Silent For Too Long said:

---

What are you talking about?

It's widely accepted by everyone almost 2.5 million people have voluntarily left.

There is nothing imaginary about it.

---

I know that stat was thrown out somewhere but there is simply no evidence for it and I am sorry.

Vance will not do any better. He owes his entire career to Theil and Theil does not support mass deportations

I love how you cling to Groyper conspiracy theories as established fact, but won't accept well established data published by the Departmentof Homeland Security.

Your epistomoloigcal frame work needs work, bud. Stop letting Nick Fuentes do your thinking for you.

Silent For Too Long said:

---

I love how you cling to Groyper conspiracy theories as established fact, but won't accept well established data published by the Departmentof Homeland Security.

Your epistomoloigcal frame work needs work, bud. Stop letting Nick Fuentes do your thinking for you.

---

What? I am just living here in America as it declines. Spanish on the Super Bowl. No mass deportations. No wall. No end of foreign wars. Housing costs for Americans more UNAFFORDABLE than ever. Swamp not drained.

So yeah no, I am Never Vance

#Mke said:

---

The only real concern I have with Vance is his proximity to the Silicon Valley technocrats, but other than that I am very optimistic about him succeeding Trump as the leader of the America First movement.

---

Well theyre all moving to Texas and Miami, so CA influence is dwindling. Hell in the month of January, CA lost 1 trillion in wealth.

WinTheWholeDamnThing said:

---

Lmao, you keep pretending this is some "mystery" about when crafting began, but I've already spelled it out for you: The Bush-era NeoCon Frum grooming came first. He met Thiel through Yale networks after. The book came after. The VC job came after. The Senate funding came after. That's literally the timeline.

Here's what you're missing: Vance hated his own upbringing. Ashamed of Appalachia, ashamed of his family, desperate to escape into elite Yale circles. Fast forward, and suddenly he's the "champion of the forgotten people"? A working-class populist hero? Please.

---

This is an interesting story with no support that I have ever seen. It's a pretty funny Manchurian Candidate fever dream of a conspiracy theory, but it is fun to at least investigate how in your mind you think this happened.

So, it is your contention that:

1) Vance hated white working class people before he came to Yale
2) Once in Yale, he met with Thiel
3) That meeting with Thiel was so important that he completely changed his view of working class whites because of Thiel while he was still at Yale, and, once Vance left Yale, before the book, before the VC job, Vance had already adopted a fake affinity for the white working male?

So, the entire facelift happened at Yale? Vance has been a fake, poor-people hating elitists since at least his sophomore year of University?

I'm trying to imagine his slip into the dark side a la Anakin Skywalker, and needing more information to paint the picture.

Keyno said:

---

Silent For Too Long said:

---

What are you talking about?

It's widely accepted by everyone almost 2.5 million people have voluntarily left.

There is nothing imaginary about it.

---

I know that stat was thrown out somewhere but there is simply no evidence for it and I am sorry.

Vance will not do any better. He owes his entire career to Theil and Theil does not support mass deportations

---

https://www.coreinsightsintl.com/post/billionaire-technocrat-peter-thiel-s-company-palantir-lands-30-million-contract-with-ice-to-help

You don't know what the hell you are talking about. You just spew stuff from your anus to see what sticks.

The contention that Theil is pulling Vance's strings is a huge, huge stretch. The idea that Thiel is against mass deportations is clearly very, very wrong.

BusterAg said:

---

Keyno said:

---

Silent For Too Long said:

---

What are you talking about?

It's widely accepted by everyone almost 2.5 million people have voluntarily left.

There is nothing imaginary about it.

---

I know that stat was thrown out somewhere but there is simply no evidence for it and I am sorry.

Vance will not do any better. He owes his entire career to Theil and Theil does not support mass deportations

---

https://www.coreinsightsintl.com/post/billionaire-technocrat-peter-thiel-s-company-palantir-lands-30-million-contract-with-ice-to-help

You don't know what the hell you are talking about. You just spew stuff from your anus to see what sticks.

