Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
Politics of the crash.
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Last: 1 day ago by halfastros81
Except it appears the pilot was a Trans and the ATC Tower was understaffed in part because they have been pushing for DEI hires. It appears Trump knew this before the PC but the trickle out of information so far looks like it's going to support his statements.Captn_Ag05 said:
Trump being Trump today with his comments. This is the type of thing that has blowback and got him bogged down the first time. I am sure Susie Wiles is pulling her hair out.
Trump is going to be Trump, the key for him this go round is to stay on offense and not worry about trying to curry favor with the press, that was his downfall last time. He just needs to keep moving and moving fast so they can't focus on a target.
"The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help."
Ronald Reagan
Ronald Reagan
You must be new hereaTmAg said:
Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
And the bolded part has already been debunkedaggie93 said:Except it appears the pilot was a Trans and the ATC Tower was understaffed in part because they have been pushing for DEI hires. It appears Trump knew this before the PC but the trickle out of information so far looks like it's going to support his statements.Captn_Ag05 said:
Trump being Trump today with his comments. This is the type of thing that has blowback and got him bogged down the first time. I am sure Susie Wiles is pulling her hair out.
Trump is going to be Trump, the key for him this go round is to stay on offense and not worry about trying to curry favor with the press, that was his downfall last time. He just needs to keep moving and moving fast so they can't focus on a target.
Do you really want a trans person pilot? Seems like they might have mental issues
aTmAg said:
Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
Probably because we saw two planes hit large buildings in NY and can't understand how the Blackhawk pilot didn't see it.
Pilot, Co-Pilot and a crew chief.TAMU1990 said:
There were 3 pilots correct? All doing different roles?
aTmAg said:
Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
The chopper was going straight. The pilot had to be looking straight ahead. The plane it crashed into had lights flashing so it could be seen by others.
It's hard not to see the obvious.
Or, could the pilot of the helicopter been passed out and didn't see he was flying into a plane?
There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former begets knowledge, the later ignorance. Hippocrates
Fully understand those necessities for training, Simulators or flying around less densely populated areas (not to mention all of the nearby restricted airspace will not be good replicators.Quote:
Where else are you supposed to do it? Part of a checkride is to assess your ability to complete the mission. If your mission is VIP transport around DC, then that's what you have to do
What is not absolutely necessary and can be controlled is the civilian commercial traffic volume at DCA. Need to adjust those runways as well. Shut down 33, for instance. Too short, approach angle after lining up for a straight shot coming down one side of the Potomac for runway 1 to then change to a different angle of approach crossing to the other side of the Potomac raises another question for me.
Outer markers for 33. Where are those located? I assume the CRJ went out to those before turning back in to line up? Or being a smaller fixed wing, shorter bank to turn inside the outer marker?
ts5641 said:I can't go down that path yet. Too many variables.No Spin Ag said:Jbob04 said:
Tin foil hat [ON] OFFLook how much time the helicopter has as it flies directly into the Commercial Airliner.
— Concerned Citizen (@BGatesIsaPyscho) January 30, 2025
It’s hard to fathom that this was just simply an accident. pic.twitter.com/FyfjgOb3jk
Okay, it looks like that was intentional.
What do we know about the helicopter pilot?
I get that, but just by the looks of it, it is a possibility and can't be taken off the table. IMO
There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former begets knowledge, the later ignorance. Hippocrates
My brother flew military for 19 years before he retired. Now he flies GA aircraft for fun on weekends. Both he and I are shocked how hard it is to see other aircraft down low with all the ground clutter. I imagine it's even more difficult at night.
Debunked. My bad.
Here is the channel that is good at pulling all the at communications.
They seemed to handle it normally, helo reported the plane was in sight and requested to maintain visual separation. ATC got a tcas alert and radio the pilot who still asked for visual separation and could see. Not sure what all will be found but seems like with the dark distance or timing was miss juged possibly where he thought the plane would be past by the time they were there or they would be under.
They seemed to handle it normally, helo reported the plane was in sight and requested to maintain visual separation. ATC got a tcas alert and radio the pilot who still asked for visual separation and could see. Not sure what all will be found but seems like with the dark distance or timing was miss juged possibly where he thought the plane would be past by the time they were there or they would be under.
