have no real distinguishing characteristics.

CoppellAg93 said:

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My favorite Saturday morning cartoon growing up was The Superfriends, especially the battles against the Legion Of Doom. It finally seemed like DC was getting their sh** together and bringing in actors that fit the parts. Love Cavill as Superman, Gadot as WW, and even liked Affleck's Batman. At the end of Justice League, the scene with Wayne and Prince in the future Hall Of Justice gave me goosebumps - finally here comes The Superfriends on the big screen. And top it off with the credit scene in Black Adam - Cavill's coming back !!

Way to totally crap all over that - I have absolutely no excitement going forward for anything coming out of DC.

---

Maybe this wasn't communicated clearly enough, but even under the old regime, DC had no concrete plans to payoff that promise at the end of Justice League. They *already* weren't going to follow any prominent Snyder-verse threads. The Snyder Cut was it, and all plans were to keep the same actors in their roles, yes, but to tell solo stories, more or less, with those characters going forward, albeit with some criss-crossing and team-ups here and there. Maybe there would have been another Justice League movie four or five years down the line, but there was nothing planned. And that was the issue... there was no real plan to speak of. They were all just winging it; a few different factions of producers, all with competing interests, haphazardly throwing sh*t at the wall, saying, "Why don't we try this?!" Hence the need for someone - Gunn and Safran, thankfully - to finally come in with some leadership, along with a concrete plan/singular vision.

This is why I'd like to see Braniac as the main villain.

They could also go a bit on the nose and go with Mongul, who was created by the same guy as Thanos, and War World. A recent Superman comic run just did a Mongul story that was really good. Superman went to War World to help the slaves lead a rebellion, but the slaves took pride in being slaves so Superman had to win them over without his powers. He couldn't just go in and punch his way through the problem.

The graphic novel and the animated movie are great, but I would love a live-action Superman: Red Son

I know people are dispirited and wondering what the point of DC's 2023 slate is but I have repeatedly heard SHAZAM 2, THE FLASH, and BLUE BEETLE are varying degrees of good to great.

— ViewerAnon (@ViewerAnon) December 15, 2022

If you're a Flash or Blue Beetle fan, do you want a good-but-dead film/franchise now, or a more "purposeful" one that's part of a greater narrative someday down the road?

It's almost like… I liked Luke Cage, but he's a dead character who will never interact with the Thunderbolts or New Avengers. He shot his shot too soon and may never be seen again.

Does Blue Beetle in 2023 mean no Blue Beetles for 10 years? Or can he be done again in 2028 without feeling totally redundant?

I do wonder if there's any room to just pull a J.K. Simmons and cast the same previous actor as the same previous character, but in a completely different universe, and not even attempt to explain it away as the multiverse or whatever.

That said, to answer your question, no, this many years/decades into the superhero, I don't think people would care one bit if they recast the character in the Gunn/Safran universe so soon after the last one.

The Porkchop Express said:

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The graphic novel and the animated movie are great, but I would love a live-action Superman: Red Son

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Red Son is the best Superman representation out there.

Not just a reboot/recast, but like… is a 2nd take on the character just the same thing from a few years ago? Would the reboot be fresh or is there just kinda the one origin and we all kinda remember it still?

I'm thinking like Spider-Man into Amazing Spider-Man. It's pretty much the same thing but this one dates a blonde and skateboards instead.

jeffk said:

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The Porkchop Express said:

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The graphic novel and the animated movie are great, but I would love a live-action Superman: Red Son

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Red Son is the best Superman representation out there.

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How can you say that when Kingdom Come exists?

I bet Cavill comes back for a Kingdom Come or Crisis on Infinite Earths event

The Porkchop Express said:

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The graphic novel and the animated movie are great, but I would love a live-action Superman: Red Son

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The one off Superman stories are by far the most interesting properties to make into features (that I've read anyway). Same for Batman really, would love to see a true Year One, The Dark Knight Returns, Hush, Arkham Asylum (as a horror film), etc.

AgfromHOU said:

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At least the new Superman movie won't be an origin movie

He's not meeting the major characters for the first time, either. He's merely younger.

— James Gunn (@JamesGunn) December 15, 2022

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It's a DC / Boss Baby mashup

fig96 said:

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The Porkchop Express said:

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The graphic novel and the animated movie are great, but I would love a live-action Superman: Red Son

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The one off Superman stories are by far the most interesting properties to make into features (that I've read anyway). Same for Batman really, would love to see a true Year One, The Dark Knight Returns, Hush, Arkham Asylum (as a horror film), etc.

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Yep, it's about the only way to make Superman interesting to me because of his power level.

Aggies76 said:

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Could not agree with you more Porkchop. Cavill was the perfect Superman and they wasted him in bad movies. I doubt that we will see a more iconic version of the Man of Steel.

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Same boat here. Agree with everything you and Porkchop wrote. What a friggin bummer.