Whats in your wine cellar?

1,901,145 Views | 12987 Replies | Last: 13 hrs ago by Objective Aggie
Whoa Nellie
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AG
SupermachJM said:

Also, the pairing at the Mayo Family Reserve Room was spectacular when we went. Much more of a lunch sized meal than the standard light bites pairings that most wineries out that way do, and the wines were great!

This. The Mayo Family Reserve Room has been one of our favorites. It alone is worth the drive from Napa to Sonoma.
Objective Aggie
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Birthday celebrations continue in Dana Point.



jh0400
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It's a grocery store cab franc kind of night. For $20 it's hard to beat.
BSD
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I love Dana Point. My buddy has a beach house out there that I need to utilize more.
QBCade
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Nice night in Napa. I preferred the Schrader, buddy Futo. Schrader really needed the 4+hr decant


SupermachJM
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My Sam's Club Today….about had a heart attack. The wife won't be happy but definitely stocking up!
SupermachJM
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Had to crack it open and compare to a great bottle from Mosel! The wife prefers the Molitor but I give a slight edge to the Trimbach. Both are bone dry and going amazing with the schnitzel we made tonight!
EclipseAg
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EclipseAg said:

Stumbled across the Substack article linked below on the situation facing Napa wine producers. Turns out the author has written a series of articles on the topic -- discussing the growth of downtown tasting rooms and their impacts on winery visits; the damaging nature of wine scores; the sameness of marketing language; the challenges different types of owners face; and other relevant issues.

I didn't recognize the name right away, but he's the co-founder of Long Meadow Ranch in the valley, and a guy with a long history of business consulting. So he has a little bit of expertise.

Anyway, worth a read if you're interested in the future of Napa wines. From this one link you can find the rest of his recent articles.

https://ted241.substack.com/p/the-great-napa-valley-overpour

Here's the latest in this series. Really, really good.

Hall's point is that much of Napa needs to change its focus from collectables to wines that can be enjoyed today to enhance community and conversation.

https://ted241.substack.com/p/part-ii-life-beyond-the-score
Objective Aggie
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AG
Did someone say Trimbach?

Hanging with beautiful people at RH Ocean in Newport.


Objective Aggie
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SupermachJM said:

My Sam's Club Today….about had a heart attack. The wife won't be happy but definitely stocking up!



Which Sam's Club
FriendlyAg
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This is a great read.
jh0400
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That would require a change in winemaking practices, because for me the aversion to acid is my biggest complaint about Napa wines. 99% or the time when we drink wine it's with a meal. If it's not paired with a meal, we're drinking something like Provence rose or Sancerre.

The price points are another problem, but the biggest issue is the drinkability outside of a steakhouse.
cecil77
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I few years ago I checked the pH of the wines we drank.

Old world, and some new world (e.g. Inwood) were all around 3.65 Napa was at least 3.9 and some up to 4.2.
HTownAg98
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I would argue that a lot of the Napa cabs don't pair well with steaks either. Those over-extracted, low tannin, low acid wines aren't food friendly.
cecil77
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HTownAg98 said:

I would argue that a lot of the Napa cabs don't pair well with steaks either. Those over-extracted, low tannin, low acid wines aren't food friendly.


Agree. The reason steak goes so well w/ red wine is that the drying sensation on your palette is proteins in your saliva being made water insoluble by the tannins in the wine. By pairing w/ steak, you're supplying much more protein for the tannins to react with, so the overall palette sensation softer. And a decent level of acid in the wine helps break down the fat in the steak.
SupermachJM
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Grapevine
FriendlyAg
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SupermachJM said:

It still amazes me how many Texans overlook how great of a wine scene we have going on here in Texas. Majority of my neighbors in our neighborhood wine club either don't realize Texas makes wine or have preconceived notions that our wine is swill. I've tried to broaden their horizons by bringing some good stuff and for the most part they're really impressed once they get past their preconceptions.