But this plane wasn't "down low" in relation to the helicopter.aTmAg said:
My brother flew military for 19 years before he retired. Now he flies GA aircraft for fun on weekends. Both he and I are shocked how hard it is to see other aircraft down low with all the ground clutter. I imagine it's even more difficult at night.
No Spin Ag said:aTmAg said:
Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
The chopper was going straight. The pilot had to be looking straight ahead. The plane it crashed into had lights flashing so it could be seen by others.
It's hard not to see the obvious.
Or, could the pilot of the helicopter been passed out and didn't see he was flying into a plane?
If they had night vision goggles on, your field of view is reduced by about 40%. Plus bright lights can wash out your view completely.
Not hard to make that jump on not seeing the plane if they were under NV conditions (or the pilot was looking at console, map/nav, or something else).
Because they were focusing on a different, larger aircraft straight ahead. I guess you guys have never flown anything before.
WBAP is saying an ATC was allowed to leave his shift early not long before the crash. Really sounds like staffing is going to be a significant piece of this puzzle, at least on the ATC side.
As with most aviation crashes, Swiss Cheese is lining up.
As with most aviation crashes, Swiss Cheese is lining up.
World's best pilot if true.ts5641 said:I can't go down that path yet. Too many variables.No Spin Ag said:Jbob04 said:
Tin foil hat [ON] OFFLook how much time the helicopter has as it flies directly into the Commercial Airliner.
— Concerned Citizen (@BGatesIsaPyscho) January 30, 2025
It’s hard to fathom that this was just simply an accident. pic.twitter.com/FyfjgOb3jk
Okay, it looks like that was intentional.
What do we know about the helicopter pilot?
I would expect better situational awareness than that. Maybe my expectations of military pilots is too high. CRM training by ATC and the Blackhawk would have prevented this.
Agreed. That wasn't a solo flight. One kamikazepilot would get taken out by the others.aTmAg said:
Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
You guys are INSANE if you think this was intentional. Both pilots didn't see each other because it's HARD TO SEE. And the helicopter didn't have ADS-B. You guys think they were both in on the conspiracy? To the death? Really?No Spin Ag said:aTmAg said:
Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
The chopper was going straight. The pilot had to be looking straight ahead. The plane it crashed into had lights flashing so it could be seen by others.
It's hard not to see the obvious.
Or, could the pilot of the helicopter been passed out and didn't see he was flying into a plane?
One year ago, Republicans stood before Congress and stated that there was shortage of air, traffic control operators, and that the DEI policies and workshops needed to go. They wanted money to go for hiring people to work in air traffic control that had nothing to do with DEI… pic.twitter.com/U303pK1roy
— Insurrection Barbie (@DefiyantlyFree) January 30, 2025
"The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help."
Ronald Reagan
Ronald Reagan
aTmAg said:You guys are INSANE if you think this was intentional. Both pilots didn't see each other because it's HARD TO SEE. And the helicopter didn't have ADS-B. You guys think they were both in on the conspiracy? To the death? Really?No Spin Ag said:aTmAg said:
Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
The chopper was going straight. The pilot had to be looking straight ahead. The plane it crashed into had lights flashing so it could be seen by others.
It's hard not to see the obvious.
Or, could the pilot of the helicopter been passed out and didn't see he was flying into a plane?
No, just the helicopter. Or it could just be complete incompetence on the part of the helicopter pilot, but regardless, the helicopter has a lot of time to not keep going straight at the plane yet still does.
I'd imagine the Blackhawk pilots are trained to use evasive maneuvers to not hit other aircraft in the sky, no?
There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former begets knowledge, the later ignorance. Hippocrates
Reports this morning stating there was another incident same scenario earlier in the night week. Passenger flight changed course, circled twice and landed after other Blackhawk passed.
FTAG 2000 said:No Spin Ag said:aTmAg said:
Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
The chopper was going straight. The pilot had to be looking straight ahead. The plane it crashed into had lights flashing so it could be seen by others.
It's hard not to see the obvious.
Or, could the pilot of the helicopter been passed out and didn't see he was flying into a plane?
If they had night vision goggles on, your field of view is reduced by about 40%. Plus bright lights can wash out your view completely.
