RBI for Altuve in the All-Star game

Altuve

Our front office knows what it's doing.

The problem the front office has right now is that they sold off every asset we had at the big league level and completely put the big league team in the crapper. Nobody goes to the games except the opposing teams fans. Now, the one benefit of doing this is getting the #1 pick which we have absolutely imploded on this year. If they don't sign Aiken it will not bode well for future draft picks because the agent world is already suspicious of the way the Astros do things.
Anybody who can't see this has blinders on. They have mishandled this Aiken deal so badly its an black eye for the organization. Of course it isn't a surprise seeing how they were trying to get Kolek to give a nice hometown discount before the draft so they could go after some other guys behind him at above slot. Its a great idea but you can't pick 1,1 and try to convince a kid to take a big discount when he has no guarantee of ever making it to the big leagues.

quote:

---

Its a great idea but you can't pick 1,1 and try to convince a kid to take a big discount when he has no guarantee of ever making it to the big leagues.

---

Do you even know what's goin on? Maybe I'm confused but, you're not making much sense to me.

We're not trying to convince Aiken to take a discount. We're arguing that he's a medical risk and therefore not worth the money he's asking.

And you're right...There is no guarantee he makes the big leagues, but this is a bigger risk to the organization since we're the ones paying him.

That's part of the choice these guys have. Take the money now and recoup some when you prove yourself or pass on the dough all together and go to school for a couple years to sign for a bigger amount when you're drafted higher. Aiken loses a good bit of leverage since he can't go any higher than 1.1.

I have faith in Lunhow and how we're running things and I expect him to sign.

[This message has been edited by Ag_07 (edited 7/16/2014 10:31a).]

did you even read my post? They asked Kolek to sign at a discount if they picked him. He wouldn't do it so they went with Aiken and now we are in a colossal mess. Do you not realize what losing out on the #1 pick means?

How many days do we have left?

How many days do we have left?

Think Friday is the deadline.

Yeah I read the post but I'm still confused on how the organization is being shady and how that affects future draft picks?

What's wrong with trying to sign draft picks for lower money to sign more picks? Isn't that essentially what we did with Correa? Wasn't shady back then when it worked.

I think the Astros botched this one by not doing their due diligence and catching this elbow issue earlier. That is why I think people are saying we're trying to pull a fast one. Like we know we have the leverage and we're making up this issue to sign him for less money.

quote:

---

In response to how so, the Astros will not be a destination for players as long as the front office is thought of as shady. Boras and Close are already both very critical of the organization and what those guys think matters big time.

---

Feldman, Crain, Albers, Qualls didn't have a problem taking their money.

This is literally the first time an issue has popped up with the Astros. You're overreacting.

Can teams perform physicals on prospects before the draft? I feel like whoever picked Aiken would've had this problem. Reminds me of what happened to Loux a few years back.

quote:

---

did you even read my post? They asked Kolek to sign at a discount if they picked him. He wouldn't do it so they went with Aiken and now we are in a colossal mess. Do you not realize what losing out on the #1 pick means?

---

So Kolek turns down a discounted deal from the Astros and then signs for $6 million as the #2 pick, an over $800k discount. Is the Miami FO shady?

Feldman Crain Albers and qualls aren't difference makers. Also kolek said all along that 6 mil was his number. The Astros wanted to go closer to 5. Also correa was a reach at the time with the first pick which enabled the Astros to sign him at a bigger discount.

Mr Bond - I believe the deadline is Friday.

If he doesn't sign, the qualifying offer guarantees we get the #2 pick next year (the way I understand it)

Guys, the Astros will be fine even if Aiken doesn't sign. Aiken wouldn't have been up at the major league level for at least 3-4 years. There's more than enough talent in the system, even with Appel struggling. Although Correa's injury is a big setback. Luhnow knows what he is doing. He is one of the best in the business, regardless of how people perceive him.

I'm loving me some Hernadez though. Hope he can keep up his numbers and energy level. Love what he's brought to the table.

Lets tap the breaks on one of the best in the business. I'm a Lunhow fan but he has absolutely no track record to be able to claim he is one of the best in the business. 3 or 4 years from now we may be able to make that claim.

Lunhow may not have the track record yet but he's well on his way. You can't judge it just by the big league team. It's a big picture thing.

He's taken us from the worst farm system in the majors (by far) to one the top in just 3-4 years.

I think he's done a helluva job. He's turned some players that we thought no one wanted into assets.

TREX01, he turned a complete CF of a franchise, completely rebuilt the farm system, and is on the cusp of having a decent major league ballclub. All in 3 years. And all on a penny pincher's budget. If that's not incredible, I'm not sure what is.

Lets see, top players on this years team.

Altuve
Springer
keuchel
cosart
singleton
Castro

Can't give Lunhow credit for guys he didn't bring into the program. Granted most of his players haven't been in the system very long so they haven't had the chance to make a big impact. I wasn't a fan of Ed Wade but he did leave us with the guys listed above.

No McHugh, Qualls, or Fowler on that list? Or just homegrown players?

I just wanted to point out that he did walk into a little talent in the system. Albeit not much

quote:

---

I don't think you can pin Appel on Lunhow.

Everyone projected him as the No. 1 pick and even as the safe pick. Anyone would've picked 1.1 and if we wouldn't have he would've gone 1.2.

No one saw it coming.

---

You are exactly right. Theo Epstein is on the record saying Mark Appel was at the top of their board and Bryant was #2.

quote:

---

while we're talking about struggling 1st round draft picks...how much longer is Jason Castro going to be an astro? (2008 1st round pick #10 overall)

I don't know if the 'Stanford curse' existed back then, but he looks like another Cardinal bust.

