Unfortunately, God was replaced in public schools with the religion of woke, leftist, Marxist worship taught by hard left teachers. The current public school system and the elimination of God of people's lives is producing a bad result. Ninety percent of college students are democrats. Far too many graduate with worthless degrees and zero marketable skills. And ignorant people make bad life choices resulting in poverty and unhappiness and envy. Then they vote to take the fruits of other's labors by voting democrat. And voting Democrat gets you Obama and Biden.

txwxman said:

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Forum 16 likes themselves some Ten Commandments.

Forum 16 likes themselves some Ken Paxton.

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Ken Paxton is one of the most hated politicians on this board.

Why do ya'll insist on lying to try to make a point? Kind of, you know, proving my point...

pfo said:

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Unfortunately, God was replaced in public schools with the religion of woke, leftist, Marxist worship taught by hard left teachers. The current public school system and the elimination of God of people's lives is producing a bad result. Ninety percent of college students are democrats. Far too many graduate with worthless degrees and zero marketable skills. And ignorant people make bad life choices resulting in poverty and unhappiness and envy. Then they vote to take the fruits of other's labors by voting democrat. And voting Democrat gets you Obama and Biden.

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How will learning about God in school get anyone a job?

infinity ag said:

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No religion in schools.

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Teaching basic morals and ethics isn't "religion", its common sense.

We have abandoned that and now are kids love Marxism, worship Gaia, our afraud to have children, and mutilate their own genitals.

infinity ag said:

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pfo said:

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Unfortunately, God was replaced in public schools with the religion of woke, leftist, Marxist worship taught by hard left teachers. The current public school system and the elimination of God of people's lives is producing a bad result. Ninety percent of college students are democrats. Far too many graduate with worthless degrees and zero marketable skills. And ignorant people make bad life choices resulting in poverty and unhappiness and envy. Then they vote to take the fruits of other's labors by voting democrat. And voting Democrat gets you Obama and Biden.

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How will learning about God in school get anyone a job?

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To me, it seems like another one of those "culture war" things, that won't change anything in the real world, but gives the side doing the "owning" the feels.

infinity ag said:

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pfo said:

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Unfortunately, God was replaced in public schools with the religion of woke, leftist, Marxist worship taught by hard left teachers. The current public school system and the elimination of God of people's lives is producing a bad result. Ninety percent of college students are democrats. Far too many graduate with worthless degrees and zero marketable skills. And ignorant people make bad life choices resulting in poverty and unhappiness and envy. Then they vote to take the fruits of other's labors by voting democrat. And voting Democrat gets you Obama and Biden.

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How will learning about God in school get anyone a job?

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How will teaching people to be moral and ethical help them get a job?

Silent For Too Long said:

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infinity ag said:

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No religion in schools.

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Teaching basic morals and ethics isn't "religion", its common sense.

We have abandoned that and now are kids love Marxism, worship Gaia, our afraud to have children, and mutilate their own genitals.

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Morals and ethics can't be taught without the commandments put up?

No Spin Ag said:

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infinity ag said:

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pfo said:

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Unfortunately, God was replaced in public schools with the religion of woke, leftist, Marxist worship taught by hard left teachers. The current public school system and the elimination of God of people's lives is producing a bad result. Ninety percent of college students are democrats. Far too many graduate with worthless degrees and zero marketable skills. And ignorant people make bad life choices resulting in poverty and unhappiness and envy. Then they vote to take the fruits of other's labors by voting democrat. And voting Democrat gets you Obama and Biden.

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How will learning about God in school get anyone a job?

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To me, it seems like another one of those "culture war" things, that won't change anything in the real world, but gives the side doing the "owning" the feels.

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But this is empirically false.

No Spin Ag said:

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Silent For Too Long said:

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infinity ag said:

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No religion in schools.

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Teaching basic morals and ethics isn't "religion", its common sense.

We have abandoned that and now are kids love Marxism, worship Gaia, our afraud to have children, and mutilate their own genitals.

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Morals and ethics can't be taught without the commandments put up?

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They aren't, so...

The 10 Commandments are symbol of a society that respects the rule of Law.

Not one that worships hedonism. Which is what we have instead.

infinity ag said:

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No religion in schools.

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You are angry that there is no religion in schools?