Not hard to make that jump on not seeing the plane if they were under NV conditions (or the pilot was looking at console, map/nav, or something else).
There's only one person in those helicopters? I ask because I don't know, so any info help.
There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former begets knowledge, the later ignorance. Hippocrates
I believe they were flying with NVG's, pretty standard night ops flight training.aTmAg said:
My brother flew military for 19 years before he retired. Now he flies GA aircraft for fun on weekends. Both he and I are shocked how hard it is to see other aircraft down low with all the ground clutter. I imagine it's even more difficult at night.
^^^^^This.FTAG 2000 said:No Spin Ag said:aTmAg said:
Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
The chopper was going straight. The pilot had to be looking straight ahead. The plane it crashed into had lights flashing so it could be seen by others.
It's hard not to see the obvious.
Or, could the pilot of the helicopter been passed out and didn't see he was flying into a plane?
If they had night vision goggles on, your field of view is reduced by about 40%. Plus bright lights can wash out your view completely.
Not hard to make that jump on not seeing the plane if they were under NV conditions (or the pilot was looking at console, map/nav, or something else).
If the airline pilot saw him, then he WOULD have turned to avoid him. He wouldn't have just flew into him because "he was supposed to move". That shows how hard it is to see and why ATC tells everybody about traffic. This pilot thought ATC was taking about another plane. Not the smaller closer one. Most military aircraft don't have ADS-B. That is much more to blame here than anything.No Spin Ag said:aTmAg said:You guys are INSANE if you think this was intentional. Both pilots didn't see each other because it's HARD TO SEE. And the helicopter didn't have ADS-B. You guys think they were both in on the conspiracy? To the death? Really?No Spin Ag said:aTmAg said:
Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
The chopper was going straight. The pilot had to be looking straight ahead. The plane it crashed into had lights flashing so it could be seen by others.
It's hard not to see the obvious.
Or, could the pilot of the helicopter been passed out and didn't see he was flying into a plane?
No, just the helicopter. Or it could just be complete incompetence on the part of the helicopter pilot, but regardless, the helicopter has a lot of time to not keep going straight at the plane yet still does.
I'd imagine the Blackhawk pilots are trained to use evasive maneuvers to not hit other aircraft in the sky, no?
I've read claims that the NVG's used by army aviators make vision akin to 'looking through toilet paper.'
This is still the Occam's razor simplest answer, imho. That neither the experienced pilot, nor co-pilot getting trained to use them, saw/recognized the plane they hit. The only real politics then would be why staffing was abnormal/reduced in the control tower, but that's really only a tangential impact to the pilot error.
This is still the Occam's razor simplest answer, imho. That neither the experienced pilot, nor co-pilot getting trained to use them, saw/recognized the plane they hit. The only real politics then would be why staffing was abnormal/reduced in the control tower, but that's really only a tangential impact to the pilot error.
A crew of 3 on this oneNo Spin Ag said:FTAG 2000 said:No Spin Ag said:aTmAg said:
Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
The chopper was going straight. The pilot had to be looking straight ahead. The plane it crashed into had lights flashing so it could be seen by others.
It's hard not to see the obvious.
Or, could the pilot of the helicopter been passed out and didn't see he was flying into a plane?
If they had night vision goggles on, your field of view is reduced by about 40%. Plus bright lights can wash out your view completely.
Not hard to make that jump on not seeing the plane if they were under NV conditions (or the pilot was looking at console, map/nav, or something else).
There's only one person in those helicopters? I ask because I don't know, so any info help.
aTmAg said:If the airline pilot saw him, then he WOULD have turned to avoid him. He wouldn't have just flew into him because "he was supposed to move". That shows how hard it is to see and why ATC tells everybody about traffic. This pilot thought ATC was taking about another plane. Not the smaller closer one. Most military aircraft don't have ADS-B. That is much more to blame here than anything.No Spin Ag said:aTmAg said:You guys are INSANE if you think this was intentional. Both pilots didn't see each other because it's HARD TO SEE. And the helicopter didn't have ADS-B. You guys think they were both in on the conspiracy? To the death? Really?No Spin Ag said:aTmAg said:
Why the hell do you guys think it was intentional? Looks to me like they didn't see it.