And you don't have to go 4 hours from DFW to the Hill Country to find good stuff either. There's a dozen or so great wineries within an hour drive of the metroplex. I just wish our stuff were getting more recognition - it bothers me how many local restaurants proclaim to be 'farm to table' and 'eat local' but then have the same swill wine list from the distributor with the same 10 wines.

Side note - still need to come see you at Inwood! We were members up here for a few years but the times we went to the Fbg location there was someone else working those days.


I live in Grapevine too. I have been to most of the places on Main Street and most of the wineries in Fredericksburg.

What are your favorites? I haven't tried inwood, I'll admit that.

The winery on Main Street that I think is the best for the Texas wines I have tried is Bingham. We liked their southern Rhone whites. I think they sell single varietal marsanne and a roussane. I remember both being good and good chilled during the summer. I think they also sell a Tempranillo (I believe?) reserve which had 5-6 years of age on it and that was tasty.

Most of the other stuff I find to be downright terrible to just meh. I just spent two weeks in north east Spain along the coast and into the Languendoc and for 15-20 bucks I could find a lot of cheap wine that my taste buds feel like generally tastes better for the price.

I tried Calais wines and thought those were really good for Texas. I liked some of his white wines to be a little better than the reds.

Most of my cellar is old world stuff - BDX daily drinkers, Loire valley, Rhone wines. I pretty much like any white that is saline and crisp - etna bianco, txokoli, xarello, albarino. Love me some riesling and love me some Italians.

I think if I step back and analyze what I like the most from the old world and from the new world (Santa Barbara, finger lakes, and Oregon) I like acid in my wines and while I like fruit, I prefer fruit to not be the main character. I like wines that I can drink with food.

That's also probably why I liked that article linked to Ted Hall's Substack.

/end rant
Objective Aggie
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Laguna. God bless california corkage.

Also horns down.

* * * * Just a warning, I am the worst typist on texags.
cecil77
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Quote:

I haven't tried inwood, I'll admit that.


We can fix it hat!
SupermachJM
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The problem in Texas is that it's difficult to maintain acid in the wine due to the climatic conditions here. As I'm sure you're aware, usually you see higher acid in cooler climates which is obviously not here. You will see a lot of wine makers acidify after taking must measurements at crush.
When comparing to other regions for QPR you have to realize that Texas winegrowers aren't subsidized like the Europeans. The Europeans have been doing this for centuries whereas the oldest wineries in TX are only approaching 50 or so. There's a lot higher cost of doing business here with land prices, lack of subsidies, transportation, equipment, etc. Imagine trying to buy 100 acres in Napa now vs. the 70s and you'll see why it has quickly turned into a rich man's game (and why the joke of how to become a millionaire by starting a winery is so often told).
I don't disagree that 9 times out of 10 I can get a ros from Provence for half the price of a domestic one that's just as good if not better. What Texas needs to try to do is focus on ways to bring costs down while still maintaining quality and not going back to our old reputation of having bad quality stuff. It's hard when a local wine bar has to choose between a bottle they get for $7 wholesale or a bottle of Texas wine that the winery can't sell for less than $17. I've seen this firsthand and it's frustrating because bars aren't willing to take a smaller margin to make local products competitively priced even when producers are selling to them at a 50% discount from their tasting room price.

Anyway, I'll step off of my soap box.

To answer your question, I agree that 90% of Main Street grapevine is garbage tourist trap wine, and that Bingham is by far the best with Landon coming in a distant second for me. Bingham stuff is pretty decent quality but some of their vintages have been hit or miss. We tend to go there as our go-to local wine bar and have gotten to know the employees over the years. Their Tempranillo and Merlot are usually pretty killer consistently from year to year.

If you like crisp and saline whites, start looking for anyone producing a Picpoul Blanc. It's a relatively new varietal to Texas for the south of France. It grows really well here and has high acidity and I usually get a bit of salinity too.