The contention that Theil is pulling Vance's strings is a huge, huge stretch. The idea that Thiel is against mass deportations is clearly very, very wrong.

---

Vance's entire career is a Theil cutout. His no show job at an investment firm, his money backing, his Trump Senate endorsement, and ultimately his tap for VP.

You have no clue what's going on and I am sorry.

They know he's the best chance for the GOP in 2028 so they've begun they're assault against him.

ts5641 said:

---

They know he's the best chance for the GOP in 2028 so they've begun they're assault against him.

---

Bingo. Leftists will tell you who scares them. They save their most vitriolic attacks for the ones they see as the biggest threats.

Keyno said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

Keyno said:

---

Silent For Too Long said:

---

What are you talking about?

It's widely accepted by everyone almost 2.5 million people have voluntarily left.

There is nothing imaginary about it.

---

I know that stat was thrown out somewhere but there is simply no evidence for it and I am sorry.

Vance will not do any better. He owes his entire career to Theil and Theil does not support mass deportations

---

https://www.coreinsightsintl.com/post/billionaire-technocrat-peter-thiel-s-company-palantir-lands-30-million-contract-with-ice-to-help

You don't know what the hell you are talking about. You just spew stuff from your anus to see what sticks.

The contention that Theil is pulling Vance's strings is a huge, huge stretch. The idea that Thiel is against mass deportations is clearly very, very wrong.

---

Vance's entire career is a Theil cutout. His no show job at an investment firm, his money backing, his Trump Senate endorsement, and ultimately his tap for VP.

You have no clue what's going on and I am sorry.

---

When you make two statements as solid fact, and one of them is a complete fabrication, and the other is a huge stretch, how do you intend to portray any amount of credibility at all?

Painting Vance as an elitist in disguise as a populist is an interesting strategy that is just not going to work, IMO. It will be interesting to see how much traction that spin gets.

In the end, if it does get some traction, it will bite them right in the ass when it comes time to have the debates. Vance just comes across as folksy. The media trying to portray him as "fake" will fall apart when he gets uninterrupted time in front of the camera, because he talks straight to the point with a significant amount of candor, something that very few politicians do.

Believing that the majority of swing voters are going to believe this spin as opposed to their own eyes is pretty funny. Very condescending. I mean, you can call an Alzheimer's suffering geriatric patient "sharp as a tack" as many times as you want, when he bumbles once about solving Medicare, your credibility is out the window.

My hope is that this is the best arrow in the Dem's quiver when it comes to Vance. Because, if it is, they have a long way to go to be competitive at all in 2028.

ts5641 said:

---

They know he's the best chance for the GOP in 2028 so they've begun they're assault against him.

---

Exactly.

I hope that this is their best swing, because it is incredibly weak sauce.

Quote:

---

the democrats are the enemy

---

Well, you also said Vance is an enemy of the United States. I guess we just need to put our faith in the great americans like Nick Fuentes. He will save us!

Keyno said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

The GOP doesn't have anyone I would vote for besides Massie. But I'd honestly prefer the GOP to collapse and something more right wing to fill the vacuum.

---

Good luck with that. I prefer further right also but have learned to live in the world of what's practical. That doesn't mean you sacrifice anything. Advocate for the best you can get but also be realistic when the votes are counted. That's real life man. Do you think hiding out as a hermit is going to force the rest of the world to come around to you? Because it ain't happening, as much as you and I might want it to.

I'll gladly take 80% of what I want today and come back for the other 20% later.

---

Yeah the "what are you, a hermit?" rhetoric does not work anymore. The last 30 years have shown that the democrats are the enemy and the GOP is the traitor. If given the choice of who to vote for, I choose neither. If given the choice of who deserves to collapse, I choose the traitor every time.

This whole 80/20 dialectic you are trying to set up just doesn't work. The GOP I guess gives you a better tax break? but that is about it. It's called a uniparty for a reason.

---

Ok, I now understand your point of view. Don't agree with it, but understand it.

As imperfect as the GOP is, it is still head and shoulders above the Dems. I appreciate their efforts to reduce taxes, cut regulations, crush DEI, pushback on the man-made climate change scam, protect life, secure the border, deport illegals, promote law and order, and more. The Dems stand in opposition to every one of those items.

