I know all of this feels unprecedented, and it kinda is. But it also kinda isn't. There was a fairly large chunk of either pro-German sentiment or German apologists all the way up when the U.S. entered the war. The American ambassador to Britain was hated overseas because of his knobslobbering of the Nazis. Putin could begin a rampage across Europe and people here would still hold their high ground. The only way youd get a real consensus is if he attacked an American military installation, which Putin is smart enough to never do. He wants to take the Bloc without having to worry about American deterrence. If he can get America to essentially cede territory and remove troops (which I don't believe Trump would do), that puts a much larger portion of Europe in play.

Quote:

---

There are still sooooooo many LIV people who still blindly believe we just shipped over $200BN in cash on pallets and said good luck! It became my litmus actually on whether I would even engage someone on this overall topic. If someone didn't or couldn't understand the basics of the aid packages and how they worked, it wasn't worth anyone's time trying to engage further.

---

Exact same for me. Many of the pro Russian posters have basically believed we have just sent pallets of cash for Zelenskyy to buy Lambos with.

Take the L and move on bro......

Zelenskyy before he became a CIA plant for regime change in Ukraine. pic.twitter.com/4ggpz5SCO0

— Jessica 🇺🇸 (@RealJessica05) February 19, 2025

BusterAg said:

---

aTmAg said:

---

aTmAg said:

---

Regarding the war itself, Ukraine is no demon at all. Not even close.

Um, they were the chief money laundering arm of the democratic party until about 29 days ago. The people might not be endlessly corrupt, but their government is.

---

Which is why I said "regarding the war itself". Which is the topic of this thread.

Quote:

---

I don't know how you can say that with any authority. Like I said before, it was absolutely a consideration. Putin covets Kiev. Was it 100% the reason for the invasion? It is a pretty messy conflict. Trying to assign white and black hats doesn't really work.

---

I don't care what Putin considers before invading another nation. If he did so without being attacked first, then he is wrong. PERIOD. Treating his "consideration" as legit is like saying Ted Bundy had a legit complaint against women and that it wasn't "black and white".

---

Again, the Cuban Missile Crisis is a great contra example.

I do not believe that JFK would have been wearing the black hat had he bombed and invaded Cuba. I do not believe that Obama was wearing a black hat when he invaded Pakistan to take out Bin Laden. I do not believe that G.W.Bush or Colon Powell were wearing black hats when we invaded Iraq (but, I do believe that Cheyne was).

Your litmus test "being attacked first" fails.

---

The Cuban missile crisis is a TERRIBLE example. Again, those missile were FIRST STRIKE nukes. That is like somebody pointing a gun at your head rather than merely them strapping a gun to their hip.

Bin Laden ATTACKED us and Saddam was violating the terms of his previous surrender (in which he attacked Kuwait). All of these are in RESPONSE to violent action. Putin invading Ukraine was not.

74OA said:

---

At least one Republican has found his spine.

"In a post on his X handle on Wednesday, the former Vice President told Trump that the road to peace must be built on the truth. Pence said: "Mr President, Ukraine did not 'start' this war. Russia launched an unprovoked and brutal invasion, claiming hundreds of thousands of lives. The road to peace must be built on the truth."

PENCE

---

Dude. Read the room.

Pence?

What does Dick Cheney think about the war in Ukraine?

BusterAg said:

---

74OA said:

---

At least one Republican has found his spine.

"In a post on his X handle on Wednesday, the former Vice President told Trump that the road to peace must be built on the truth. Pence said: "Mr President, Ukraine did not 'start' this war. Russia launched an unprovoked and brutal invasion, claiming hundreds of thousands of lives. The road to peace must be built on the truth."

PENCE

---

Dude. Read the room.

Pence?

What does Dick Cheney think about the war in Ukraine?

---

Pence sucks, but he is right about that particular point.

Eliminatus said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

sanangelo said:

---

This might be the most braindead statement I have ever seen be made by a sitting U.S. President. Calling Zelensky a dictator while someone like Putin has been in power now for over 25 years is some next level stupidity. This is the President of the United States on one of his… pic.twitter.com/d5cLZQOe2q

— OSINTdefender (@sentdefender) February 19, 2025

---

People from group A read Trump's statement and say: "Holy crap, he called Z a dictator"

People from group B read Trump's statement and say: "Holy crap, even Z says that half the aid is missing! And he is asking for more?"

There are more people in group B than there are in group A.

And that is why Trump is POTUS, and not Harris.

---

Wrong. Absolutely wrong. And when it was corrected, the right media didn't even bother whispering the truth after shouting the lie.

