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I was assured on this board that it was a "fight"

Weird that in said "fight" that one person got suspended 8x more than the other. Guess Odor wasn't in the right after all.

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Murder carries a heavier sentence than being murdered. What's so hard to understand about this?

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FIFY for better context with this discussion.

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I was assured on this board that it was a "fight"

Weird that in said "fight" that one person got suspended 8x more than the other. Guess Odor wasn't in the right after all.

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Neither one was in the right.

A punch is entirely outside the realm of a game, unlike a slide, though, and I would agree Odor's punishment is appropriately longer because it was completely and utterly outside anything "baseball."

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I don't think knowingly committing an illegal slide with malicious intent is inside the realm of the game.

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Or we could go with the code and discuss player's taking out their aggression on the player that "wronged" them. Why go after the ex-con that hit you with the pitch and was only about 40 feet away at the time when you can just make a cheap slide against the guy playing 2nd?

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Was Matt Bush on the bench last year when Bautista tossed the bat? Were his feelings personally when that happened?

No. The guy was in prison. He had nothing to do with it. So, this is bit of a non sequitur from the start.


Also, how is Bautista supposed to get back at Bush if he won't let Bautista swing at a pitch?

I guess he can charge the mound but point is it's a slippery slope when Bush probably didn't even see the bat toss last year.

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Sliding is a part of the game. Punching in no form.

They have rules to regulate slides and process for punishing it. Odor took justice into his own hands and every league is going to frown upon that with a heavy hand.

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Except the NHL, in which Donaldson would be the only one penalized as the "3rd man in".

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I was assured on this board that it was a "fight"

Weird that in said "fight" that one person got suspended 8x more than the other. Guess Odor wasn't in the right after all.

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Neither one was in the right.

A punch is entirely outside the realm of a game, unlike a slide, though, and I would agree Odor's punishment is appropriately longer because it was completely and utterly outside anything "baseball."

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I don't think knowingly committing an illegal slide with malicious intent is inside the realm of the game.

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I get what you're says but yeah, it is. Malicious intent aside, the slide by definition makes it part of the "realm of the game".

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So as long as I disguise my attack as something resembling an action you take in a game it's ok?

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Did I say that at all?

Of course it wasn't OK. That's the first thing I said in this thread.


Reading comprehension.

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So as long as I disguise my attack as something resembling an action you take in a game it's ok?

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It would appear so, yes.

Wasn't responding to you in that post. So yeah. Reading comprehension.

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Was Matt Bush on the bench last year when Bautista tossed the bat? Were his feelings personally when that happened?

No. The guy was in prison. He had nothing to do with it. So, this is bit of a non sequitur from the start.


Also, how is Bautista supposed to get back at Bush if he won't let Bautista swing at a pitch?

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It's that "taking up for your teammates" thing, I suppose. I imagine the rest of the Rangers team is quite pleased with Bush right now.

IMO the passive-aggressiveness of Bautista's slide is the least admirable quality of all. And it is no coincidence as to why Bautista ended up the ass-kickee. If someone tried to hurt you, go take care of business against the guy that did. Putting some other player at risk of injury because you didn't have the sack to charge the mound and face the guy that did, as players have done since the league began, is weak. The "inside the ream of the game" stuff is garbage.

I was in the line but I'll rephrase, did anyone say that?

Nope.

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Was Matt Bush on the bench last year when Bautista tossed the bat? Were his feelings personally when that happened?

No. The guy was in prison. He had nothing to do with it. So, this is bit of a non sequitur from the start.


Also, how is Bautista supposed to get back at Bush if he won't let Bautista swing at a pitch?

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It's that "taking up for your teammates" thing, I suppose. I imagine the rest of the Rangers team is quite pleased with Bush right now.

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FWIW, I know part of the league is happy for Bautista for trying to take out Odor after aome of the dirty stuff Odor has tried in his career.

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I was in the line but I'll rephrase, did anyone say that?

Nope.

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It was in the context of Moore's comment who understood my point fine and wasn't directed at you.

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I was in the line but I'll rephrase, did anyone say that?

Nope.