2014 numbers so far: .232 BA, 8 HR, 26 RBI, .386 SLG, .690 OPS

and perhaps the worst number...he's already 27 years old. Not a young pup anymore. Another Ed Wade masterstroke it appears. 2014 salary is $2.45 million. At least his arbitration case is weak

---

Catcher goes well beyond the offensive numbers. Castro has become an above average pitch framer. Fangraphs has him at 1.0 WAR and both Fangraphs projection systems peg him at around 2.0 WAR at the end of the season. He's league average, but we know that he is capable of being very good with some BABIP luck. He just needs to reduce his K rate.

quote:

---

They have mishandled this Aiken deal so badly its an black eye for the organization.

---

Honestly, how have they mishandled this? That's like saying you screwed up at driving when you were sitting at a stop sign and got rear-ended by a drunk driver.

Aiken was a consensus 1.1 that had the cleanest mechanics in the draft (hence a low injury risk). When the physical revealed that he, according to the Chronicle, is missing a large portion of his UCL, he is no longer a consensus 1.1. If the MLB teams had known this about him prior to the draft, he would have easily fell to the 3rd round or beyond.

You can't see the forest for the trees that his agent has planted right in front of you if you believe the Astros are the only bad guys here.

One of my fellow writers on the Crawfishboxes had a perfect analogy. Let's say you buy a house. You and the seller agree to a price of $100 K. The house gets inspected. The inspector finds out that there is the foundation has several cracks that are harmless now, but are the precursor to major issues down the line. If you are going to buy this house with all of these major faults, you are about to lower your asking price. It's negotiating 101. What's the seller going to do? Probably try to undersell the issues and claim your inspector is blowing things out of proportion.







The devil is all in the details ladies and gentleman. Look very carefully at what Aiken's agent says when he comments on Aiken's health.

quote:

---

"Casey Close, told FOXSports.com that Aiken 'has been seen by some of the most experienced and respected orthopedic arm specialists in the country, and all of those doctors have acknowledged that he’s not injured and that he’s ready to start his professional career.'"

---

The Astros aren't claiming that he is currently injured or that he can't "start" his professional career. They also aren't paying him millions to "start" his career. He is getting paid based on his ceiling... his potential. If the Chronicle's source is right, and he is missing part of his UCL to where Tommy John can't even fix him... his potential and ceiling just shot way the hell down.


DO NOT LET AIKEN'S AGENT'S PROPAGANDA GET TO YOU.


This sucks really bad for both sides.





Finally, read this if you haven't yet.http://www.crawfishboxes.com/2014/7/16/5904605/an-aiken-elbow-more-info-comes-to-light

quote:

---

I think the Astros botched this one by not doing their due diligence and catching this elbow issue earlier.

---

There is no way in hell you can catch this abnormality without an MRI. Teams cannot do pre-draft physicals like the combine in the NFL. Luhnow is one of the biggest advocates of a pre-draft physical.

There is no amount of due diligence that could have caught this. This is just a flat out piece of pure $H!T luck for the Astros.

[This message has been edited by irish pete ag06 (edited 7/16/2014 3:10p).]

Good info irish.

I just assumed they did all that prior to the draft.

And honestly I'm not concerned about missing on Aiken as A) we get the 2nd pick next year and B) Lunhow has shown that in MLB its really more about quantity over quality when looking at prospects.

Now if we were signing draftees at the rate of the previous regime then I'd be worried.

[This message has been edited by Ag_07 (edited 7/16/2014 3:26p).]

quote:

---

One of my fellow writers on the Crawfishboxes had a perfect analogy. Let's say you buy a house. You and the seller agree to a price of $100 K. The house gets inspected. The inspector finds out that there is the foundation has several cracks that are harmless now, but are the precursor to major issues down the line. If you are going to buy this house with all of these major faults, you are about to lower your asking price. It's negotiating 101. What's the seller going to do? Probably try to undersell the issues and claim your inspector is blowing things out of proportion.

---

As a Realtor, this is a perfect analogy.

Very well put, pete. It really sounds like a crap deal for both the Astros and Aiken.

quote:

---

Aiken was a consensus 1.1

---

Ill disagree with this statement, but agree with the rest.

quote:

---

quote:

---

Aiken was a consensus 1.1

---

Ill disagree with this statement, but agree with the rest.

---

Disagree all you want but it's true

Damn near consensus if not consensus...


MLB - Jim Callis
http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/prospects/watch/y2014/#list=draft

Baseball-America
http://www.baseballamerica.com/college/2014-top-100-draft-prospects-list/

Don't feel like digging up the rest, plus Baseball Prospectus is behind a paywall...

By the sound of the info in the article posted above, Aiken's camp is posturing and would have to be crazy not to sign for whatever the Astros are offering. At this point, with as big of a risk as he is now, wouldnt the Astros probably prefer he not even sign and be satisfied with 2nd overall next year? Its obvious he doesnt go anywhere near 1.1 if this prognosis came to light before the draft. And like some others here are saying, i'm completely confused how this in any way makes the Astros look bad.

Crappy situation. Kind of feel like the Astros should have found this out before they drafted him. Hard to blame the kid but ultimately, I agree, stros are better off not signing him.

quote:

---

Kind of feel like the Astros should have found this out before they drafted him.

---

There is simply no way they could have without fundamentally changing the draft to allowing pre-draft physicals.

So Aiken is truly injured? Last I saw it was being debated that he wasn't injured at all and was in fact throwing currently.

Appel 1.2 innings, 7 hits , 7 runs