Z said Ukraine did not receive over half of the aid earmarked. And that is correct. Something like 60 to 70% of said aid never leaves our shores. Especially those first big packages. Which were used to build up our infrastructure here. Ukraine never saw that money. They were never going to see that money. That's not how it works.

There are still sooooooo many LIV people who still blindly believe we just shipped over $200BN in cash on pallets and said good luck! It became my litmus actually on whether I would even engage someone on this overall topic. If someone didn't or couldn't understand the basics of the aid packages and how they worked, it wasn't worth anyone's time trying to engage further.

There probably is missing money somewhere. I'd count on it even. But $100BN+ is a joke and has moved from a misunderstanding to an outright lie at this point.

---

So, you trust Ukraine and USAID more? These are not paragons of virtue that you are talking about here.

No telling where that money went. Did disbursements from the Department of Treasury to the Ukraine banks even have a memo line that tied the payments to the aid allocation?

I case so much less about this war than I care about the federal government stealing taxpayer money.

I am super pumped about what is coming out later this week. Musk must be up to something really good for Trump to distract the news cycle so well with this stuff.

aTmAg said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

74OA said:

---

At least one Republican has found his spine.

"In a post on his X handle on Wednesday, the former Vice President told Trump that the road to peace must be built on the truth. Pence said: "Mr President, Ukraine did not 'start' this war. Russia launched an unprovoked and brutal invasion, claiming hundreds of thousands of lives. The road to peace must be built on the truth."

PENCE

---

Dude. Read the room.

Pence?

What does Dick Cheney think about the war in Ukraine?

---

Pence sucks, but he is right about that particular point.

---

Well Bernie Sandars voted no on aide to Ukraine, but you sure don't see me trotting out his name to defend Trump's policies.

BusterAg said:

---

Gordo14 said:

---

Teslag said:

---

Same reason he said Zelenskyy has a 4% approval rating. Love the guy, voted for him 3 times and would again if I could, but he sometimes says some really really stupid *****

---

He's not just saying stupid ***** This is a very calculated effort to realign America with Russia. I know you're struggling because you are not the average MAGA bot on this forum... You're struggling to accept the reality because you're invested in him. You didn't see this in Trump. But it'd always been there. We were just lucky enough that it mattered a whole lot less in his first term.

Over the next few weeks, we will pull American troops out of NATO countries east of Germany (Donald Trump is so strong - funny joke), the MAGA algorithm will be flooded with anti-NATO and pro Russia content (a lot of emphasis on conservative values of Russia), peace talks will collapse and Trump will blame Ukraine and Europe, Trump will hold hands with Putin and Xi in Moscow on May 9tn, and the Republican party will further it's descent into mindless collapse behind Trump.

If you're not a slave to this algorithm, you'll be very confused. Many, like teslag are too invested to take it seriously. Some of you are waking up to just how awful the global security environment is going to be. Russia will challenge NATOs Article V due to Trump's weakness, and a Chinese invasion of Taiwan (2027) is much more likely today than it was even a month ago.

I wish this wasn't so predictable. I've basically been right about everything in regards to Trump so far. But even I am shocked at how bad he's been.

---

There are many interests in this conflict:

1) Russia
2) Ukraine
3) Corrupt democrat politicians that need their money laundered
4) Corrupt GOP politicians that need their defense contractor buddies taken care of
5) The people of Ukraine
6) The people of Russia
7) The American tax payer.

Trump decided to side with #7, all others can figure it out amongst themselves. That's why he won the presidency, and why Vance will be your next president.

This new line of rhetoric going around that Trump is aligning with Russia because he is pushing for peace is simply a false dichotomy. You can be for the American people without really giving a damn about the other 6.

Take that back to your discord server and ask your overlords to try again.

---

This is a solid explanation of America first. I just can't figure out why it's such a foreign concept to… Americans.

nortex97 said:

---

Quote:

---

Ukraine is saving us.

---

More hilarity. Thx.

---

They are certainly saving US soldiers from sitting in a trench in Europe (not that that has ever happened before). Instead we are sending weapons that were all designed to defend against Russia most of which are likely useless in any future conflict with China. If we get in a missile, tank and artillery war with China god help us.


Think about this. Every US soldier who has been killed in action since WWII was killed by a Russian weapon (Korea, Viet Nam, every single conflict in the Middle East). Consider that when you are thinking about who our enemies are and who our allies are.

Thays not true.