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It was in the context of Moore's comment who understood my point fine and wasn't directed at you.

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I get what you're saying too.

You're still making things up here,

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Was Matt Bush on the bench last year when Bautista tossed the bat? Were his feelings personally when that happened?

No. The guy was in prison. He had nothing to do with it. So, this is bit of a non sequitur from the start.


Also, how is Bautista supposed to get back at Bush if he won't let Bautista swing at a pitch?

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It's that "taking up for your teammates" thing, I suppose. I imagine the rest of the Rangers team is quite pleased with Bush right now.

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FWIW, I know part of the league is happy for Bautista for trying to take out Odor after aome of the dirty stuff Odor has tried in his career.

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Bush didn't need to be on the field in the playoffs last year. Oftentimes pitchers retaliate against a player even though they had no connection to the original event. As was mentioned above, it's just viewed as "taking up for your teammates". And Bautista, if he was bent on revenge for being hit, could have charged the mound against the guy that actually hit him.

And you may be right about some in the league being happy, but according to Buster Olney, Odor is viewed as a "legend" now around the league for what he did.

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Bush didn't need to be on the field in the playoffs last year. Oftentimes pitchers retaliate against a player even though they had no connection to the original event. As was mentioned above, it's just viewed as "taking up for your teammates". And Bautista, if he was bent on revenge for being hit, could have charged the mound against the guy that actually hit him.

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And if you think about it, lots of times a guy hits a big HR and then later in the game, against a RP, or even the next night against a completely different SP, gets plunked.

Or the next guy in the lineup, who had nothing to do with any of it, gets plunked

I get it but I'm saying you can't really go after Bautista for "going after someone not involved in event" when Bush was in prison and has as little to do with it as anyone in either clubhouse.

Bush hit the guy that flipped the bat. Bautista didn't go after the guy that hit him with the pitch. See how this works? Bautista picking out Odor is the outlier, much as if Bush decided to hit Justin Smoak because Bautista flipped his bat. That wouldn't make sense, would it? You go after the guy that did dirty, no?

the guys that go after someone else are weak.

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I was in the line but I'll rephrase, did anyone say that?

Nope.

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It was in the context of Moore's comment who understood my point fine and wasn't directed at you.

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I get what you're saying too.

You're still making things up here,

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Didn't make anything up then skippy. It wasn't a difficult exchange to follow. It was logical extension of the notion that attacks that look like baseball moves are somehow more acceptable and in the realm of the game.

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I get it but I'm saying you can't really go after Bautista for "going after someone not involved in event" when Bush was in prison and has as little to do with it as anyone in either clubhouse.

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But his gripe was with being hit by the pitch. The guy that hit him was closer to him than Odor. He instead chose to go after Odor in a way that could have seriously injured someone, plus cost his team a chance at a rally. The guy he had a problem w/ was Bush. Bush was right there to deal with.

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Bush hit the guy that flipped the bat. Bautista didn't go after the guy that hit him with the pitch. See how this works? Bautista picking out Odor is the outlier, much as if Bush decided to hit Justin Smoak because Bautista flipped his bat. That wouldn't make sense, would it? You go after the guy that did dirty, no?

the guys that go after someone else are weak.

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I think it's weak to get the scrub minor league pickup to come in late in the last game and do the clubs dirty work...

And then it gets richer getting mad at Bautista sliding into Odor hard.

FWIW, I've read several times that it was about more than the HBP between Odor and Bautista.

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I was in the line but I'll rephrase, did anyone say that?

Nope.

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It was in the context of Moore's comment who understood my point fine and wasn't directed at you.

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I get what you're saying too.

You're still making things up here,

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Didn't make anything up then skippy. It wasn't a difficult exchange to follow. It was logical extension of the notion that attacks that look like baseball moves are somehow more acceptable and in the realm of the game.

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More acceptable does not mean OK.

I think just about everyone here agrees what Bautista did wasn't OK and he needed punishment from the league.

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I get it but I'm saying you can't really go after Bautista for "going after someone not involved in event" when Bush was in prison and has as little to do with it as anyone in either clubhouse.

