I have MRIs of my pancreas done every six months as part of a study on lesions / spots on pancreas which are poorly understood.

I am only 48 but if you want to to scan, look at it and discuss with your doctor friends what's going on, I am all for it.

So the pancreatic risk for me is somewhat mitigated.

If a green alien erupts from my stomach and starts singing Sinatra, I will update the board.

Let's be honest. A lot of the folks with "objections" about glp1 would be 100% on board with folks injecting themselves with teenage boy levels of testosterone.

Juicing is manly, science is not.

See comment above regarding Viagra and Rogaine.

Cmon fellas don't cheat on your bald spots and boners… putting the hard work so to speak.

Apparently the newest trend is women taking high doses of testosterone. Makes them horny like teenage boys. Also makes them grow beards and lose the hair on their heads, but who cares if you feel on fire all the time and want to go at it like a bunny on speed.

amercer said:

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Let's be honest. A lot of the folks with "objections" about glp1 would be 100% on board with folks injecting themselves with teenage boy levels of testosterone.

Juicing is manly, science is not.

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Then there are the smart ones who know: You want to run anabolics in parallel with GLP1s (in the right populations when you can) so you don't lose metabolically useful lean tissue while dropping weight. Most of these folks dropping weight on Tirzepatide and similar will look like death when they get down to target weight, and while that's still a medically useful result, it's highly non-optimal.

The real scandal? Our idiotic 90s legislation on anabolics, pharma's lack of financial incentive, and medical culture's fear of "abuse potential" have erased compounds that could mitigate nearly every downside of GLP1 therapy.

-20.9 lbs fat, +2.8 lbs lean, -1.7 lbs visceral fat in 15 weeks on 120mg testosterone cypionate, 80mg nandrolone decanoate, 7.5mg Tirzepatide (all dosages weekly). Labs? Perfect. I think my HDL even ticked up a few points on cycle - I guess the visceral fat reduction and metabolic improvements were more than enough to offset any dyslipidemia.

Once you're clearing high six, low seven figures and start paying out of pocket for actual care, you stop being a patient and start seeing what real medicine looks like not the insurance scam built on gatekeeping and CYA charts. This isn't a flex, it's an indictment - we're denying real care to people who can't afford specialty concierge medical providers.

The sad thing is, all this is insanely cheap compared to GLP1s. We just deny this care to folks who are reliant on employment-sponsored health insurance plans and in-the-system docs (read: front men for a system that won't even allow them to prescribe non-approved dosages or dose forms - you get what the FDA approved and what Walgreens stocks, that's it).

Real medical care (like adding lean tissue while simultaneously shredding subcutaneous and visceral fat and repairing metabolism) is what we withhold from the average person because of regulatory inertia and profit structures. I have no doubt I'll piss off a few physicians on this forum advocating for nandrolone of all things as being a medically responsible compound in conjunction with testosterone and GLP1s. But the truth is, I can run an entire cycle with heavy monitoring for half a year for what a single month of Mounjaro costs - the anabolics, the labwork, everthing.

Meanwhile, we've got folks arguing here we shouldn't even be paying for the good but still mediocre results of GLP1 only therapy. I really don't know what to say hearing that folks would like to see America remain physically degenerate, the nexus of bad government policy sponsored by industrial agriculture and cost-minimized neglectful medical care out of some notion of personal responsibility, or how fat kids somehow morally bear the responsibility of their parents bad decisions. I'm tired of seeing an America full of fat ****s, let's stop being degenerate - whatever the cost.

Every fat person I know that got their stomach stapled is back to being fat. I'm pretty sure this will play out no differently because you haven't addressed the root cause of most people being fat. Poor self discipline and access to cheap, garbage food.

aggiehawg said:

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BudAg97 said:

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I don't get the hate for GLP-1 medications.

But there does seem to be a contingent of people who get really angry about other people choosing to use this medication for weight loss.

If it helps people and they want to partake, so be it. If you don't care to partake, don't.

It's not like someone else taking it harms you.

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Look, after the Covid vaccines, there is a legit fear that the FDA is not doing their jobs to really test these drugs before release. Affects thyroid (survivable) and pancreas (not usually survivable.)