Many have been killed by usa made weapons

Teslag said:

---

Same reason he said Zelenskyy has a 4% approval rating. Love the guy, voted for him 3 times and would again if I could, but he sometimes says some really really stupid *****

---

Concern noted.

rootube said:

---

nortex97 said:

---

Quote:

---

Ukraine is saving us.

---

More hilarity. Thx.

---

They are certainly saving US soldiers from sitting in a trench in Europe (not that that has ever happened before). Instead we are sending weapons that were all designed to defend against Russia most of which are likely useless in any future conflict with China. If we get in a missile, tank and artillery war with China god help us.


Think about this. Every US soldier who has been killed in action since WWII was killed by a Russian weapon (Korea, Viet Nam, every single conflict in the Middle East). Consider that when you are thinking about who our enemies are and who our allies are.

---

So those other countries know good weapons when they see one. Maybe if the firearms industry in America made a better weapon that's cheap and easy to care for, those countries would us it.

And by the way, it was the CIA who gave the Middle East a ton of those Russia weapons.

Picture is worth a thousand words.

He's always been an intel agency cutout. Not a single ounce of genuine in him as the leader of a country.

BusterAg said:

---

Eliminatus said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

sanangelo said:

---

This might be the most braindead statement I have ever seen be made by a sitting U.S. President. Calling Zelensky a dictator while someone like Putin has been in power now for over 25 years is some next level stupidity. This is the President of the United States on one of his… pic.twitter.com/d5cLZQOe2q

— OSINTdefender (@sentdefender) February 19, 2025

---

People from group A read Trump's statement and say: "Holy crap, he called Z a dictator"

People from group B read Trump's statement and say: "Holy crap, even Z says that half the aid is missing! And he is asking for more?"

There are more people in group B than there are in group A.

And that is why Trump is POTUS, and not Harris.

---

Wrong. Absolutely wrong. And when it was corrected, the right media didn't even bother whispering the truth after shouting the lie.

Z said Ukraine did not receive over half of the aid earmarked. And that is correct. Something like 60 to 70% of said aid never leaves our shores. Especially those first big packages. Which were used to build up our infrastructure here. Ukraine never saw that money. They were never going to see that money. That's not how it works.

There are still sooooooo many LIV people who still blindly believe we just shipped over $200BN in cash on pallets and said good luck! It became my litmus actually on whether I would even engage someone on this overall topic. If someone didn't or couldn't understand the basics of the aid packages and how they worked, it wasn't worth anyone's time trying to engage further.

There probably is missing money somewhere. I'd count on it even. But $100BN+ is a joke and has moved from a misunderstanding to an outright lie at this point.

---

So, you trust Ukraine and USAID more? These are not paragons of virtue that you are talking about here.

---

Versus f'n Donald Trump?! Is this a joke?

USAID is an independent agency that has provided humanitarian assistance around the world for more than 60 years and undergoes rigorous evaluations and audits. Specifically, there are two types of evaluations performed independently on most large USAID programs: performance evaluations and impact evaluations.

• From the very beginning, USAID releases what is known as an RFP (Request for Proposals, if a contract) or RFA (Request for Application, if a grant or cooperative agreement). Within those opportunities, USAID will clearly list a budget range-- say between 15-20M with approximately 5M of the total amount set aside for additional grants under contracts to even smaller, more specified, localized implementing partners.
• Then the various implementing partners all submit concepts/program ideas/activities that are aligned with the needs of the RFP and the goals that USAID has set, with budget line items to them. Internally, USAID then deliberates on a few things-- the technical soundness of what's being proposed, the cost effectiveness (down to travel line items in say, Year Three), the personnel being suggested, and the evaluation metrics being used. You get extra points for using US small businesses, especially if they're US service-disabled, veteran-owned small businesses. They also review the concepts with the programming already happening in country AND the priorities of the USG in said country-- Nigeria, for example, a lot of work focused on food security, creating a stable market for US agribusinesses, and counteracting Chinese involvement in infrastructure via Belt and Road initiative.
• USAID then selects that concept AND the budget that goes along with it. There's an announcement of the awardee. The awardee and USAID (typically the contracting officer and a technical officer) then begin to negotiate a 30-60 day project launch. During project launch, salary line items are finalized, activity line items are finalized, project goals are negotiated then finalized, etc. Per opportunity, we are allowed to move money laterally (so money allotted to Y1 can be moved to Y3, etc.) but we cannot move money from say...salaries to activities without a contractual amendment. Those take months, if they ever get approved.
• Every quarter of every year of the project, we write reports to USAID. Those reports detail, thoroughly, our progress along agreed upon project goals and the corresponding budget expenditure, per activity. Those reports, once read and discussed with USAID, are then uploaded to DEC (the development clearinghouse), which is now offline. The politically...."interesting" ones get sent to certain members of Congress.
• Audits and evaluations are done by a neutral third party. Typically it's done by a neutral third party staffed by people who are not host country nationals and the auditing firm is decided upon using the exact same process as what I detailed in lines 1-3.