If you can get up north, Five Fifty-Five (for their reds moreso than their whites in my opinion), Edge of the Lake, Arche, and Red River Winery & Provisions are all within about an hour of Grapevine and all make wines ranging from pretty good to great with Texoma grown grapes. The Syrah and Chardonnay at Arche are killer, as are the Tempranillos at 555 and Red River. Red River is doing some Spanish style whites that are also really great and true to the style, as well as a Picpoul. Edge of the Lake has some fun blends and their Petit Verdot is really good. They also have an off-dry white that they back-sweetened with agave nectar which is definitely unconventional but very unique and surprisingly good. (I know, not your style but it's one that I always find fun to mention).

Inwood also has a tasting room near the Dallas Design District that's open for limited hours on Saturdays. I'd recommend going down and checking them out to try their wines. Cecil can obviously talk more to their stuff but Dan has put a lot of blood, sweat, and tears into bringing highly pedigreed grapevine clones into Texas and making the highest possible quality wine from them.

I feel like a lot of Texas wineries are trying to go the more approachable route of not needing to be 'food wines'. Look for Tannat, Sagrantino, and Cab Franc in the hill country as I find those to generally be less lush and overly jammy like a lot of other reds tend to be. Sagrantino is specifically my favorite varietal in Texas due to the amount of tannin it maintains even in this heat. It's a really interesting grape and makes fun wine.

My favorite wineries down in the hill country are William Chris and their associated brands (specifically Uplift), Hilmy, Pebble Rock, Ron Yates, Slate Theory, Hye Meadow, 12 fires, Michael Ros, and Sandy Road.
William Chris is one of the OG's who has really put Texas on the map, and people have varying opinions of them due to how much press they have received. Personally I think Chris is a great Aggie and representative of Texas Wine on a large scale and I think everything they put out is of high quality. If you're into Rhone wines they should be your stop #1.

Pebble Rock and 12 fires are both other Aggie-owned wineries making good stuff. Pebble rock specifically is a great experience due to how hands on their winemaker is. Their tasting is super intimate - Rob and his wife Lydia own and run the place basically by themselves. Their Teroldego is one of my favorite wines from Texas, hands down, followed closely by their Sagrantino.


Calais is good but definitely on the pricier side for what you get. William Chris has started to get up there in recent years. Like I said before, I wish we could get Texas prices down from where they are now into the $10-$20 range, but it just isn't feasible given the costs here. This is something that John Rivenburgh of Kerrville Hills (former president of the Texas Winegrowers Association) has been pushing for as of late too. He agrees to get more market segment Tx wines need to be able to compete on the shelf price wise (and not just the big box guys at HEB like Llano, Becker, and Messina Hof).

Anyway, sorry for the dissertation. Let me know if you need any other specific recommendations or want more details on any of the wineries I've listed. I'm near you too and have plenty of good Texas wine that I'm happy to pop a cork on and share if you're ever interested.
EclipseAg
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SupermachJM said:

Look for Tannat, Sagrantino, and Cab Franc in the hill country as I find those to generally be less lush and overly jammy like a lot of other reds tend to be.

Speaking of Texas cab franc, we went to this event last year and it was a blast. This year, Calais Winery is joining the lineup along with the original four, Lost Draw, Ron Yates, William Chris and Signor.

The fruit is grown by Friesen Vineyards in West Texas and the winemakers do their best with it.

https://friesenfrancoff.com/
cecil77
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Thanks so much for taking the time/effort!

I would add two wineries to your list. Hawk Shadow outside Dripping Springs. Doug makes some very good wine and knows wine. He has a decent First Growth selection in his personal collection and regularly drinks fine wine with his friends. You'd be surprised just how uncommon that is among some Texas winemakers.

Also Blackmon Wines Bill is the "William" in William Chris. He's beginning to make fine wine out of Mason, Texas.

Also thanks for the kind (and accurate) words regarding Dan/Spencer and Inwood. Dan and I are "brothers from a different mother" - I am four weeks his elder and not quite a foot shorter though. Dan avoids one of the primary seductions of aging (we are 71 now) which is getting to where "I know what I know". Dan and Spencer are constantly pushing the envelope on wine production, always learning, always trying new things, ready to adopt new beliefs and new techniques. Inwood's sorting stack, ending in optical is as good as the industry offers, albeit a smaller version than the big boys. They monitor Bordeaux for the latest vinting techniques and communicate regularly with industry sources. The results show in the wine.