I'll take an imperfect GOP and vote for those who will improve it instead of turning my back on them and letting the heathens take over. No sir.

BusterAg said:

---

Keyno said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

Keyno said:

---

Silent For Too Long said:

---

What are you talking about?

It's widely accepted by everyone almost 2.5 million people have voluntarily left.

There is nothing imaginary about it.

---

I know that stat was thrown out somewhere but there is simply no evidence for it and I am sorry.

Vance will not do any better. He owes his entire career to Theil and Theil does not support mass deportations

---

https://www.coreinsightsintl.com/post/billionaire-technocrat-peter-thiel-s-company-palantir-lands-30-million-contract-with-ice-to-help

You don't know what the hell you are talking about. You just spew stuff from your anus to see what sticks.

The contention that Theil is pulling Vance's strings is a huge, huge stretch. The idea that Thiel is against mass deportations is clearly very, very wrong.

---

Vance's entire career is a Theil cutout. His no show job at an investment firm, his money backing, his Trump Senate endorsement, and ultimately his tap for VP.

You have no clue what's going on and I am sorry.

---

When you make two statements as solid fact, and one of them is a complete fabrication, and the other is a huge stretch, how do you intend to portray any amount of credibility at all?

Painting Vance as an elitist in disguise as a populist is an interesting strategy that is just not going to work, IMO. It will be interesting to see how much traction that spin gets.

In the end, if it does get some traction, it will bite them right in the ass when it comes time to have the debates. Vance just comes across as folksy. The media trying to portray him as "fake" will fall apart when he gets uninterrupted time in front of the camera, because he talks straight to the point with a significant amount of candor, something that very few politicians do.

Believing that the majority of swing voters are going to believe this spin as opposed to their own eyes is pretty funny. Very condescending. I mean, you can call an Alzheimer's suffering geriatric patient "sharp as a tack" as many times as you want, when he bumbles once about solving Medicare, your credibility is out the window.

My hope is that this is the best arrow in the Dem's quiver when it comes to Vance. Because, if it is, they have a long way to go to be competitive at all in 2028.

---

I didn't paint Vance as an elitist. I am saying he is an empty suit. He his a political creature built by Theil.

The rest of what you said, lol ok

What does "empty suit" even mean in this context?

That he has financial backers? That isn't really a negative thing. If he was smart enough to attract the attention of VC guys while he was still writing the law review at Yale, why is that, in isolation, a bad thing? There has to be an insinuation or connotation in there that this is something more nefarious. What exactly is that?

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

The GOP doesn't have anyone I would vote for besides Massie. But I'd honestly prefer the GOP to collapse and something more right wing to fill the vacuum.

---

Good luck with that. I prefer further right also but have learned to live in the world of what's practical. That doesn't mean you sacrifice anything. Advocate for the best you can get but also be realistic when the votes are counted. That's real life man. Do you think hiding out as a hermit is going to force the rest of the world to come around to you? Because it ain't happening, as much as you and I might want it to.

I'll gladly take 80% of what I want today and come back for the other 20% later.

---

Yeah the "what are you, a hermit?" rhetoric does not work anymore. The last 30 years have shown that the democrats are the enemy and the GOP is the traitor. If given the choice of who to vote for, I choose neither. If given the choice of who deserves to collapse, I choose the traitor every time.

This whole 80/20 dialectic you are trying to set up just doesn't work. The GOP I guess gives you a better tax break? but that is about it. It's called a uniparty for a reason.

---

Ok, I now understand your point of view. Don't agree with it, but understand it.

As imperfect as the GOP is, it is still head and shoulders above the Dems. I appreciate their efforts to reduce taxes, cut regulations, crush DEI, pushback on the man-made climate change scam, protect life, secure the border, deport illegals, promote law and order, and more. The Dems stand in opposition to every one of those items.

I'll take an imperfect GOP and vote for those who will improve it instead of turning my back on them and letting the heathens take over. No sir.