USAID local missions not only have budgets, they also work in collaboration with host countries and the respective US embassies to make sure their priorities are aligned. Furthermore, every USAID local mission has what is called a "small business utilization" metric, which is where they must meet a certain $ value of US small business contracts. Last year, USAID gave something like 1B USD in awards to US small businesses.

But you would believe an actual felon who has never released his tax documents, actively engaged in a crypto scam, cheated on multiple wives, known liar, and is obviously self interested in telling people things that only benefit his narrative.

VDH from this past Sunday. Go to the 50 minute point where he lays out the parameters of what he believes Trump's peace deal will be.

Krombopulos Michael said:

---

Picture is worth a thousand words.

He's always been an intel agency cutout. Not a single ounce of genuine in him as the leader of a country.

---

Like this picture of Reagan performing as well? How did he fair against russia?

texagbeliever said:

---

titan said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

aTmAg said:

---

(Countries have every right to pursue and join whatever alliances they want. Nobody has the right to invade them because of it.)

---

What is this nonsense?

Where did you come up with this "right"? Who is responsible for enforcing this "right"?

If Canada formed an alliance with China you can bet America wouldn't hesitate to invade because of it.

---

Bingo. This is not about rights but about how nations predictably react when they have sufficient power and sense of security risk to do so. Diplomacy deals with reality, not as things should be. Thats for philosophers and priests.

That said, Ukraine is a special case. WE asked them to disarm their arsenal in 1994 in return for guarantees. WE should have told Russia BEFORE invading --- "you remember what happened to Saddam? We are not going to let you invade Ukraine, we have that 1994 pledge remember? So don't. And you can't say its our fault and act of war because we are telling you now and you know about the 1994 arrangement. So back off that mobilization and lets discuss things."

But the reason that didn't happen is because Biden's admin were crooks, theives, bad actors. They didn't want to prevent it. They didn't care, as long as their criminal enterprises and laundering in Ukraine could remain obscured and concealed.

---

I'd argue Ukraine shouldn't have ever agree to disarmament. I would wager that Ukraine likely only agreed because we paid off the right people to agree.
America should never be in the business of making countries weak because we will then "protect" them. It is a foolish and shortlived vision that is sold as being altruistic but in reality is at best a paper tiger.

---

I'm guessing you were born in the 80's or later. Ukraine and the U.S. didn't have much choice. When the USSR fell apart, Ukraine immediately became the world's third largest nuclear power. They had no way to maintain those weapons and didn't want them. The Americans had to step in to make sure that nukes didn't end up scattered all over the globe.

BusterAg said:

---

aTmAg said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

74OA said:

---

At least one Republican has found his spine.

"In a post on his X handle on Wednesday, the former Vice President told Trump that the road to peace must be built on the truth. Pence said: "Mr President, Ukraine did not 'start' this war. Russia launched an unprovoked and brutal invasion, claiming hundreds of thousands of lives. The road to peace must be built on the truth."

PENCE

---

Dude. Read the room.

Pence?

What does Dick Cheney think about the war in Ukraine?

---

Pence sucks, but he is right about that particular point.

---

Well Bernie Sandars voted no on aide to Ukraine, but you sure don't see me trotting out his name to defend Trump's policies.

---

I have no doubt that 90% of that aid was lining democrat pockets. Reagan sent small fraction of that to Afghanistan and those goat herders used it to kick Soviet ass in only 3 years back when the Soviets were still a super power.

I do think we had an obligation to help Ukraine based on our our past agreements, but not in the way Biden did it. We should have done it in a Reagan-esq way.

Hullabaloonatic said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

Eliminatus said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

sanangelo said:

---

This might be the most braindead statement I have ever seen be made by a sitting U.S. President. Calling Zelensky a dictator while someone like Putin has been in power now for over 25 years is some next level stupidity. This is the President of the United States on one of his… pic.twitter.com/d5cLZQOe2q

— OSINTdefender (@sentdefender) February 19, 2025

---

People from group A read Trump's statement and say: "Holy crap, he called Z a dictator"

People from group B read Trump's statement and say: "Holy crap, even Z says that half the aid is missing! And he is asking for more?"

There are more people in group B than there are in group A.

And that is why Trump is POTUS, and not Harris.

