agracer said:

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EllisCoAg said:

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why is the offsides call so late, recent thing?? seems like the players expend a lot of energy until the play is done.

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Known I'm late here but I'd like to know as well. As a ref we're told to make sure the player is actually involved in active play, but Mbappe was way off and played the ball and 30s later the flag goes up.

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Yep it's bad for the players and bad for the fans
Just a terrible change
Reviewing hand balls 2 minutes later is just silly

Sports were way better without replay factored in

tysker said:

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What happens if a defender causes injury during professional foul and dogso because the ARs flag didn't go up. Players rely on the refs to call the game consistently.

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That's pretty much what happened when VVD had his knee blown up by Pickford back in 2020.

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12106351/liverpools-virgil-van-dijk-and-thiago-injured-against-everton

The real problem is with the offside rule itself. I'd love to see it disappear.

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/12249982/marco-van-basten-on-the-offside-law-why-it-should-be-scrapped-and-the-hockey-precedent-that-might-surprise

Beyond the offside rule, I think VAR is generally a good thing, but it blows my mind why certain situations aren't reviewable - the big one for me being GK v. Corner decisions.

Oh man if they used it for that it'd slow the game down way too much.

Hockey rules work b/c the puck stays in a confined area, the rink is tiny, and they have constant line changes.

Gaelic Football and Hurling rules don't have offsides and is probably more what you are looking for- Smaller penalty area where PK's are rewarded and only rule on "offsides" is you can't be inside the 6 yard box before the ball

very free flowing sports

We've all played or watched those indoor games with an offside line and sometimes even the 'two line pass' foul. It kinda works on the small field of play, on faster moving turf, and small goals, but I doubt it works well on a big field with grass

I have no problem with the offside rule itself, but I'd like to see the restrictions laxed. Make it to where we are talking below the waist in terms of what counts. If someone's arm is outstretched or they are leaning forward when the pass occurs, that shouldn't be offside.

I'd also definitely go with smaller penalty areas.

Just like in football nowdays the rule is to let the play continue if unsure and let replay sort it out

I have no issue with it however not all levels of soccer will have VAR

If you pick another point on the body or say "there must be daylight between the players" all you are doing is moving the line. You aren't solving the problem that VAR has created. And you are throwing out years of muscle memory from ARs.

Agree 100%. We will always groan whenever VAR is used to find the inch or two of offside, no matter where

And while I would love to see Van Basten's newest idea implemented (full abolition of the rule) - he had an older idea a few years ago (when he was FIFA technically director) that I think would be more palatable and a good starting point… drawing a line across the top of the box, and all forward passes initiated beyond that point are legal. It's utterly ridiculous when offside is called in those situations… especially when off rebounded shots. It has absolutely nothing to do with the intent of the rule (prevent cherry picking when they allowed forward passes). There's always defenders around. I'd argue you could probably even back up the line to the final third (and thereby also shrink the penalty area).

Some years ago they tried a hockey style blue line. I think it was in a lower English league. IIRC is was a disaster.

IMHO MLS handles it best. They don't draw any lines. All they do is use the mowing lines on the field as a gauge. And if they can't tell based in that they let the decision stand.

I would just let ARs make the call they need to make and only use VAR to reverse egregious instances where there is an offside player that the AR missed. They are trying to fix onside players called off by accident. Just let that go. Fix the offside player that is ignored.

I think a much bigger change would be in changing the PA from the large rectangle to an arc and cutting out what I would call capricious penalties out at the top corners.

It's still wild to me that MLS somehow does VAR the best in the world.

jeffk said:

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It's still wild to me that MLS somehow does VAR the best in the world.

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It's obvious. America loves scoring, the rest of the world hates it.

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I think a much bigger change would be in changing the PA from the large rectangle to an arc and cutting out what I would call capricious penalties out at the top corners.

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like the crease in handball or hockey?
Would make it harder for defenders to run an offside trap at the top of the box, unless they have a flat section.
Also would be much harder for rec leagues to mark off the curved lines. Squares are much easier to paint/chalk.

I mean make the PA an arc like 15 or 20 yards from the center of the goal.

yeah, i hate penalties being awarded in the top corner of the 18 yd box with a guy's back to goal, not dangerous, not really supported, not in position to send a ball in, zero chance of scoring a goal yet a goal is basically being awarded simply because it's a "foul in the box." An arc or crease bigger than the 6 yd goal box, but smaller than the 18 yd box wouldn't solve that completely, but it would at least mean most "fouls in the penalty area" are closer to the goal.


what might really solve it, is you only award a PK for DOGSO fouls. Any DOGSO foul, anywhere = PK from the spot. Any regular foul, even if inside the 18 yard box, if it's not a DOGSO, is just a regular free kick from where the foul occurred. If there's more than 10 yds to goal, defense can use a wall. If there's less than 10 yds to goal, it's like a PK, 1 v 1 with goalie, but you take it from the angle and distance of the foul; not from the 12 yd "spot" center of goal. I think that would prevent goals from being almost automatically awarded for fouls when there was zero chance of scoring, but it would also create more aggressive defending in the defensive third and make a low-scoring sport even lower scoring. So I don't know what the answer is. Just spit-balling here.

oh no said:

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what might really solve it, is you only award a PK for DOGSO fouls. Any DOGSO foul, anywhere = PK from the spot. Any regular foul, even if inside the 18 yard box, if it's not a DOGSO, is just a regular free kick from where the foul occurred. If there's more than 10 yds to goal, defense can use a wall. If there's less than 10 yds to goal, it's like a PK, 1 v 1 with goalie, but you take it from the angle and distance of the foul; not from the 12 yd "spot" center of goal. I think that would prevent goals from being almost automatically awarded for fouls when there was zero chance of scoring, but it would also create more aggressive defending in the defensive third and make a low-scoring sport even lower scoring. So I don't know what the answer is. Just spit-balling here.

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I like the idea except just make it 18 yards for any defensive player other than the keeper. In effect, you couldn't build a wall on a kick inside of the box. This would increase the drama and probably goals.

Much simpler way to solve all of this that doesn't involve redrawing lines, as many rules, etc...

...use the old NASL penalty kicks. I used to laugh at this idea but my God it would be fantastic. Its success rate is much lower than the current penalty kicks so it lessens the importance of a penalty kick while still being an advantage to the team taking the penalty kick. And it is much more replicative of the run of play.

Dre_00 said:

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Much simpler way to solve all of this that doesn't involve redrawing lines, as many rules, etc...

...use the old NASL penalty kicks. I used to laugh at this idea but my God it would be fantastic. Its success rate is much lower than the current penalty kicks so it lessens the importance of a penalty kick while still being an advantage to the team taking the penalty kick. And it is much more replicative of the run of play.

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https://snavely.substack.com/p/how-the-nasl-penalty-speaks-the-game