---

I get it, I really do. I used to think like this when I was 21. I am younger than you, but I have been betrayed by the GOP too many times (as I am sure you have to). Our country is spiraling and the biggest issues are immigration and foreign war. The GOP is not fixing those things (even though they always say they will when they campaign). Yeah the tax cuts for corporations are sweet, but in 50 years this country will be unrecognizable if something doesn't change.

BusterAg said:

---

What does "empty suit" even mean in this context?

That he has financial backers? That isn't really a negative thing. If he was smart enough to attract the attention of VC guys while he was still writing the law review at Yale, why is that, in isolation, a bad thing? There has to be an insinuation or connotation in there that this is something more nefarious. What exactly is that?

---

It means Vance is a creature created by Theil

Buster, its just Groyper Conspiracy Theory bull***** They don't have any evidence for any of it outside of Fuentes' YouTube channel.

Keyno said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

The GOP doesn't have anyone I would vote for besides Massie. But I'd honestly prefer the GOP to collapse and something more right wing to fill the vacuum.

---

Good luck with that. I prefer further right also but have learned to live in the world of what's practical. That doesn't mean you sacrifice anything. Advocate for the best you can get but also be realistic when the votes are counted. That's real life man. Do you think hiding out as a hermit is going to force the rest of the world to come around to you? Because it ain't happening, as much as you and I might want it to.

I'll gladly take 80% of what I want today and come back for the other 20% later.

---

Yeah the "what are you, a hermit?" rhetoric does not work anymore. The last 30 years have shown that the democrats are the enemy and the GOP is the traitor. If given the choice of who to vote for, I choose neither. If given the choice of who deserves to collapse, I choose the traitor every time.

This whole 80/20 dialectic you are trying to set up just doesn't work. The GOP I guess gives you a better tax break? but that is about it. It's called a uniparty for a reason.

---

Ok, I now understand your point of view. Don't agree with it, but understand it.

As imperfect as the GOP is, it is still head and shoulders above the Dems. I appreciate their efforts to reduce taxes, cut regulations, crush DEI, pushback on the man-made climate change scam, protect life, secure the border, deport illegals, promote law and order, and more. The Dems stand in opposition to every one of those items.

I'll take an imperfect GOP and vote for those who will improve it instead of turning my back on them and letting the heathens take over. No sir.

---

I get it, I really do. I used to think like this when I was 21. I am younger than you, but I have been betrayed by the GOP too many times (as I am sure you have to). Our country is spiraling and the biggest issues are immigration and foreign war. The GOP is not fixing those things (even though they always say they will when they campaign). Yeah the tax cuts for corporations are sweet, but in 50 years this country will be unrecognizable if something doesn't change.

---

Political parties are very imperfect. It wouldn't be wrong to even view them as somewhat sinister because all they care about is THE PARTY, not the voters. I learned to detach myself emotionally from the GOP after years of disappointment. But I still take an honest look at the agenda of each party, and one is much better for me than the other.

So I support them in the hopes that they will deliver for me and my family. It hasn't been all bad. Trump gets a lot of credit for partial delivery, and the R's before him were still infinitely better than Biden or Obama. Clinton was actually pragmatic but would be tossed out of the Dem party today as a right-wing extremist.

When I look around the world, I don't see a political system that is head and shoulders better than ours. Humans are inherently flawed, so it's not a surprise that our political systems are either. Sometimes associating with the least imperfect is the best deal you can get. I've made my peace with that and try to invest my emotion in other things in life that bring me joy.

Keyno said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

The GOP doesn't have anyone I would vote for besides Massie. But I'd honestly prefer the GOP to collapse and something more right wing to fill the vacuum.

---

Good luck with that. I prefer further right also but have learned to live in the world of what's practical. That doesn't mean you sacrifice anything. Advocate for the best you can get but also be realistic when the votes are counted. That's real life man. Do you think hiding out as a hermit is going to force the rest of the world to come around to you? Because it ain't happening, as much as you and I might want it to.

I'll gladly take 80% of what I want today and come back for the other 20% later.