---

Wrong. Absolutely wrong. And when it was corrected, the right media didn't even bother whispering the truth after shouting the lie.

Z said Ukraine did not receive over half of the aid earmarked. And that is correct. Something like 60 to 70% of said aid never leaves our shores. Especially those first big packages. Which were used to build up our infrastructure here. Ukraine never saw that money. They were never going to see that money. That's not how it works.

There are still sooooooo many LIV people who still blindly believe we just shipped over $200BN in cash on pallets and said good luck! It became my litmus actually on whether I would even engage someone on this overall topic. If someone didn't or couldn't understand the basics of the aid packages and how they worked, it wasn't worth anyone's time trying to engage further.

There probably is missing money somewhere. I'd count on it even. But $100BN+ is a joke and has moved from a misunderstanding to an outright lie at this point.

---

So, you trust Ukraine and USAID more? These are not paragons of virtue that you are talking about here.

---

Versus f'n Donald Trump?! Is this a joke?

USAID is an independent agency that has provided humanitarian assistance around the world for more than 60 years and undergoes rigorous evaluations and audits. Specifically, there are two types of evaluations performed independently on most large USAID programs: performance evaluations and impact evaluations.

• From the very beginning, USAID releases what is known as an RFP (Request for Proposals, if a contract) or RFA (Request for Application, if a grant or cooperative agreement). Within those opportunities, USAID will clearly list a budget range-- say between 15-20M with approximately 5M of the total amount set aside for additional grants under contracts to even smaller, more specified, localized implementing partners.
• Then the various implementing partners all submit concepts/program ideas/activities that are aligned with the needs of the RFP and the goals that USAID has set, with budget line items to them. Internally, USAID then deliberates on a few things-- the technical soundness of what's being proposed, the cost effectiveness (down to travel line items in say, Year Three), the personnel being suggested, and the evaluation metrics being used. You get extra points for using US small businesses, especially if they're US service-disabled, veteran-owned small businesses. They also review the concepts with the programming already happening in country AND the priorities of the USG in said country-- Nigeria, for example, a lot of work focused on food security, creating a stable market for US agribusinesses, and counteracting Chinese involvement in infrastructure via Belt and Road initiative.
• USAID then selects that concept AND the budget that goes along with it. There's an announcement of the awardee. The awardee and USAID (typically the contracting officer and a technical officer) then begin to negotiate a 30-60 day project launch. During project launch, salary line items are finalized, activity line items are finalized, project goals are negotiated then finalized, etc. Per opportunity, we are allowed to move money laterally (so money allotted to Y1 can be moved to Y3, etc.) but we cannot move money from say...salaries to activities without a contractual amendment. Those take months, if they ever get approved.
• Every quarter of every year of the project, we write reports to USAID. Those reports detail, thoroughly, our progress along agreed upon project goals and the corresponding budget expenditure, per activity. Those reports, once read and discussed with USAID, are then uploaded to DEC (the development clearinghouse), which is now offline. The politically...."interesting" ones get sent to certain members of Congress.
• Audits and evaluations are done by a neutral third party. Typically it's done by a neutral third party staffed by people who are not host country nationals and the auditing firm is decided upon using the exact same process as what I detailed in lines 1-3.

USAID local missions not only have budgets, they also work in collaboration with host countries and the respective US embassies to make sure their priorities are aligned. Furthermore, every USAID local mission has what is called a "small business utilization" metric, which is where they must meet a certain $ value of US small business contracts. Last year, USAID gave something like 1B USD in awards to US small businesses.

But you would believe an actual felon who has never released his tax documents, actively engaged in a crypto scam, cheated on multiple wives, known liar, and is obviously self interested in telling people things that only benefit his narrative.

---

Lololo. They do some of that. They also do a lot of things like regime change work, censorship work, lgbtq indoctrination work in countries that don't want it

One might say they are a modern version of colonizers seeking to institute their leftist worldview all over the globe.

Its not us aid. Its united states agency for international development.

Yes, it all works out splendidly just like that in pattern and practice, as Mr. Stewart so eloquently laid out.

I can’t believe this is real

Millions of US Taxpayer dollars are being sent by USAID to a British Politician turned Yale Professors wife’s NGO called ‘Turquoise Mountain Foundation’

“The Turquoise Mountain Foundation exists to teach Afghani peasants about degenerate modern art” pic.twitter.com/0jG2WCH9va

— Wall Street Apes (@WallStreetApes) February 18, 2025

Lining British royalty pockets (who oh by the way hate America) on the backs of 3rd world laborers work.