I think the main concern and this is something that I will speak for personally. Your OP is very specific about Left-wing voters hating the 10 commandments and not following them. Whether or not I think that that's true or exaggerated I take your concern at face value. The problem becomes when politicians like Ken Paxton famously, but also let's just go there Donald trump, are in fact party leaders who are explicitly and shamelessly violating The 10 Commandments.

It gives the impression that your concern about character is limited to 1 political party and the obvious sins of the political party you vote for are not important or at best overlooked strategically because the sins of the left are worse. In other words you have a splinter in your own eye.

Silent For Too Long said:

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They vehemently disagree with all of them.

Adultery? "Marriage is an institution of the patriarchy "

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You know many people across the spectrum violate this one? I don't think I've ever heard the argument that it is an institution of the patriarchy.

Our current President is guilty of adultery.

Silent For Too Long said:

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No Spin Ag said:

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Silent For Too Long said:

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infinity ag said:

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No religion in schools.

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Teaching basic morals and ethics isn't "religion", its common sense.

We have abandoned that and now are kids love Marxism, worship Gaia, our afraud to have children, and mutilate their own genitals.

---

Morals and ethics can't be taught without the commandments put up?

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They aren't, so...

The 10 Commandments are symbol of a society that respects the rule of Law.

Not one that worships hedonism. Which is what we have instead.

---

Are you saying that unless the commandments are put up children can't be taught to respect the rule of law? That morals and ethics can only be learned by them if the commandments are put up in their classrooms?

Just trying to follow you on this one.

Malibu said:

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My religious preferences are deeply personal to me and are between me and God, and I have 0 interest in any kind of state involvement in mine or my children's religious preferences, even if I actually align with the state's preferences. When the state has a monopoly on legal violence, any kind of implied preference cannot be removed from that monopoly of violence, which is why I reject any slippery slope where the government tacitly endorses one religion. It's simply not the government's business, it's God's business.

You are making a different argument now though that the state does have an interest in the character development of its citizens, and ancient wisdom across the world's major religions have relevant contributions to that discussion. I agree, with the caveat that the implementation matters.

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Literally everything is downstream of religion. What you say you want is impossible.

Im Gipper said:

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Malibu said:

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The point of the 10 commandments in classrooms is not to inspire children to be better people. If that was the case then the authors of the bill would have no issue with also including Buddhism's eightfold path, Hindu Yamas, the 5 pillars of Islam, Jainism 5 great vows, etc. The point is to emphasize one major world religion over others. There's a reason the founders saw fit to have a first amendment that doesn't allow the government to do that.

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The founders were totally okay with States doing this. You know that, right?

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And? The founding fathers were "totally okay" with many aspects of their world that today we find problematic. The idea that Jefferson, Adam's, et al. being "okay" with something suddenly makes that thing acceptable is shockingly childish.

Having said that… keep Jebus in Sunday school not public schools.

Malibu said:

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I think the main concern and this is something that I will speak for personally. Your OP is very specific about Left-wing voters hating the 10 commandments and not following them. Whether or not I think that that's true or exaggerated I take your concern at face value. The problem becomes when politicians like Ken Paxton famously, but also let's just go there Donald trump, are in fact party leaders who are explicitly and shamelessly violating The 10 Commandments.

It gives the impression that your concern about character is limited to 1 political party and the obvious sins of the political party you vote for are not important or at best overlooked strategically because the sins of the left are worse. In other words you have a splinter in your own eye.

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All human beings sin.

One party celebrates it.

Satellite of Love said:

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Silent For Too Long said:

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They vehemently disagree with all of them.

Adultery? "Marriage is an institution of the patriarchy "

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You know many people across the spectrum violate this one? I don't think I've ever heard the argument that it is an institution of the patriarchy.

Our current President is guilty of adultery.

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You haven't read much feminist literature then.

Bob Lee said:

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Malibu said:

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My religious preferences are deeply personal to me and are between me and God, and I have 0 interest in any kind of state involvement in mine or my children's religious preferences, even if I actually align with the state's preferences. When the state has a monopoly on legal violence, any kind of implied preference cannot be removed from that monopoly of violence, which is why I reject any slippery slope where the government tacitly endorses one religion. It's simply not the government's business, it's God's business.

You are making a different argument now though that the state does have an interest in the character development of its citizens, and ancient wisdom across the world's major religions have relevant contributions to that discussion. I agree, with the caveat that the implementation matters.

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Literally everything is downstream of religion. What you say you want is impossible.

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What I say I want is actually how things are right now.

Silent For Too Long said:

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infinity ag said:

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No religion in schools.