---

Yeah the "what are you, a hermit?" rhetoric does not work anymore. The last 30 years have shown that the democrats are the enemy and the GOP is the traitor. If given the choice of who to vote for, I choose neither. If given the choice of who deserves to collapse, I choose the traitor every time.

This whole 80/20 dialectic you are trying to set up just doesn't work. The GOP I guess gives you a better tax break? but that is about it. It's called a uniparty for a reason.

---

Ok, I now understand your point of view. Don't agree with it, but understand it.

As imperfect as the GOP is, it is still head and shoulders above the Dems. I appreciate their efforts to reduce taxes, cut regulations, crush DEI, pushback on the man-made climate change scam, protect life, secure the border, deport illegals, promote law and order, and more. The Dems stand in opposition to every one of those items.

I'll take an imperfect GOP and vote for those who will improve it instead of turning my back on them and letting the heathens take over. No sir.

---

I get it, I really do. I used to think like this when I was 21. I am younger than you, but I have been betrayed by the GOP too many times (as I am sure you have to). Our country is spiraling and the biggest issues are immigration and foreign war. The GOP is not fixing those things (even though they always say they will when they campaign). Yeah the tax cuts for corporations are sweet, but in 50 years this country will be unrecognizable if something doesn't change.

---

Trump absolutely sealed the border, and is working pretty hard at the deportation thing.

I think if that is your primary issue, and you don't like Trump's performance, you are not going to like anybody's.

Trump is also one of the least hawkish presidents in modern history.

Keyno said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

What does "empty suit" even mean in this context?

That he has financial backers? That isn't really a negative thing. If he was smart enough to attract the attention of VC guys while he was still writing the law review at Yale, why is that, in isolation, a bad thing? There has to be an insinuation or connotation in there that this is something more nefarious. What exactly is that?

---

It means Vance is a creature created by Theil

---

But, what does that mean, exactly? To be a creature created by Thiel?

Do you believe:

1) Vance doesn't think for himself at all? That 100% of his opinions are fed to him by Thiel

2) Vance would not have been successful except for Thiel, and that alone makes him an empty suit?

3) Vance is literally a ghost, and his ghost makes his suit look like there is something inside of it, but there isn't, so Vance is literally just and empty piece of fabric?

4) Vance completely reinvented himself when he met Theil, and changed who he is, and that alone is enough to call him an empty suit?

I'm trying to get past name calling and cliche phrases to understand if you are actually trying to make a point, or just like gaslight-throwing mud.

Silent For Too Long said:

---

Buster, its just Groyper Conspiracy Theory bull***** They don't have any evidence for any of it outside of Fuentes' YouTube channel.

---

I'm the kind of sadist that enjoys watching idiots drown.

BusterAg said:

---

Keyno said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

The GOP doesn't have anyone I would vote for besides Massie. But I'd honestly prefer the GOP to collapse and something more right wing to fill the vacuum.

---

Good luck with that. I prefer further right also but have learned to live in the world of what's practical. That doesn't mean you sacrifice anything. Advocate for the best you can get but also be realistic when the votes are counted. That's real life man. Do you think hiding out as a hermit is going to force the rest of the world to come around to you? Because it ain't happening, as much as you and I might want it to.

I'll gladly take 80% of what I want today and come back for the other 20% later.

---

Yeah the "what are you, a hermit?" rhetoric does not work anymore. The last 30 years have shown that the democrats are the enemy and the GOP is the traitor. If given the choice of who to vote for, I choose neither. If given the choice of who deserves to collapse, I choose the traitor every time.

This whole 80/20 dialectic you are trying to set up just doesn't work. The GOP I guess gives you a better tax break? but that is about it. It's called a uniparty for a reason.

---

Ok, I now understand your point of view. Don't agree with it, but understand it.

As imperfect as the GOP is, it is still head and shoulders above the Dems. I appreciate their efforts to reduce taxes, cut regulations, crush DEI, pushback on the man-made climate change scam, protect life, secure the border, deport illegals, promote law and order, and more. The Dems stand in opposition to every one of those items.

I'll take an imperfect GOP and vote for those who will improve it instead of turning my back on them and letting the heathens take over. No sir.