Shoshana Stewart is CEO of the Turquoise Foundation on £125,000 a year. She and 3 others have a spin off called Turquoise Mountain Trading Company which in the last two years has received over a£1 million in donations with only £52,000 given in grants. Nice work !!!!!! pic.twitter.com/vYhjEMZDd2

— Graham Monkhouse (@legcutter54) February 13, 2025

A literal muslim grooming gang apologist, as well.

Edit, one had profanity in it so I deleted. Here's the gist, replying to this X post:

Thank you to everyone who has been buying #PoliticsOnTheEdge. Really proud to be on the UK best-seller list. 🙏🏻 (But intriguing that the Trump-time list is dominated by books called Anxious Generation, Courage to be Disliked, Surrounded by Idiots and The Psychology of Money..) pic.twitter.com/nIZUr5eN4e

— Rory Stewart (@RoryStewartUK) February 15, 2025

Teslag said:

---

Krombopulos Michael said:

---

Take the L and move on bro......

Zelenskyy before he became a CIA plant for regime change in Ukraine. pic.twitter.com/4ggpz5SCO0

— Jessica 🇺🇸 (@RealJessica05) February 19, 2025

---

This is the high intellect debate I come here for

---

We can SAFEly say that you are FREE from EFFECTIVE posts. So you should welcome that post.

Hullabaloonatic said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

Eliminatus said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

sanangelo said:

---

This might be the most braindead statement I have ever seen be made by a sitting U.S. President. Calling Zelensky a dictator while someone like Putin has been in power now for over 25 years is some next level stupidity. This is the President of the United States on one of his… pic.twitter.com/d5cLZQOe2q

— OSINTdefender (@sentdefender) February 19, 2025

---

People from group A read Trump's statement and say: "Holy crap, he called Z a dictator"

People from group B read Trump's statement and say: "Holy crap, even Z says that half the aid is missing! And he is asking for more?"

There are more people in group B than there are in group A.

And that is why Trump is POTUS, and not Harris.

---

Wrong. Absolutely wrong. And when it was corrected, the right media didn't even bother whispering the truth after shouting the lie.

Z said Ukraine did not receive over half of the aid earmarked. And that is correct. Something like 60 to 70% of said aid never leaves our shores. Especially those first big packages. Which were used to build up our infrastructure here. Ukraine never saw that money. They were never going to see that money. That's not how it works.

There are still sooooooo many LIV people who still blindly believe we just shipped over $200BN in cash on pallets and said good luck! It became my litmus actually on whether I would even engage someone on this overall topic. If someone didn't or couldn't understand the basics of the aid packages and how they worked, it wasn't worth anyone's time trying to engage further.

There probably is missing money somewhere. I'd count on it even. But $100BN+ is a joke and has moved from a misunderstanding to an outright lie at this point.

---

So, you trust Ukraine and USAID more? These are not paragons of virtue that you are talking about here.

---

Versus f'n Donald Trump?! Is this a joke?

USAID is an independent agency that has provided humanitarian assistance around the world for more than 60 years and undergoes rigorous evaluations and audits. Specifically, there are two types of evaluations performed independently on most large USAID programs: performance evaluations and impact evaluations.

• From the very beginning, USAID releases what is known as an RFP (Request for Proposals, if a contract) or RFA (Request for Application, if a grant or cooperative agreement). Within those opportunities, USAID will clearly list a budget range-- say between 15-20M with approximately 5M of the total amount set aside for additional grants under contracts to even smaller, more specified, localized implementing partners.
• Then the various implementing partners all submit concepts/program ideas/activities that are aligned with the needs of the RFP and the goals that USAID has set, with budget line items to them. Internally, USAID then deliberates on a few things-- the technical soundness of what's being proposed, the cost effectiveness (down to travel line items in say, Year Three), the personnel being suggested, and the evaluation metrics being used. You get extra points for using US small businesses, especially if they're US service-disabled, veteran-owned small businesses. They also review the concepts with the programming already happening in country AND the priorities of the USG in said country-- Nigeria, for example, a lot of work focused on food security, creating a stable market for US agribusinesses, and counteracting Chinese involvement in infrastructure via Belt and Road initiative.
• USAID then selects that concept AND the budget that goes along with it. There's an announcement of the awardee. The awardee and USAID (typically the contracting officer and a technical officer) then begin to negotiate a 30-60 day project launch. During project launch, salary line items are finalized, activity line items are finalized, project goals are negotiated then finalized, etc. Per opportunity, we are allowed to move money laterally (so money allotted to Y1 can be moved to Y3, etc.) but we cannot move money from say...salaries to activities without a contractual amendment. Those take months, if they ever get approved.
• Every quarter of every year of the project, we write reports to USAID. Those reports detail, thoroughly, our progress along agreed upon project goals and the corresponding budget expenditure, per activity. Those reports, once read and discussed with USAID, are then uploaded to DEC (the development clearinghouse), which is now offline. The politically...."interesting" ones get sent to certain members of Congress.
• Audits and evaluations are done by a neutral third party. Typically it's done by a neutral third party staffed by people who are not host country nationals and the auditing firm is decided upon using the exact same process as what I detailed in lines 1-3.