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But his gripe was with being hit by the pitch. The guy that hit him was closer to him than Odor. He instead chose to go after Odor in a way that could have seriously injured someone, plus cost his team a chance at a rally. The guy he had a problem w/ was Bush. Bush was right there to deal with.

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And to continue this line, why even go after Odor at all UNLESS the intent was to injure and do damage to the team as a whole by taking out one of their best (and being too cowardly to go after Beltre, who IS the best)?

Assuming the pitch was intentional, I had the impression that Bush did it on his own. Tough ex-con new to the team. What better way to make some new friends in the clubhouse.

If you have paid any attention to the Rangers bullpen, there are several scrubs in there that could have done the job before now. Bush is looking like anything but a scrub.

They could have hit Bautista long before if they wanted to. And it's not like waiting prevented retaliation. Bautista retaliated once (he just ****ed it up), and then Chavez retaliated a second time.

Ok is being used with a dose of sarcasm. Thought that was apparent. Maybe not in text.

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I think it's weak to get the scrub minor league pickup to come in late in the last game and do the clubs dirty work...

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I don't believe this was ordered by Bannister. It would make no sense given the situation in the game. If it was intentional, I believe it was Bush's decision. Not Bannister's.

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And then it gets richer getting mad at Bautista sliding into Odor hard.

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It was an illegal, dirty slide. Just like the Angels fans have a right to gripe about Odor's slides last year.

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FWIW, I've read several times that it was about more than the HBP between Odor and Bautista.

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I am not aware of any connection between Odor and Bautista. I don't see any reason, in particular, for Bautista to go after Odor, or whoever may have been on 2nd during that play. Bautista was mad about getting hit. There's no love lost between the two clubs, especially due to the ALDS last year (and it wasn't just the bat flip, but beer cans hitting babies, trash being thrown on the field, etc). I have no doubt that Bautista was motivated by more than just the HBP, and he would have went in dirty on anyone covering 2nd. But, if he doesn't get HBP there, but instead gets a single, I don't think he goes in like that. He was mad about being hit, and adding that to the already tense relationship between the two clubs, he chose to go after someone who had nothing to do with it when the real target of his ire was on the mound.

Meh. I still think it rich to go after Bautista for involving someone other than Bush.

Bush acted because the rest of the team got thet feelings hurt...and they're going to embrace him Bush for throwing at Bautista?

Yeah, I think anyone on the Rangers roster shouldn't complain if they were who took the retaliation.

(Apart from I dislike much of the retaliation mindset in the first place.)

BTW, watch for that "minor league scrub" to shut the AL West's ass down with 98mph fastballs for the rest of 2016.

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BTW, watch for that "minor league scrub" to shut the AL West's ass down with 98mph fastballs for the rest of 2016.

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That'd be fine by me.

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(Apart from I dislike much of the retaliation mindset in the first place.)

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This I'll wholeheartedly agree with. I don't condone what either side did.

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I get it but I'm saying you can't really go after Bautista for "going after someone not involved in event" when Bush was in prison and has as little to do with it as anyone in either clubhouse.

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You are so ******* dense, it hurts my head.

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MLB is majorly protecting the blue jays with these suspensions

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Understatement.

I don't have a problem with harsh punishments, but Batista getting off with one game is criminal. I don't understand why a guy is suspended solely because he connected. Batista was clearly going to throw a punch himself. MLB, are you saying that is OK? Intent is not an issue if you can't follow through on your intent because you get cold cocked first?

Oh, and don't forget that Batista started it with the slide.

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Bush hit the guy that flipped the bat. Bautista didn't go after the guy that hit him with the pitch. See how this works? Bautista picking out Odor is the outlier, much as if Bush decided to hit Justin Smoak because Bautista flipped his bat. That wouldn't make sense, would it? You go after the guy that did dirty, no?

the guys that go after someone else are weak.

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I think it's weak to get the scrub minor league pickup to come in late in the last game and do the clubs dirty work...

And then it gets richer getting mad at Bautista sliding into Odor hard.

FWIW, I've read several times that it was about more than the HBP between Odor and Bautista.

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I hope we can find more "scrub" minor league pickups like Bush.


Good call