Quote:

I wish we could get Texas prices down from where they are now into the $10-$20 range, but it just isn't feasible given the costs here.


I've got to very strongly disagree with you here, to the point that IMO that is precisely what the Texas wine industry doesn't need to do. It degrades any notion of Texas producing fine wine, and given the production levels of most Texas wineries is economically impossible to compete. Direct To Consumer is the only way. Wine distribution is struggling all over the world, Napa is (and has been) moving to DTC as much as they can.

The answer for Texas wine is to get harvest yields down as low as possible using the best and most precise vineyard techniques available - and then make the very best wines possible. I wish every Texas winery had a good hundred dollar bottle of wine. It's a difficult task and has to be accomplished with passion and commitment. For example, our Colos Tempranillo has been produced at 1-2 clusters per vine. The 2011 and 2017 vintages were priced at $225, the 2020 vintage was $285. It was an obviously whimsical comment, but after tasting the 2020 Colos, Alex MacDonald emailed me "I may have to give up on Napa Cabernet and focus on Texas Tempranillo". For the 2024 vintage, lab research indicated we could go to 4 clusters per vine and achieve 95% of the quality. The 2024 is priced at $195. A futures option last year at $150 (qty 6) or $125 (qty 12) damn near sold out the vintage.

The point being that the answer is quality, quality, quality. Wine quality if much more dependent upon what, who, and how than it is where. People will pay for high quality wine. What we don't need is one more bottle of mediocre forty dollar Texas wine.
jh0400
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Quote:

I would add two wineries to your list. Hawk Shadow outside Dripping Springs. Doug makes some very good wine and knows wine. He has a decent First Growth selection in his personal collection and regularly drinks fine wine with his friends. You'd be surprised just how uncommon that is among some Texas winemakers.


Is this a roundabout way to say that a lot of winemakers here don't make good wine because they don't know what good wine is supposed to taste like?
WestUAg
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Had a nice dinner with some friends last night. My buddy is running a new winery on Mt Veeder called Aerika Estate, he was in town and a few of us got together to try his wine and a few others.

The 05 Griotte Chambertin was the winner of the night
QBCade
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Nice. What year is the Maya? Lokoya?
WestUAg
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Maya was 16, amazing bottle.

The Lokoya is a 10 mt veeder, brought it to compare the Aerika mt veeder bottling. It was a solid bottle.
QBCade
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Nice. Maya is prob my fav CA wine. Enjoying this one tonite


cecil77
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jh0400 said:

Quote:

I would add two wineries to your list. Hawk Shadow outside Dripping Springs. Doug makes some very good wine and knows wine. He has a decent First Growth selection in his personal collection and regularly drinks fine wine with his friends. You'd be surprised just how uncommon that is among some Texas winemakers.


Is this a roundabout way to say that a lot of winemakers here don't make good wine because they don't know what good wine is supposed to taste like?


Wine is a passion and creating it is a bunch of science but is still an artistic endeavor. I would submit that a keen appreciation and pursuit of that art is really beneficial if you're attempting to create it.
WestUAg
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Let us know how it is. I'm sure it will be amazing
aggiedata
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What do yall think about this Napa Cab currently on LB? 69$


Texstralian
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I bought one bottle from an older vintage like this, maybe 08. I will not be fooled again. It was not with the LB price, much less their "best web" pricing. To be fair, we pnp so maybe it just needed a long decant. Either way, I'm saving my $$ to something better. Maybe one day I'll get to try some inwood wines. Better keep saving….
Texstralian
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Chipotlemonger
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Anyone ever tried much Zin from Chappellet? We were gifted a '16 and I'm looking forward to it.
WestUAg
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I'm a believer that anything from Chappell is good, especially if it's estate fruit.
QBCade
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Maya surprisingly came in 3rd. However, it was a little corked. If not, I bet it would've been 2nd. Margaux was just on another level


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