The chopper was going straight. The pilot had to be looking straight ahead. The plane it crashed into had lights flashing so it could be seen by others.
It's hard not to see the obvious.
Or, could the pilot of the helicopter been passed out and didn't see he was flying into a plane?
No, just the helicopter. Or it could just be complete incompetence on the part of the helicopter pilot, but regardless, the helicopter has a lot of time to not keep going straight at the plane yet still does.
I'd imagine the Blackhawk pilots are trained to use evasive maneuvers to not hit other aircraft in the sky, no?
A former military and now private jet pilot for the past 20 years called into Clay & Buck yesterday. He said he has flown in and out of Reagan, Teterbero and other major airports up there "hundreds of times". According to him, all Helos in the DC area are required to have ADSB due to the high volume of air traffic. No idea if that is accurate or not but the guy came across as someone who knew what he was talking about. FWIW.
And like much of the time, "X" is wrong, especially when it is coming from people there with obvious political agendas.MaroonStain said:
Hitting X this morning, lead pilot of Blackhawk was trans and wrote a letter about Trump and DEI a couple of days before incident.
The person accused of being the pilot has been confirmed alive by news outlets, and is still active on Facebook.
"If you will not fight for right when you can easily win without blood shed; if you will not fight when your victory is sure and not too costly; you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all the odds against you and only a precarious chance of survival. There may even be a worse case. You may have to fight when there is no hope of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves." - Sir Winston Churchill
A lot of things will continue to come out on this but that would still make it was a female pilot which would still be DEI.Charpie said:And the bolded part has already been debunkedaggie93 said:Except it appears the pilot was a Trans and the ATC Tower was understaffed in part because they have been pushing for DEI hires. It appears Trump knew this before the PC but the trickle out of information so far looks like it's going to support his statements.Captn_Ag05 said:
Trump being Trump today with his comments. This is the type of thing that has blowback and got him bogged down the first time. I am sure Susie Wiles is pulling her hair out.
Trump is going to be Trump, the key for him this go round is to stay on offense and not worry about trying to curry favor with the press, that was his downfall last time. He just needs to keep moving and moving fast so they can't focus on a target.
"The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help."
Ronald Reagan
Ronald Reagan
Democrats continue to lie and politicize anything they can around the crash.
Politics:
More at the thread which is pretty long.
And it's ok after the woe's of the past 4 years which 2020 wrought to go down a thread online and be skeptical of a narrative, or storyline for a few hours to figure it out. The politics of these agencies and our government staffing have impacted our safety not just in air travel, but in many other regards.
FACT CHECK: Air traffic controllers are exempt from the hiring freeze AND had Trump hired a new controller on day one they wouldn’t have been trained in time to help the poor souls on that flight. Rep Jasmine seems to be admitting Biden’s lack of hiring is actually to blame. https://t.co/iYZACQL0YI pic.twitter.com/2aouAniLQE
— @amuse (@amuse) January 31, 2025
Politics:
Huerta announced plans to “transform [the FAA] into a more diverse and inclusive workplace that reflects, understands, and relates to the diverse customers.”
— Patrick Casey (@restoreorderusa) January 30, 2025
In other words, the FAA was hiring too many white guys!
You’ll never guess what his proposed solution was… pic.twitter.com/ptpirhGktk
If it didn’t still exist in some capacity, why did Rep. Brian Babin (R-Texas) include a provision in the 2023 $4 billion FAA authorization bill to remove the “biographical assessment?”
— Patrick Casey (@restoreorderusa) January 30, 2025
Regardless of the BQ, as we'll see, the FAA still prioritizes diversity over merit. pic.twitter.com/KI3pRRbMql
The NYT reports that air traffic controllers have been sleeping, drinking, and getting high on the job. Some have even been violent at the workplace.
— Patrick Casey (@restoreorderusa) January 30, 2025
Many ATCs are simply unqualified. It isn't just that they're understaffed! pic.twitter.com/PAd5oQYYsv
More at the thread which is pretty long.
And it's ok after the woe's of the past 4 years which 2020 wrought to go down a thread online and be skeptical of a narrative, or storyline for a few hours to figure it out. The politics of these agencies and our government staffing have impacted our safety not just in air travel, but in many other regards.
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