---

I get it, I really do. I used to think like this when I was 21. I am younger than you, but I have been betrayed by the GOP too many times (as I am sure you have to). Our country is spiraling and the biggest issues are immigration and foreign war. The GOP is not fixing those things (even though they always say they will when they campaign). Yeah the tax cuts for corporations are sweet, but in 50 years this country will be unrecognizable if something doesn't change.

---

Trump absolutely sealed the border, and is working pretty hard at the deportation thing.

I think if that is your primary issue, and you don't like Trump's performance, you are not going to like anybody's.

Trump is also one of the least hawkish presidents in modern history.

---

OK cool. I am not voting for Vance. I am Never Vance

BusterAg said:

---

Keyno said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

What does "empty suit" even mean in this context?

That he has financial backers? That isn't really a negative thing. If he was smart enough to attract the attention of VC guys while he was still writing the law review at Yale, why is that, in isolation, a bad thing? There has to be an insinuation or connotation in there that this is something more nefarious. What exactly is that?

---

It means Vance is a creature created by Theil

---

But, what does that mean, exactly? To be a creature created by Thiel?

Do you believe:

1) Vance doesn't think for himself at all? That 100% of his opinions are fed to him by Thiel

2) Vance would not have been successful except for Thiel, and that alone makes him an empty suit?

3) Vance is literally a ghost, and his ghost makes his suit look like there is something inside of it, but there isn't, so Vance is literally just and empty piece of fabric?

4) Vance completely reinvented himself when he met Theil, and changed who he is, and that alone is enough to call him an empty suit?

I'm trying to get past name calling and cliche phrases to understand if you are actually trying to make a point, or just like gaslight-throwing mud.

---

No, Vance is a political creature created by Theil. He was given a no show finance job as a favor to Theil. His Senate run was backed by Theil. He was tapped as VP after Trump was shot on the "suggestion" of Theil ally Elon.

Vance did I guess 2 years in the Senate? His name isn't even JD Vance. It's James Bowman. He was a "Never Trump" guy in Trump's first term when Trump was America First. Who is this guy?

I am Never Vance

Keyno said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

Keyno said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

The GOP doesn't have anyone I would vote for besides Massie. But I'd honestly prefer the GOP to collapse and something more right wing to fill the vacuum.

---

Good luck with that. I prefer further right also but have learned to live in the world of what's practical. That doesn't mean you sacrifice anything. Advocate for the best you can get but also be realistic when the votes are counted. That's real life man. Do you think hiding out as a hermit is going to force the rest of the world to come around to you? Because it ain't happening, as much as you and I might want it to.

I'll gladly take 80% of what I want today and come back for the other 20% later.

---

Yeah the "what are you, a hermit?" rhetoric does not work anymore. The last 30 years have shown that the democrats are the enemy and the GOP is the traitor. If given the choice of who to vote for, I choose neither. If given the choice of who deserves to collapse, I choose the traitor every time.

This whole 80/20 dialectic you are trying to set up just doesn't work. The GOP I guess gives you a better tax break? but that is about it. It's called a uniparty for a reason.

---

Ok, I now understand your point of view. Don't agree with it, but understand it.

As imperfect as the GOP is, it is still head and shoulders above the Dems. I appreciate their efforts to reduce taxes, cut regulations, crush DEI, pushback on the man-made climate change scam, protect life, secure the border, deport illegals, promote law and order, and more. The Dems stand in opposition to every one of those items.

I'll take an imperfect GOP and vote for those who will improve it instead of turning my back on them and letting the heathens take over. No sir.

---

I get it, I really do. I used to think like this when I was 21. I am younger than you, but I have been betrayed by the GOP too many times (as I am sure you have to). Our country is spiraling and the biggest issues are immigration and foreign war. The GOP is not fixing those things (even though they always say they will when they campaign). Yeah the tax cuts for corporations are sweet, but in 50 years this country will be unrecognizable if something doesn't change.

---

Trump absolutely sealed the border, and is working pretty hard at the deportation thing.

