JB99 said:

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rgvag11 said:

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That's going to make peace a little harder to achieve.

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Why is that? Putin is the aggressor. If you convince Putin to stop fighting, the war is over. Putin cankeep the land he occupies. What is Zelensky going to do? Attack Russia in those occupied lands and extend the war? Good luck with that. The gravy train is over.

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This

rgvag11 said:

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That's going to make peace a little harder to achieve.

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It's about to get super easy.

Trump cuts off all funding to Ukraine. Threatens Europe to do the same or USA will leave NATO. The war will be over tomorrow.

Russia will keep Crimea and part of Eastern Ukraine. Putin agrees to stand down and USA agrees Ukraine will never be part of NATO.

fc2112 said:

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The US has given about $175 B to Ukraine since the war started. About $500 for every man, woman and child in America.

We're done.

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I wonder if the average American thinks it was worth their $500? $2000 for a family of 4.

I'd like to know how many of our tax dollars have found their way into Zelensky's bank accounts…

Who?mikejones! said:

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Urban Ag said:

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Old McDonald said:

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Aglaw97 said:

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Old McDonald said:

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what a crazy coincidence that one month into trump's presidency russia and putin are about to get everything they wanted when they invaded their sovereign neighbor!

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Your understanding of foreign diplomacy would embarrass a first grader.

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spare me. the trump admin has ideologically realigned the republican party to support russia and oppose europe because they strive to emulate the former's style of governance. reagan is rolling in his grave.

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LOL

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Yeah, he's putting words in our mouths.

At the beginning of this war, I supported the ukes 100%. I was happy that we were giving support to them, especially older weapons. It doesnt even bother me we gave them money as it was a pretty good return on our investment to show the illegitimatcy of russia's mulitary prowless.

However, it's clear this war needs to end and that doesn't happen without Russia keeping the land it has conquered. Perhaps there can be a land swap with what Ukraine holds in kursk

I think 100% of this war is on putin. Theres 0 circumstance that was on the table which could have justified this invasion, now or in 2014. But unless us and the europeans are willing to send our own men to fight, this war will not end in a Ukrainian victory. Its mostly a draw now and will be so a year from now, at best.

And yes, the people in Carolina, Maui, and California deserve the money sent to ukriane first, before we burn it in ukraine

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My thoughts exactly. It sucks to be Ukraine or hate putin but those are the facts.

Yukon Cornelius said:

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This is all manufactured. Know how I know? No one gives a hoot about territorial wars in Africa. People ONLY care about Ukraine because the MEDIA told them to. Which said media was PAID BY FEDERAL government to tell people to care about Ukraine.

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Trump should arrange flights for the "stand with Ukraine" folks.
You don't want peace? Think this is a bad deal .
Great. Go to Ukraine and fight.

Now that would be a worthy cause for our tax dollars.
I will contribute over and above my taxes.

Give them citizenship in Liberia if they find Ukraine not to their liking. Any US citizen going to fight as a mercenary in another nation's army should have their citizenship revoked. Period. The end.

flown-the-coop said:

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Give them citizenship in Liberia if they find Ukraine not to their liking. Any US citizen going to fight as a mercenary in another nation's army should have their citizenship revoked. Period. The end.

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We making this retroactive to Davy Crockett?

I might be imagining 3D chess here, but to me this seems like a good negotiation tactic. Simply put, It's easier to negotiate with somebody when he believes you're on his side. So by publicly ****ting on / humiliating Zelensky, Trump might be increasing the likelihood of reaching a deal with Putin (which ironically, will benefit Ukraine).

TheCurl84 said:

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Remember how our politicos and the media INSISTED that we support Ukraine, and send them endless treasure?

Anyone who has been around a while saw that unified reaction as the first sign of trouble, and became suspicious immediately.

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Not the crazy supporters here they will tell you we see the deep state in everything. Ukraine was covid 2.0 control and money worst part is they did it right in our face. Wouldn't pass bills unless more money went to Ukraine. We are being invaded but send 100 of billions away so our lifetime politians grandchildren would be set. It's okay some say America first but Trump means it.

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Your understanding of foreign diplomacy would embarrass a first grader.

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And you're understanding of foreign diplomacy is embarrassing everyone.

Teslag said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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Give them citizenship in Liberia if they find Ukraine not to their liking. Any US citizen going to fight as a mercenary in another nation's army should have their citizenship revoked. Period. The end.

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We making this retroactive to Davy Crockett?

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Not sure I follow.

Is Ukraine an adjacent territory to the United States? Trying to understand the comparison.

You said any American leaving to fight in another war should have their citizenship revoked. It was a ridiculous thing to say.

LOL

flown-the-coop said:

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Give them citizenship in Liberia if they find Ukraine not to their liking. Any US citizen going to fight as a mercenary in another nation's army should have their citizenship revoked. Period. The end.