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Teaching basic morals and ethics isn't "religion", its common sense.

We have abandoned that and now are kids love Marxism, worship Gaia, our afraud to have children, and mutilate their own genitals.

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Morals and ethics, I am on board.

Teaching "religion" (though ethics/morals have commonalities with religion), I am not. No Marxism/activism either.

Silent For Too Long said:

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infinity ag said:

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pfo said:

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Unfortunately, God was replaced in public schools with the religion of woke, leftist, Marxist worship taught by hard left teachers. The current public school system and the elimination of God of people's lives is producing a bad result. Ninety percent of college students are democrats. Far too many graduate with worthless degrees and zero marketable skills. And ignorant people make bad life choices resulting in poverty and unhappiness and envy. Then they vote to take the fruits of other's labors by voting democrat. And voting Democrat gets you Obama and Biden.

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How will learning about God in school get anyone a job?

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How will teaching people to be moral and ethical help them get a job?

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It won't help them get a job, but it will help them stay out of jail.

No Spin Ag said:

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Silent For Too Long said:

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No Spin Ag said:

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Silent For Too Long said:

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infinity ag said:

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No religion in schools.

---

Teaching basic morals and ethics isn't "religion", its common sense.

We have abandoned that and now are kids love Marxism, worship Gaia, our afraud to have children, and mutilate their own genitals.

---

Morals and ethics can't be taught without the commandments put up?

---

They aren't, so...

The 10 Commandments are symbol of a society that respects the rule of Law.

Not one that worships hedonism. Which is what we have instead.

---

Are you saying that unless the commandments are put up children can't be taught to respect the rule of law? That morals and ethics can only be learned by them if the commandments are put up in their classrooms?

Just trying to follow you on this one.

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Its a symbol of an ideal and a mindset.

Symbols are extremely powerful and important. Our founders understood this. In truth, the marxists understand this too, which is why they have devoted so much attention to tearing them down.

PanzerAggie06 said:

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Im Gipper said:

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Malibu said:

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The point of the 10 commandments in classrooms is not to inspire children to be better people. If that was the case then the authors of the bill would have no issue with also including Buddhism's eightfold path, Hindu Yamas, the 5 pillars of Islam, Jainism 5 great vows, etc. The point is to emphasize one major world religion over others. There's a reason the founders saw fit to have a first amendment that doesn't allow the government to do that.

---

The founders were totally okay with States doing this. You know that, right?

---

And? The founding fathers were "totally okay" with many aspects of their world that today we find problematic. The idea that Jefferson, Adam's, et al. being "okay" with something suddenly makes that thing acceptable is shockingly childish.

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Malibu made a false statement I was correcting. That's why it matters here.

It also matters because the definition of the word "establishment" is based completely on what they would have believed at the time.

Libs find textualism and originalism "shocking". We know.

Speaking of childish

Quote:

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Having said that… keep Jebus in Sunday school not public schools.

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Grow up.

Silent For Too Long said:

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Malibu said:

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I think the main concern and this is something that I will speak for personally. Your OP is very specific about Left-wing voters hating the 10 commandments and not following them. Whether or not I think that that's true or exaggerated I take your concern at face value. The problem becomes when politicians like Ken Paxton famously, but also let's just go there Donald trump, are in fact party leaders who are explicitly and shamelessly violating The 10 Commandments.

It gives the impression that your concern about character is limited to 1 political party and the obvious sins of the political party you vote for are not important or at best overlooked strategically because the sins of the left are worse. In other words you have a splinter in your own eye.

---

All human beings sin.

One party celebrates it.

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And the other doesn't practice what they preach, but yall eat it up anyways

Malibu said:

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Bob Lee said:

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Malibu said:

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My religious preferences are deeply personal to me and are between me and God, and I have 0 interest in any kind of state involvement in mine or my children's religious preferences, even if I actually align with the state's preferences. When the state has a monopoly on legal violence, any kind of implied preference cannot be removed from that monopoly of violence, which is why I reject any slippery slope where the government tacitly endorses one religion. It's simply not the government's business, it's God's business.

You are making a different argument now though that the state does have an interest in the character development of its citizens, and ancient wisdom across the world's major religions have relevant contributions to that discussion. I agree, with the caveat that the implementation matters.

---

Literally everything is downstream of religion. What you say you want is impossible.

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What I say I want is actually how things are right now.