I think if that is your primary issue, and you don't like Trump's performance, you are not going to like anybody's.

Trump is also one of the least hawkish presidents in modern history.

---

OK cool. I am not voting for Vance. I am Never Vance

---

Ok, that is what voting is about. You don't need to have good reasons to vote for someone, your vote still counts just as much as someone who is well informed.

BusterAg said:

---

Keyno said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

Keyno said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Keyno said:

---

The GOP doesn't have anyone I would vote for besides Massie. But I'd honestly prefer the GOP to collapse and something more right wing to fill the vacuum.

---

Good luck with that. I prefer further right also but have learned to live in the world of what's practical. That doesn't mean you sacrifice anything. Advocate for the best you can get but also be realistic when the votes are counted. That's real life man. Do you think hiding out as a hermit is going to force the rest of the world to come around to you? Because it ain't happening, as much as you and I might want it to.

I'll gladly take 80% of what I want today and come back for the other 20% later.

---

Yeah the "what are you, a hermit?" rhetoric does not work anymore. The last 30 years have shown that the democrats are the enemy and the GOP is the traitor. If given the choice of who to vote for, I choose neither. If given the choice of who deserves to collapse, I choose the traitor every time.

This whole 80/20 dialectic you are trying to set up just doesn't work. The GOP I guess gives you a better tax break? but that is about it. It's called a uniparty for a reason.

---

Ok, I now understand your point of view. Don't agree with it, but understand it.

As imperfect as the GOP is, it is still head and shoulders above the Dems. I appreciate their efforts to reduce taxes, cut regulations, crush DEI, pushback on the man-made climate change scam, protect life, secure the border, deport illegals, promote law and order, and more. The Dems stand in opposition to every one of those items.

I'll take an imperfect GOP and vote for those who will improve it instead of turning my back on them and letting the heathens take over. No sir.

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I get it, I really do. I used to think like this when I was 21. I am younger than you, but I have been betrayed by the GOP too many times (as I am sure you have to). Our country is spiraling and the biggest issues are immigration and foreign war. The GOP is not fixing those things (even though they always say they will when they campaign). Yeah the tax cuts for corporations are sweet, but in 50 years this country will be unrecognizable if something doesn't change.

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Trump absolutely sealed the border, and is working pretty hard at the deportation thing.

I think if that is your primary issue, and you don't like Trump's performance, you are not going to like anybody's.

Trump is also one of the least hawkish presidents in modern history.

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OK cool. I am not voting for Vance. I am Never Vance

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Ok, that is what voting is about. You don't need to have good reasons to vote for someone, your vote still counts just as much as someone who is well informed.

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Just wait. The 2028 election will be "The Most Important Election of Our Lifetimes". You better vote GOP otherwise the democrats will win

Keyno said:

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BusterAg said:

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Keyno said:

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BusterAg said:

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What does "empty suit" even mean in this context?

That he has financial backers? That isn't really a negative thing. If he was smart enough to attract the attention of VC guys while he was still writing the law review at Yale, why is that, in isolation, a bad thing? There has to be an insinuation or connotation in there that this is something more nefarious. What exactly is that?

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It means Vance is a creature created by Theil

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But, what does that mean, exactly? To be a creature created by Thiel?

Do you believe:

1) Vance doesn't think for himself at all? That 100% of his opinions are fed to him by Thiel

2) Vance would not have been successful except for Thiel, and that alone makes him an empty suit?

3) Vance is literally a ghost, and his ghost makes his suit look like there is something inside of it, but there isn't, so Vance is literally just and empty piece of fabric?

4) Vance completely reinvented himself when he met Theil, and changed who he is, and that alone is enough to call him an empty suit?

I'm trying to get past name calling and cliche phrases to understand if you are actually trying to make a point, or just like gaslight-throwing mud.

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No, Vance is a political creature created by Theil. He was given a no show finance job as a favor to Theil. His Senate run was backed by Theil. He was tapped as VP after Trump was shot on the "suggestion" of Theil ally Elon.

Vance did I guess 2 years in the Senate? His name isn't even JD Vance. It's James Bowman. He was a "Never Trump" guy in Trump's first term when Trump was America First. Who is this guy?

