You may recall that republicans tried to stop it in many cases, only to be told no damage had yet been done, and then after the fact that it was too late. This was blatant corruption.

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There needs to be a remedy to the situation that isn't just tossing the votes. Or else you can influence an election by intentionally tainting a batch of votes you know will slant toward your opponent.

Perhaps they can cure them with an investigation, but if not, then if the margin of victory is less than the quantity votes you aren't counting due to no fault of the voters, then the election would have to be declared invalid.

That's a nightmare scenario, but better than allowing manipulation.

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Yes it is a nightmare how screwed up our election laws have become. Judges are loathe to throw out faulty election irrespective of the scale because that translates into disenfranchising voters. Of course gerrymandering districts has the same effect and few judges have ever recognized that until recently.

There are laws for chain of custody. Why do you think they banned observers? And now it's "oops!"

The crazy thing about all this....it was extremely obvious. We all saw it happen in real time. We all watched the anomalies occur...specific counties targeted, in multiple swing States.

We heard the whistleblower's accounts, saw the printed ballots, watched boxes of votes being found, vote harvesters gathering ballots, vote counting paused, the fake pipes bursts, polling locations closed, the windows being covered up, the massive vote dumps being added to the total, etc etc etc.

And every single time...it only benefited one side.

We all knew this. But we've all been gaslit for 5 years now, being told we were conspiracy theorists for talking about what we witnessed with our own eyes.

No. The votes need to be tossed. If democrats didn't want election fraud, they'd advocate for election security. They never do anywhere. And then we hear "where's the proof?!"

Here's the proof.

AtomicActuator said:

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Logos Stick said:

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You can't tackle it without nuking the filibuster and they won't do that. This is a legislature issue.

Federal laws need to be passed on MIBs, chain of custody, voter id requirements, ballot reception deadlines, etc...

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It would be great to not have yet another massive increase in federal power.

This is why we have the electoral college. The damage from a tainted count is limited to the number of electoral votes of that state and can't usually tip the scales nationally.

Georgians no doubt want their votes to count properly and should be trusted to do so. If in fact 51% or more voted for Trump, then they should be pissed and vote in leaders who will fix it.

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This is a Federal election! Thus we should have Federal laws in place to eliminate cheating and ensure process consistency across states. Allowing lawless states like Cali to do their own thing and cheat is a no go since it affects every other state!

They are disenfranchised either way. But if the result is something awful like the state legislature voting for the winner, then perhaps an imperfect election is better.

But what we really need to do is build an infrastructure and capability for snap runoffs for these scenarios.

A solution needs to be reached for mail-in ballots though, as they are just too slow for such a process.

You arent a conservative if you believe in 2020 election fraud per Ben Shapiro.

If they are not certified, they're not legal votes. PERIOD! It's the entire point of certification.

Ellis Wyatt said:

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You may recall that republicans tried to stop it in many cases, only to be told no damage had yet been done, and then after the fact that it was too late. This was blatant corruption.

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Corruption? Sort of but more in the nature of the laws on injunctions need to be changed for election cases. Instead of requiring a showing of irreparable harm, a showing of a high likelihood of irreparable harm for those cases so a remedy is available pre-election.

Either that or rule that the equitable doctrine of laches cannot be used in election cases, unless very untimely such as a year later before suit is filed.

Change the Rules of Procedure.

Their votes didn't count. Illegal votes counted. Thats it. Actual Americans were disenfranchised and a potato took the White House. You got what you wanted.

texagbeliever said:

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You arent a conservative if you believe in 2020 election fraud per Ben Shapiro.

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I like Ben.

But we dont agree on everything.

But if a voter cast a legal and proper vote, then it MUST be certified. The government can't be allowed to oopsie-daisy people out of their rights.

Logos Stick said:

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AtomicActuator said:

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Logos Stick said:

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You can't tackle it without nuking the filibuster and they won't do that. This is a legislature issue.

Federal laws need to be passed on MIBs, chain of custody, voter id requirements, ballot reception deadlines, etc...

---

It would be great to not have yet another massive increase in federal power.

This is why we have the electoral college. The damage from a tainted count is limited to the number of electoral votes of that state and can't usually tip the scales nationally.

Georgians no doubt want their votes to count properly and should be trusted to do so. If in fact 51% or more voted for Trump, then they should be pissed and vote in leaders who will fix it.

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This is a Federal election! Thus we should have Federal laws in place to eliminate cheating and ensure process consistency across states. Allowing lawless states like Cali to do their own thing and cheat is a no go since it affects every other state!

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Exactly.

Local issues can be handled locally.

But we cannot allow the rest of the Union to suffer, because of local laws allow certain States to cheat.

Regulations are needed, so all State cast their vote with confidence, that they are counted. Then when the EC moves forward, we all know it was fair and accurately cast.