So why not question it?

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These aren't new drugs. As previously mentioned they have been in development for almost 20 years.

A_Gang_Ag_06 said:

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Every fat person I know that got their stomach stapled is back to being fat. I'm pretty sure this will play out no differently because you haven't addressed the root cause of most people being fat. Poor self discipline and access to cheap, garbage food.

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A lot of people just stay on them. Remember, being designed as diabetic drugs they are intended to be used long term.

aggiehawg said:

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BudAg97 said:

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I don't get the hate for GLP-1 medications.

But there does seem to be a contingent of people who get really angry about other people choosing to use this medication for weight loss.

If it helps people and they want to partake, so be it. If you don't care to partake, don't.

It's not like someone else taking it harms you.

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Look, after the Covid vaccines, there is a legit fear that the FDA is not doing their jobs to really test these drugs before release. Affects thyroid (survivable) and pancreas (not usually survivable.)

So why not question it?

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Question it all you want. I have no issue with that. The issue with the Covid vaccines was not that they were available. It was that they were being forced on people.

Take GLPs of you want or don't. I don't really care.

The fact of the matter is these drugs have been around for a long time. Weight loss is a secondary effect for what the initial use was.

Isn't that kind of like the off label uses for ivermectin?

A_Gang_Ag_06 said:

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Every fat person I know that got their stomach stapled is back to being fat. I'm pretty sure this will play out no differently because you haven't addressed the root cause of most people being fat. Poor self discipline and access to cheap, garbage food.

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You do realize there are indeed metabolic differences and disorders amongst people, right? Maybe not.

Let me enlighten you. There are. HTH.

Vepp said:

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Obesity drugs.

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I've lost over 50 pounds in 8 months after struggling for years to lose a couple of pounds here and there. Haven't felt this good in years.

This would have saved me a truck load of cash. Cash I'm glad I spent, but always happy to spend less.

40% of snap users are obese. Number goes to 80% for overweight. Best thing we could do for the poor is to end all food aid to the poor.

Kozmozag said:

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40% of snap users are obese. Number goes to 80% for overweight. Best thing we could do for the poor is to end all food aid to the poor.

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I think SNaP should be extremely limited in what is can be used to purchase. When you pack lunches at the food bank they have a nutritional value. They are not full of sugar and don't have coke as an option.

BonfireNerd04 said:

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Queso1 said:

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There are no shortcuts in life.

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Why do you care if someone wants to take a "shortcut"?

Did your girlfriend leave you for a formerly morbidly obese guy who took semaglutide?

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I don't care much beyond the effort it took to write my post. With exception of when it comes up on texags, it's not something I think about.

I'm sure it's great to take the pharmaceutical and lose weight. Hats off. But, like keto or any fad diet, it isn't sustainable over the long term. Are people going to take these things the rest of their life?

"What's wrong with shortcuts?"

Like we aren't the fattest nation already. Most of these glutenous people don't need the medicine, they need to stop sitting all day at work and actually count calories. Stop drinking soda or anything that isn't water if you are that worried about your weight. Calories via drinking are the easiest to quit.

Still won't get credit. How will they spin it?

twelve12twelve said:

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"What's wrong with shortcuts?"

Like we aren't the fattest nation already. Most of these glutenous people don't need the medicine, they need to stop sitting all day at work and actually count calories. Stop drinking soda or anything that isn't water if you are that worried about your weight. Calories via drinking are the easiest to quit.

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Or they could just take an injection once a week and make it easier to do everything you said

Queso1 said:

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BonfireNerd04 said:

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Queso1 said:

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There are no shortcuts in life.

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Why do you care if someone wants to take a "shortcut"?

Did your girlfriend leave you for a formerly morbidly obese guy who took semaglutide?

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I don't care much beyond the effort it took to write my post. With exception of when it comes up on texags, it's not something I think about.

I'm sure it's great to take the pharmaceutical and lose weight. Hats off. But, like keto or any fad diet, it isn't sustainable over the long term. Are people going to take these things the rest of their life?