USAID local missions not only have budgets, they also work in collaboration with host countries and the respective US embassies to make sure their priorities are aligned. Furthermore, every USAID local mission has what is called a "small business utilization" metric, which is where they must meet a certain $ value of US small business contracts. Last year, USAID gave something like 1B USD in awards to US small businesses.

But you would believe an actual felon who has never released his tax documents, actively engaged in a crypto scam, cheated on multiple wives, known liar, and is obviously self interested in telling people things that only benefit his narrative.

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Explain the millions for transgender surgeries and $20 million for Sesame Street in Iraq.

Putin says Trump must go harder on Europe and Ukraine; must move faster; he promised 24 hours; won’t meet with Trump until Trump is ready for serious results; the cause of the war is NATO

Putin: I’m surprised by Trump’s restraint toward allies who behaved rudely 0/ pic.twitter.com/JHqPKarbLF

— Tymofiy Mylovanov (@Mylovanov) February 19, 2025

Eliminatus said:

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This is where the true followers of the Russian disinformation campaign will show themselves.

It's pretty easy to see how they did it too. They just latched it onto the leftist messaging during the height of the mudslinging. So many right to far right just saw Uke = leftist and rebounded hard by forfeiting common sense and critical thought.

The damn thing is, is how f'ing easy it was. They did take some leftist messaging but then inflated it/lied to egregious proportions and sculpted out what is probably one of the most perfect psyop campaigns ever waged. How many of the same posters crying about Zelesnky posted videos of Soviet infiltration and media control tactics from the 60's onward? And yet refuse to believe that it was happening to them? I gave up countering the lies years ago. Screaming into the void doesn't cover it. I saw the futility when a poster threw out some dumb propaganda lies, I proved them wrong USING THE VERY SOURCES THEY POSTED, they ditched the thread that they were very active on up to the point, then were on another not even a day later posting the exact same lie. Some people here aren't interested in truth. They are interested in narratives that support their world. Nothing else needs to exist. Was everything that happened during the Biden campaign kosher? Of course not. It also was not as bad as most of the naysayers think it was and trust me, I have several rants against it myself over the years. Under a Trump admin, an effective and efficient aid package should have continued that would have enhanced our capabilities, strengthened our existing ties in Ukraine, propelled ourselves back onto the world stage as a trusted ally (which is pure dog**** as of now) and IMO, would have actually shaped ourselves up in a better spot against the coming war with China.

Putin did not invade to save abused ethno-Russians or destroy Nazis or biolabs. That is LIV thinking. Euromaidan doesn't happen and sustain till 2022 without popular support from the people.

I am also pretty certain this is where the first true wedges of the Elon/ left split began. I do think Russia was the main driver behind the initial media blitz against Elon on the global stage and it was devastatingly effective IMO. And cheap. It's also where I actually gotta give the Russians credit. Because if I were them, I would have done the same thing. Strategically brilliant victory.

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Teslag said:

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Detmersdislocatedshoulder said:

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Teslag said:

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Putin was forced to invade a sovereign nation because they might have joined a defensive alliance?

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no what putin was afraid of was ukraine becoming part of nato and then nato putting nuclear missiles in ukraine. this is no different than if russia wanted to put nuclear missiles in say Cuba.

what i can assure you is we played a major hand in this and that has been somewhat admitted to by victoria nuland. she admitted that the minsk agreement was a ploy to buy time for ukraine to prepare for war.

this issue is not black and white.

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This isn't 1963. The reach of modern nuclear munitions are just as capable from Poland as they are from Ukraine.