AtomicActuator said:

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A solution needs to be reached for mail-in ballots though, as they are just too slow for such a process.

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MIBs should be disallowed entirely with rare exceptions regardless of efficiency.

The biggest issue with MIBs in 2020 is that the ballots sent out were unsolicited!!!

Logos Stick said:

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AtomicActuator said:

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Logos Stick said:

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You can't tackle it without nuking the filibuster and they won't do that. This is a legislature issue.

Federal laws need to be passed on MIBs, chain of custody, voter id requirements, ballot reception deadlines, etc...

---

It would be great to not have yet another massive increase in federal power.

This is why we have the electoral college. The damage from a tainted count is limited to the number of electoral votes of that state and can't usually tip the scales nationally.

Georgians no doubt want their votes to count properly and should be trusted to do so. If in fact 51% or more voted for Trump, then they should be pissed and vote in leaders who will fix it.

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This is a Federal election! Thus we should have Federal laws in place to eliminate cheating and ensure process consistency across states. Allowing lawless states like Cali to do their own thing and cheat is a no go since it affects every other state!

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The electoral college vote is a federal election. Each state holds their own election to determine where its electoral votes should be allocated.

You are making a case for the Democrat plan to replace the EC with a national popular vote.

That function, and those elections will still exist within the States.

You're not establishing the popular vote, nor getting rid of the EC, simply by instituting regulations to insure fair practices.

Quite the opposite. You're strengthening the votes of all States, so the EC proceeds with confidence.

The point is that I don't care, nor should have to care, how Georgia allocates its votes. That's the genius of the EC. It allowed us to not NEED a federal election apparatus or federal elections rules, beyond the basics or protecting citizens' RIGHT to vote in all elections held.

AtomicActuator said:

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Logos Stick said:

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AtomicActuator said:

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Logos Stick said:

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You can't tackle it without nuking the filibuster and they won't do that. This is a legislature issue.

Federal laws need to be passed on MIBs, chain of custody, voter id requirements, ballot reception deadlines, etc...

---

It would be great to not have yet another massive increase in federal power.

This is why we have the electoral college. The damage from a tainted count is limited to the number of electoral votes of that state and can't usually tip the scales nationally.

Georgians no doubt want their votes to count properly and should be trusted to do so. If in fact 51% or more voted for Trump, then they should be pissed and vote in leaders who will fix it.

---

This is a Federal election! Thus we should have Federal laws in place to eliminate cheating and ensure process consistency across states. Allowing lawless states like Cali to do their own thing and cheat is a no go since it affects every other state!

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The electoral college vote is a federal election. Each state holds their own election to determine where its electoral votes should be allocated.

You are making a case for the Democrat plan to replace the EC with a national popular vote.

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I am doing no such thing! Good grief!

Passing a national voter ID requirement law to ensure the person voting is the actual person is not an argument for replacing the EC. Passing a law to set the cutoff date on ballot counting on day of election is not replacing the EC.

I understand the point you're making; I just dont understand how you came to that conclusion.

You are affected by how Georgia's election proceeds, and the resulting EC. We're all in the same Union. How often do you see electors go against the will of the State's people?

The EC still maintains it's function. Nothing in that regard changes, by securing the elections uniformly across the States. All it does is insure the electors act with confidence, when they submit their choice.

I come to the conclusion based on federalist principles. States should have maximum autonomy except for enumerated powers of the federal government.

The federal government has continued to grant itself greater and greater power each year, while we (the people) have been asleep at the wheel, and we should stop pushing for even more power to be consolidated there.

And I conceptually reject that their election shenanigans impacted me since they fundamentally have the right to allocate their electoral votes as they see fit and it's not my place to say they did it wrong.

Logos Stick said:

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AtomicActuator said:

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Logos Stick said:

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AtomicActuator said:

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Logos Stick said:

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You can't tackle it without nuking the filibuster and they won't do that. This is a legislature issue.

Federal laws need to be passed on MIBs, chain of custody, voter id requirements, ballot reception deadlines, etc...

---

It would be great to not have yet another massive increase in federal power.

This is why we have the electoral college. The damage from a tainted count is limited to the number of electoral votes of that state and can't usually tip the scales nationally.

Georgians no doubt want their votes to count properly and should be trusted to do so. If in fact 51% or more voted for Trump, then they should be pissed and vote in leaders who will fix it.

---

This is a Federal election! Thus we should have Federal laws in place to eliminate cheating and ensure process consistency across states. Allowing lawless states like Cali to do their own thing and cheat is a no go since it affects every other state!

---

The electoral college vote is a federal election. Each state holds their own election to determine where its electoral votes should be allocated.

You are making a case for the Democrat plan to replace the EC with a national popular vote.

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I am doing no such thing! Good grief!