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Yes, they can take these the rest of their lives in a maintenance dose if they choose too.

flown-the-coop said:

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A_Gang_Ag_06 said:

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Every fat person I know that got their stomach stapled is back to being fat. I'm pretty sure this will play out no differently because you haven't addressed the root cause of most people being fat. Poor self discipline and access to cheap, garbage food.

---

You do realize there are indeed metabolic differences and disorders amongst people, right? Maybe not.

Let me enlighten you. There are. HTH.

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Metabolic differences and disorders aren't the reason this country is a nation of fatasses. That's a tiny % of the overall population. HTH.

A_Gang_Ag_06 said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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A_Gang_Ag_06 said:

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Every fat person I know that got their stomach stapled is back to being fat. I'm pretty sure this will play out no differently because you haven't addressed the root cause of most people being fat. Poor self discipline and access to cheap, garbage food.

---

You do realize there are indeed metabolic differences and disorders amongst people, right? Maybe not.

Let me enlighten you. There are. HTH.

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Metabolic differences and disorders aren't the reason this country is a nation of fatasses. That's a tiny % of the overall population. HTH.

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If it makes you feel better about yourself to believe that, go for it. But just know it's about your feelz and not about actual statistics, medical knowledge or anything else.

The f16 fat shame is about as bad as Muslim shame and minority shame that pops up. Lots of insecure folks needed to brush with a broad stroke to pound their chest as superior.

Sad.

amercer said:

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Apparently the newest trend is women taking high doses of testosterone. Makes them horny like teenage boys. Also makes them grow beards and lose the hair on their heads, but who cares if you feel on fire all the time and want to go at it like a bunny on speed.

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Ok, slight education here for you.

Women on testosterone aren't taking "high doses." A typical protocol is 5-10 mg/week, which is about 1/10th to 1/20th of a moderate male dose (for reference, I'm on 120mg/week).

It's usually added to a bioidentical HRT stack for postmenopausal women already taking estrogen and progesterone. Testosterone and estrogen are required in both sexes just in different amounts.
This isn't juicing or anything, it's completing the hormone profile.

In men, testosterone is produced directly, with a small amount converted to estradiol via aromatase. That system generally keeps working with age, albeit with slow declines in absolute levels gradually.

In women, estrogens are made directly, and a small amount gets converted to testosterone, but when menopause hits, estrogen production drops off a cliff, and the entire system collapses.

Adding testosterone to female HRT is just replacing what they used to produce, rather than hoping low-dose estrogen and progesterone will somehow convert and fill the gap.

Seriously, if you're a guy, try taking an aromatase inhibitor and crash your estradiol. See how your joints, bones, and mood feel after a week.

Women without testosterone? Similar story, just flip side of that coin.

Example: my motorcycle instructor is postmenopausal, runs full E/P/T replacement, sources BPC-157 and retatrutide from the gray market, and still wins amateur races on a 600cc bike in her 50s.

The side effects you're talking about beards, hair loss happen only with bad dosing or rare sensitivity, not therapeutic microdosing.

But sure, keep talking about it like its chicks slamming roids if that's the depth you're operating at.

Over_ed said:

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TrumpRX - another mind meld into distraught liberals.

For some, from $1000 to $50.

Great Trump, on so many planes.

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/trump-weight-loss-drugs-cost-wegovy-zepbound-novo-nordisk-eli-lilly-rcna242309

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And still half of America will be upset because it is not free. We have too many non value Americans. I am referencing the elderly or disabled. Just the worthless freeloaders.

ts5641 said:

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Still won't get credit. How will they spin it?

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So right. Bad orange.. And you too, Stallion6.

Kozmozag said:

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40% of snap users are obese. Number goes to 80% for overweight. Best thing we could do for the poor is to end all food aid to the poor.

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Agreed. If we don't do that we should give all SNAP user free access to these weight loss drugs which make them crave food and alcohol less. Maybe we should even require it.

flown-the-coop said:

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See comment above regarding Viagra and Rogaine.

Cmon fellas don't cheat on your bald spots and boners… putting the hard work so to speak.

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LOL!!!!

Well played, sir. Well played.

flown-the-coop said:

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The f16 fat shame is about as bad as Muslim shame and minority shame that pops up.

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1000%.