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Sucks for pappy boyington

I love most of what Trump stands for and does but not this. I can't reconcile that he can call Zelensky a dictator but not putin. putin is one of the greatest examples of a dictator in the modern era.

I am all for Europe taking lead with providing most of the support but calling out Ukraine for corruption when it was us doing the corrupting while russia repeatedly commits some damn nasty atrocities is quite ****ed up.

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

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So we're rewarding Russia for taking Ukrainian soil?

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What would you do if you were in charge of foreign policy?

I am not ok defending other nations on our dime that debate all you want, but was long game provoked. Even if it wasn't I'm not for spending billions on a corrupt "democracy". Which it's not.

Are all you Ukraine cheerleaders OK that we organized a toppling of their government to begin with?

No. I do wish we'd get out of the regime change business though I understand the strategy behind it.


That said, it still doesn't give Russia any justification to invade ukraine.

Who?mikejones! said:

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No. I do wish we'd get out of the regime change business though I understand the strategy behind it.


That said, it still doesn't give Russia any justification to invade ukraine.

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Let's take the justification debate off the table for a sec as that's not really matters to me.

Why do you want to spend billions of tax payer dollars to support a regime that corrupt and when the dollars are very hard to account for and little actually does meaningful good. Ukes have sold our arms to cartels and others. Why are you ok to spend money here?

You're suggesting thing that I don't think

🚨 HE SAID IT AGAIN!

TRUMP: "A dictator without elections, Zelensky better move fast, or he's not gonna have a country left."pic.twitter.com/yLPjLaXVBw

— Eric Daugherty (@EricLDaugh) February 19, 2025

🚨 Trump is going OFF on Zelensky again

“Zelensky wants to keep the gravy train going…He's very upset that he wasn't invited... but he's HAD three years!"

pic.twitter.com/i82shK1b4j

— Eric Daugherty (@EricLDaugh) February 19, 2025

Teslag said:

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You said any American leaving to fight in another war should have their citizenship revoked. It was a ridiculous thing to say.

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And I mean it. You cannot be a citizenship of the US and have allegiance to another army.

These mercenaries somewhat routinely find themselves in complex situations and on more than one occasion including costing us money and men in retrieving them.

You may like watching Rambo and dreaming that these mercenaries are somehow fighting the good fight for another team. To be, they have gone off the reservation and I would not welcome them back.

You are welcome to your own take and opinion. I am most certainly welcome to mine.

From the replies, I am starting to wonder if Zelensky's cocaine habit rumors are real, after all, something I have long dismissed. Trump would undoubtedly by now have solid intelligence information about that, though.
As well:

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His plan (Trump) was to try peace and if Zelensky declined to wash his hands of the conflict and say we tried. Russia will be allowed to finish the job if Europe doesn't step up, bc the USA is stepping out soon.

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Who?mikejones! said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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Give them citizenship in Liberia if they find Ukraine not to their liking. Any US citizen going to fight as a mercenary in another nation's army should have their citizenship revoked. Period. The end.

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Sucks for pappy boyington

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I still hold my position.

American citizens, particularly ex-military, fighting in other wars for other countries are no longer a citizen of the US and should have to reapply if they want to come back home.

flown-the-coop said:

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Who?mikejones! said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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Give them citizenship in Liberia if they find Ukraine not to their liking. Any US citizen going to fight as a mercenary in another nation's army should have their citizenship revoked. Period. The end.

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Sucks for pappy boyington

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I still hold my position.

American citizens, particularly ex-military, fighting in other wars for other countries are no longer a citizen of the US and should have to reapply if they want to come back home.

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Curious. What about dual citizenship?

Old McDonald said:

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what a crazy coincidence that one month into trump's presidency russia and putin are about to get everything they wanted when they invaded their sovereign neighbor!

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I sure hope you keep posting here. You add humor to the board.....just glad there's not an Agtag next to your name for your media sheepish comments.

Eliminatus said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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Who?mikejones! said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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Give them citizenship in Liberia if they find Ukraine not to their liking. Any US citizen going to fight as a mercenary in another nation's army should have their citizenship revoked. Period. The end.

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Sucks for pappy boyington

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I still hold my position.

American citizens, particularly ex-military, fighting in other wars for other countries are no longer a citizen of the US and should have to reapply if they want to come back home.

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Curious. What about dual citizenship?

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Bit different of a topic. As the US allows it, then I think as long as country B is not in conflict with country A, then that would be palatable to me. This certainly applies with our relationship with Israel.

But I would still want the option to revoke if your service in the military of country B resulted in actions that would be subject to a court martial here (war crime type stuff).

Back on the subject of true mercenaries, I believe the risk they present to the US through their personal actions should have risk / consequences to their returning back to our Country / society.

flown-the-coop said:

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Eliminatus said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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Who?mikejones! said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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Give them citizenship in Liberia if they find Ukraine not to their liking. Any US citizen going to fight as a mercenary in another nation's army should have their citizenship revoked. Period. The end.