Passing a national voter ID requirement law to ensure the person voting is the actual person is not an argument for replacing the EC. Passing a law to set the cutoff date on ballot counting on day of election is not replacing the EC.

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I didn't explain, but I can now. The best argument against a national popular vote currently, imho, is that we don't have a national election apparatus, and the states will be highly incentivized to manipulate and inflate their vote counts. And then every election will be mired in lawsuits between the states. The only solution would be for the Feds to step in and take over the election from the bottom up, a massive increase in federal power and control.

So therefore retaining the EC is wise so each state's electoral power is fixed and not subject to manipulation.

But if you implement a federal elections apparatus anyway, then there won't be any need for the EC anymore.

This is Trump smoke and mirrors.

AUDITS of paper ballots confirmed the vote numbers. Someone missed an audit step, but the votes were accurate.

This is coming out because the transcript of Jack Smith's deposition (that he wanted to give publicly) is being release. Trump is trying to avoid future criminal liability and public blow back for trying to overturn a valid election.


He's also trying to lay the groundwork to gut our elections. He knows the swing voters realize the emperor has not clothes on and he is a charleton.

Supporting the big lie, at this stage, should be criminal. But, some of you want a dictatorship.

I dont disagree with any of that.

None of that is effected by instituting fair standards.

94DCAg said:

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Supporting the big lie, at this stage, should be criminal.

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It's horse****, but it's constitutionally protected horse*****

Many states don't have the resources or political will to combat the scheming that can be achieved with the type of funding that runs through the campaign financing mess we've created. It is very sad.

Quote:

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AUDITS of paper ballots confirmed the vote numbers. Someone missed an audit step, but the votes were accurate.

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There were no actual audits done, not in any of the 2020 swing states. The Dominion and other voting systems don't allow that type of audit.

94DCAg said:

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This is Trump smoke and mirrors.

AUDITS of paper ballots confirmed the vote numbers. Someone missed an audit step, but the votes were accurate.

This is coming out because the transcript of Jack Smith's deposition (that he wanted to give publicly) is being release. Trump is trying to avoid future criminal liability and public blow back for trying to overturn a valid election.


He's also trying to lay the groundwork to gut our elections. He knows the swing voters realize the emperor has not clothes on and he is a charleton.

Supporting the big lie, at this stage, should be criminal. But, some of you want a dictatorship.

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Let me help you since you don't understand the issue here: THE BALLOTS WERE ILLEGALLY CERTIFIED!

This has nothing to do with electronic count versus paper count!

If non-citizens are voting, they're disenfranchising the rest of us. They do not have the right to vote in American elections. Period.

aggiehawg said:

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Quote:

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AUDITS of paper ballots confirmed the vote numbers. Someone missed an audit step, but the votes were accurate.

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There were no actual audits done, not in any of the 2020 swing states. The Dominion and other voting systems don't allow that type of audit.

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Please google and research this and don't rely on the MAGA disinformation machine.

Logos Stick said:

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94DCAg said:

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This is Trump smoke and mirrors.

AUDITS of paper ballots confirmed the vote numbers. Someone missed an audit step, but the votes were accurate.

This is coming out because the transcript of Jack Smith's deposition (that he wanted to give publicly) is being release. Trump is trying to avoid future criminal liability and public blow back for trying to overturn a valid election.


He's also trying to lay the groundwork to gut our elections. He knows the swing voters realize the emperor has not clothes on and he is a charleton.

Supporting the big lie, at this stage, should be criminal. But, some of you want a dictatorship.

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Let me help you since you don't understand the issue here: THE BALLOTS WERE ILLEGALLY CERTIFIED!

This has nothing to do with electronic count versus paper count!

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They litigated this. This is smoke and mirrors. Don't be confused and duped.

You know what else was litigated? 34 felonies with ex post facto laws.

94DCAg said:

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Logos Stick said:

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94DCAg said:

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This is Trump smoke and mirrors.

AUDITS of paper ballots confirmed the vote numbers. Someone missed an audit step, but the votes were accurate.

This is coming out because the transcript of Jack Smith's deposition (that he wanted to give publicly) is being release. Trump is trying to avoid future criminal liability and public blow back for trying to overturn a valid election.


He's also trying to lay the groundwork to gut our elections. He knows the swing voters realize the emperor has not clothes on and he is a charleton.

Supporting the big lie, at this stage, should be criminal. But, some of you want a dictatorship.

---

Let me help you since you don't understand the issue here: THE BALLOTS WERE ILLEGALLY CERTIFIED!

This has nothing to do with electronic count versus paper count!

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They litigated this. This is smoke and mirrors. Don't be confused and duped.

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So you admit your original post was FOS and you do no understand the issue, then you come back and move the goal post, Nice.

Let's see how long before 81+ million cast ballots for a single candidate again