If you cannot see it, that's just being dishonest.

It's a small, usual group that pops up and many times it results in thread locking and thread vanishing, but it's not so subtle.

But when I am shocked at some of the posts in those regards then it should be pretty evident to those who are more particular on these things.

I do NOT think it represents a majority opinion. But the vocal minority can be loud.

Teslag said:

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LMCane said:

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how ironic will it be when they discover the side effects of GLP 1s are worse than just being fat

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For most people the side effects when taken as directly are fatigue and nausea, and those are usually the day or two after injection.

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Long term side effects are unknown, just like MRNA

samurai_science said:

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Teslag said:

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LMCane said:

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how ironic will it be when they discover the side effects of GLP 1s are worse than just being fat

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For most people the side effects when taken as directly are fatigue and nausea, and those are usually the day or two after injection.

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Long term side effects are unknown, just like MRNA

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Unlike MRNA, GLP-1's have been in testing and development for almost 20 years. We also know their chemical makeup and interactions with the body. There's nothing particularly exotic or ground breaking about these meds. They were just developed to be simple diabetic treatments.

Not all meds are bad because Covid.

Hogties said:

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Vepp said:

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Obesity drugs.

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Please explain the hate. It would cost effective to ship these drugs for free to every obese person on SNAP and Medicaid or receiving large ObamaCare subsidies and require weigh ins every 6 months.

Would save hundreds of billions of dollars.

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Seems like some folks just want a reason to look down on others.

The hate it gets on this board is kind of wild, considering how many in red states/the MAGA movement could benefit from this type of thing.

These drugs tackle most of the major health challenges we face. Within the next few decades, about 90% of Americans are expected to use them.

TacoKitKat said:

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amercer said:

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Apparently the newest trend is women taking high doses of testosterone. Makes them horny like teenage boys. Also makes them grow beards and lose the hair on their heads, but who cares if you feel on fire all the time and want to go at it like a bunny on speed.

---

But sure, keep talking about it like its chicks slamming roids if that's the depth you're operating at.

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My wife does the hormone replacement thing - including some T as you indicate. She definitely acts like she's slamming 'roids at times! I almost have to hide at night to get some sleep.

And to tie these two topics back together - a man taking T (especially when overweight) can actually cause you to produce too many female hormones such that you have to take an aromatase inhibitor like Anastrozole.


The more you know!

Oh, and to show you how bloated and craptastic our government and healthcare system is - even WITH Trump's proposed/promised pricing - that is still many times higher than you can currently get semaglutide for from a compounding pharmacy (WITHOUT insurance even). Yes, you can STILL get this stuff from compounders (they basically just mix in a vitamin). And at around $200 for a 3-month supply it runs circles around everything else that involves "insurance".

What a scam we have gotten ourselves into. The only thing insurance insures/ensures is the employment of people to get more of your money!


Edit to add: I wouldn't be surprised if Trump secretly agreed to crack down on compounding more to get these companies to agree to lower their prices for his plan.

Over_ed said:

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TrumpRX - another mind meld into distraught liberals.

For some, from $1000 to $50.

Great Trump, on so many planes.

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/trump-weight-loss-drugs-cost-wegovy-zepbound-novo-nordisk-eli-lilly-rcna242309

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How is this not Socialist? This is anti-FreeMarket. This is literally socialism. So socialism in this form is okay or not? I literally lost track where this political party stands on this and hypocrisy?

Ag1188 said:

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Over_ed said:

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TrumpRX - another mind meld into distraught liberals.

For some, from $1000 to $50.

Great Trump, on so many planes.

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/trump-weight-loss-drugs-cost-wegovy-zepbound-novo-nordisk-eli-lilly-rcna242309

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How is this not Socialist? This is anti-FreeMarket. This is literally socialism. So socialism in this form is okay or not? I literally lost track where this political party stands on this and hypocrisy?

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US Government is one of if not the largest customer buying these drugs. That customer went to the private drug companies and said lower your prices to what you give other customers or you will no longer have your largest customer.

Literally could not be more free market capitalism.

Perhaps I see what is wrong with most DemLib thinking… In their world, it's socialism to negotiate price.