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And you don't see any of the deleterious effects this has had?

Hasan Piker is being celebrated by leftwing media and proudly says Marxism , murder, and stealing are all good things.

A left wing media that is filled with "good students" with ivy league degrees

cajunaggie08 said:

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Silent For Too Long said:

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Malibu said:

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I think the main concern and this is something that I will speak for personally. Your OP is very specific about Left-wing voters hating the 10 commandments and not following them. Whether or not I think that that's true or exaggerated I take your concern at face value. The problem becomes when politicians like Ken Paxton famously, but also let's just go there Donald trump, are in fact party leaders who are explicitly and shamelessly violating The 10 Commandments.

It gives the impression that your concern about character is limited to 1 political party and the obvious sins of the political party you vote for are not important or at best overlooked strategically because the sins of the left are worse. In other words you have a splinter in your own eye.

---

All human beings sin.

One party celebrates it.

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And the other doesn't practice what they preach, but yall eat it up anyways

---

Another non sequitur

Im Gipper said:

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PanzerAggie06 said:

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Im Gipper said:

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Malibu said:

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The point of the 10 commandments in classrooms is not to inspire children to be better people. If that was the case then the authors of the bill would have no issue with also including Buddhism's eightfold path, Hindu Yamas, the 5 pillars of Islam, Jainism 5 great vows, etc. The point is to emphasize one major world religion over others. There's a reason the founders saw fit to have a first amendment that doesn't allow the government to do that.

---

The founders were totally okay with States doing this. You know that, right?

---

And? The founding fathers were "totally okay" with many aspects of their world that today we find problematic. The idea that Jefferson, Adam's, et al. being "okay" with something suddenly makes that thing acceptable is shockingly childish.

---

Malibu made a false statement I was correcting. That's why it matters here.

It also matters because the definition of the word "establishment" is based completely on what they would have believed at the time.

Libs find textualism and originalism "shocking". We know.

Speaking of childish

Quote:

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Having said that… keep Jebus in Sunday school not public schools.

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Grow up.

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Another highly childish take…. "what they would have believed at the time". So, let's set current 21st Century policy based on our reading of tea leaves to ascertain what we hope they were thinking 200+ years ago.

Grow up, indeed.

Look, when my conversation about concern about the lack of character in your party is met with "everybody sins," but you seem very concerned with making sure that we have religious symbols in classrooms as utmost importance, it gives me the impression that you don't really care about character, so long as its your side in power. I'd respect your position a little bit more if you were applying it to everyone equally.

For the record I made no false statement. I made a claim about what the founders put in the 1st amendment and said absolutely nothing about their views of how the 1st amendment would apply to the states.

AgDev01 said:

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Anonymous Source said:

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I'm against the 10 commandments in schools because seemingly all of the politicians who insisted they be there are in violation of nearly all of them

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You must be talking about the current Senate candidate championing this whole thing that got busted having an affair with a skeletor impersonator.

I find it amusing how so many on here rage about their contempt for the godless democrats on one thread and then go to another to support their lying, cheating, thieving candidate.

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Sometimes the giant douc** is better than the turd sandwich.

Quote:

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Another highly childish take…. "what they would have believed at the time". So, let's set current 21st Century policy based on our reading of tea leaves to ascertain what we hope they were thinking 200+ years ago.

Grow up, indeed.

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As I said, original and textualism are very offensive to the liberals. The truth is not having this "living breathing constitution" y'all want so bad helps even the godless.

Quote:

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There's a reason the founders saw fit to have a first amendment that doesn't allow the government to do that.

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This is historically false. Sorry.

In addition to the state v fed issue, under no excepted definition of "establishment" would hanging the Ten Commandments in the classroom qualify.


Please keep your definition of establishment and the source

Malibu said:

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Look, when my conversation about concern about the lack of character in your party is met with "everybody sins," but you seem very concerned with making sure that we have religious symbols in classrooms as utmost importance, it gives me the impression that you don't really care about character, so long as its your side in power. I'd respect your position a little bit more if you were applying it to everyone equally.

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No, the fact that we only have sinners to choose from politically is entirely irrelevant to the conversation.

Fundies pimping their religious beliefs over a captive audience of children. What could possibly go wrong.

10 Commandments in school for historical/judicial/legal/societal underpinnings is fine.

Religious teaching, no. Parents/church. Then you got a bunch of damn Methodists and Episcopalians trying to corrupt yo' Baptist kids!