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Sucks for pappy boyington

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I still hold my position.

American citizens, particularly ex-military, fighting in other wars for other countries are no longer a citizen of the US and should have to reapply if they want to come back home.

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Curious. What about dual citizenship?

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Bit different of a topic. As the US allows it, then I think as long as country B is not in conflict with country A, then that would be palatable to me. This certainly applies with our relationship with Israel.

But I would still want the option to revoke if your service in the military of country B resulted in actions that would be subject to a court martial here (war crime type stuff).

Back on the subject of true mercenaries, I believe the risk they present to the US through their personal actions should have risk / consequences to their returning back to our Country / society.

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Interesting. Was just curious. As your remarks about the allegiance thing to differing countries. So you are cool with it, conditionally. Not a gotcha, I promise. Just like to pick peoples brains on things like this for perspective. I myself was leaning hard towards the FFL years ago when I was in a rough spot in life and have wondered from time to time what my life would have looked like if I had gone through all of it and made it and spent the time to gain the French citizenship as well. I know one guy who did with no regrets.

I also know two guys who have died in Ukraine. Both prior service Americans. I'm not mad at your opinion though and I doubt they would be either. I'd doubt they'd care to be honest as it probably wouldn't matter to them. Big picture guys. I do find it interesting as well that many other nations DO have restrictions on their natives fighting in other wars yet we really don't, for the most part. Legally at least. We also have several Americans fighting for Russia too.

rgvag11 said:

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That's going to make peace a little harder to achieve.

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Trump is 100% right in what he said.

You don't bow down the little corrupt, pieces of **** like Zelenskky, but of course, Biden did.

Funny how when Trump was president the first time all the leftist organizations and media were saying how horrible a persons Zelenskky was and how could Trump deal with him he was a little fascist/dictator, etc. and then all of a sudden when Biden became president he was fine. Now they're making Zelenskky the hero. The left flip-flops more than a pancake.

rgvag11 said:

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If you say so.

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It's baffling that you think Trump is the bad guy in this situation.

It's even more baffling that you find it funny, hundreds of billions of dollars being sent over there, especially after seeing what the pants pooper did.

You don't know much about Zelenskky's past, threats to our country and grifting of our money.

🚨 BREAKING: Senator Rand Paul (R-KY) formally endorses President Donald Trump after Trump denounced Zelensky & aid to Ukraine, amidst DOGE's progress and a strong Cabinet.

Paul says he "resisted an enthusiastic endorsement of Donald Trump during the election."

"But now, I’m… pic.twitter.com/BJ1tZvaHq5

— Eric Daugherty (@EricLDaugh) February 20, 2025

BREAKING: Senator Rand Paul (R-KY) formally endorses President Donald Trump after Trump denounced Zelensky & aid to Ukraine, amidst DOGE's progress and a strong Cabinet.

Paul says he "resisted an enthusiastic endorsement of Donald Trump during the election."

"But now, I'm amazed by the Trump cabinet (many of whom I would have picked)."

"I love his message to the Ukrainian warmongers, and along with his DOGE initiative shows I was wrong to withhold my endorsement. So today, admittedly a little tardy, I give Donald Trump my enthusiastic endorsement!"

For those going to the other extreme of talking about abandoning Ukraine entirely, what if any culpability or responsibility do you see we have for our mid 1990's arrangements and assurances with Urkaine?

Eliminatus said:

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Interesting. Was just curious. As your remarks about the allegiance thing to differing countries. So you are cool with it, conditionally. Not a gotcha, I promise. Just like to pick peoples brains on things like this for perspective. I myself was leaning hard towards the FFL years ago when I was in a rough spot in life and have wondered from time to time what my life would have looked like if I had gone through all of it and made it and spent the time to gain the French citizenship as well. I know one guy who did with no regrets.

I also know two guys who have died in Ukraine. Both prior service Americans. I'm not mad at your opinion though and I doubt they would be either. I'd doubt they'd care to be honest as it probably wouldn't matter to them. Big picture guys. I do find it interesting as well that many other nations DO have restrictions on their natives fighting in other wars yet we really don't, for the most part. Legally at least. We also have several Americans fighting for Russia too.

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Its not that I do not thing such mercenaries are noble and brave to do what they do (I suspect the compensation, if any, is not the motivation). they most certainly are. And I agree they would likely still go and fight and shed their blood regardless of what I believe but also regardless of the 'consequence' I laid out.

My position is based on what is best for the whole of America versus the individual. Sort of like the whole Mission Impossible approach, but if you go and fight as a mercenary in a foreign army you are 'disavowed'. As you mention, other countries have restrictions and I think we should as well (in addition to whatever we may have, if any, which I admittedly am not familiar with).