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while your right in regards to advancements in nuclear weapons you miss the point completely.

the closer they are the quicker they get there. so whether it is 1963 or 2025 the distance these missiles have to travel does matter from a defensive position. if a nuclear missile is fired from ukraine its impact is less than 5 minutes. if it is fired from england as an example it could be 15-20 minutes. russia is as not willing to allow that.

they also engaged zeliinsky multiple times before invading. they put a time/ red line in the sand and then allowed zalinski to cross it with no response and they still didn't invade immediately. zelensky called nuland and idiot boris they said F putin let's see what he does. he invaded

this story is not black and white it is very gray with the real bad guys are the globalist. unfortunately the globalist infiltrated our government and many others this is where we are today.

sanangelo said:

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Putin says Trump must go harder on Europe and Ukraine; must move faster; he promised 24 hours; won’t meet with Trump until Trump is ready for serious results; the cause of the war is NATO

Putin: I’m surprised by Trump’s restraint toward allies who behaved rudely 0/ pic.twitter.com/JHqPKarbLF

— Tymofiy Mylovanov (@Mylovanov) February 19, 2025

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Can't believe anyone buys what he's selling.

sanangelo said:

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Putin says Trump must go harder on Europe and Ukraine; must move faster; he promised 24 hours; won’t meet with Trump until Trump is ready for serious results; the cause of the war is NATO

Putin: I’m surprised by Trump’s restraint toward allies who behaved rudely 0/ pic.twitter.com/JHqPKarbLF

— Tymofiy Mylovanov (@Mylovanov) February 19, 2025

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No surprise there. Putin's statement for his own domestic audience. Putin has not survived this long without being pragmatic. He took a calculated risk in invading Ukraine and trying to take Kiev. Past experience showed there would be some stompy feet reactions had he been successful but not a full military reaction.

He failed. Mostly he failed because of the timing, February? Really? For a country offensive? Did he learn nothing from Hitler's disastrous decision to open the Eastern Front with winter on the doorstep and troops not equipped for winter warfare?

But to be fair, I think Putin truly believed Zelensky would bug out and Poroshenko would become de facto leader, his puppet creating a vassal state, like Belarus. Why Poroshenko was doing all of those photo ops very early in the war. A deal was in place.

Ironic since Poroshenko was the handpicked CIA and State Department successor when Yanukovych was deposed.

eric76 said:

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BboroAg said:

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Because Ukraine/USA did start the war….very similar playbook to the USA's role in the Vietnam war

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The US entered into the Viet Nam War in 1965, but it had already been going on for something like twenty years.

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The US inserted themselves into Vietnam in 1954 in support of France….which was ironic considering that the Vietnamese people were seeking independence from colonialism just like American had done in 1776.

BboroAg said:

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eric76 said:

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BboroAg said:

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Because Ukraine/USA did start the war….very similar playbook to the USA's role in the Vietnam war

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The US entered into the Viet Nam War in 1965, but it had already been going on for something like twenty years.

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The US inserted themselves into Vietnam in 1954 in support of France against Soviet and Chinese backed communists….which was ironic considering that the Vietnamese people were seeking independence from colonialism just like American had done in 1776.

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FIFY

Quote:

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Why do you think Trump is saying Ukraine started the war?

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Trump always laying the groundwork for what's about to come next.

Start with The Art of the Deal and work backwards.

Krombopulos Michael said:

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Take the L and move on bro......

Zelenskyy before he became a CIA plant for regime change in Ukraine. pic.twitter.com/4ggpz5SCO0

— Jessica 🇺🇸 (@RealJessica05) February 19, 2025

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incredible self-own

aggiehawg said:

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sanangelo said:

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Putin says Trump must go harder on Europe and Ukraine; must move faster; he promised 24 hours; won’t meet with Trump until Trump is ready for serious results; the cause of the war is NATO

Putin: I’m surprised by Trump’s restraint toward allies who behaved rudely 0/ pic.twitter.com/JHqPKarbLF

— Tymofiy Mylovanov (@Mylovanov) February 19, 2025

---

No surprise there. Putin's statement for his own domestic audience. Putin has not survived this long without being pragmatic. He took a calculated risk in invading Ukraine and trying to take Kiev. Past experience showed there would be some stompy feet reactions had he been successful but not a full military reaction.

He failed. Mostly he failed because of the timing, February? Really? For a country offensive? Did he learn nothing from Hitler's disastrous decision to open the Eastern Front with winter on the doorstep and troops not equipped for winter warfare?

But to be fair, I think Putin truly believed Zelensky would bug out and Poroshenko would become de facto leader, his puppet creating a vassal state, like Belarus. Why Poroshenko was doing all of those photo ops very early in the war. A deal was in place.

Ironic since Poroshenko was the handpicked CIA and State Department successor when Yanukovych was deposed.

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He also ran his supply lines too thin and had to abandon a lot of equipment. You can move fast, but you have to conquer quickly. Logistics take time, and if you quick strike you better win or withdraw.