I am Never Vance

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So.

Vance got his financial backing from Theil.

You hate Theil.

Therefore-> Never Vance?

I mean, I can empathize a bit if that is the stance. I was really worried about Bessent when I first learned that he was one of the quants behind the Soros hedge fund that squeezed the British Pound when Bessent was just 30. Having your name tied to Soros in any way, shape, or form is a huge red flag in my book.

But, the more I learned about him, the more I realized that he did not have very much in common with Soros at all. That, even though Soros' willingness to back his very, very bold bet was the entire reason why Bessent went on to have a successful career, that early win with Soros did not shape Bessent's future policies.

What would a person like you look for in policies that Vance either supports or brings down would make you think that Vance is tied to Thiel, and unable to make his own decisions. On the flip side, what type of policies would you look for from Vance that would tend to disprove your thesis that Vance is owned by Theil, and that Vance acts on his own opinion?

Or, is your theory simply unfalsifiable? There is no way to prove or disprove it, it is just the way it is because that is what you feel in your heart?

Voting GOP buys us time to try and primary more swamp creatures and change the GOP.

But, it sounds like you won't be happy with anything other than some right-wing authoritarian gov't, so I guess you'll never be happy.

CDUB98 said:

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Voting GOP buys us time to try and primary more swamp creatures and change the GOP.

But, it sounds like you won't be happy with anything other than some right-wing authoritarian gov't, so I guess you'll never be happy.

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We've been "buying time" since Obama was elected. 2008. So almost 20 years. 2016 Trump was supposed to be the change candidate, but that didn't work. I guess let's keeping "buying time" though

the guy explains in his book why he changed his name. ...but the masses have been trained to HATE him because he changed his name, and because his Yale buddy hired him and later donated to help him become a Senator?

Do the people trained to HATE him because he was only a senator for a couple years say the same thing about Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama?

And why do the masses blindly believe their reddit talking points about Victor Orban and Hungary? They have secure borders and strict immigration laws so therefore you must HATE them, call it an authoritarian dictatorship, and condemn US officials who have positive relations with Hungary?

shiftyandquick said:

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He's a social engineer at this core who is created by and propped up by his billionaire benefactors. There isn't a conservative bone in his body, but you already knew that.

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You would be the expert on that...

Keyno said:

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CDUB98 said:

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Voting GOP buys us time to try and primary more swamp creatures and change the GOP.

But, it sounds like you won't be happy with anything other than some right-wing authoritarian gov't, so I guess you'll never be happy.

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We've been "buying time" since Obama was elected. 2008. So almost 20 years. 2016 Trump was supposed to be the change candidate, but that didn't work. I guess let's keeping "buying time" though

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Says the guy that calls data that explicitly differentiates Trump from Obama "imaginary."

When you refuse to even acknowledge facts that contradict your narrative, you make yourself seemingly difficult to reason with.

MemphisAg1 said:

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Keyno said:

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Vance was a "Never Trump" guy for all of Trump's first term (back when Trump's rhetoric and policies were actually America First). I am Never Vance.

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And Trump was once a Democrat.

Still is on some days, lol, but he was clearly the best option given the alternate choice of Kamala.... by a longshot.

I don't care about their history. What are you doing for me today?

Gotta roll with what we got!

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So was Reagan...

I think that would disqualify Reagan to a certain subset of posters on here because he "pivoted"...

Also, I think that Vance's wife is a big part of the issue based on someone's past posting history...

Keyno said:

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MemphisAg1 said:

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Keyno said:

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Vance was a "Never Trump" guy for all of Trump's first term (back when Trump's rhetoric and policies were actually America First). I am Never Vance.

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And Trump was once a Democrat.

Still is on some days, lol, but he was clearly the best option given the alternate choice of Kamala.... by a longshot.

I don't care about their history. What are you doing for me today?

Gotta roll with what we got!

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Yeah I am done with the "we have to vote GOP because what if the democrats win"?! The GOP has betrayed me (and probably you) so many times that its just not worth it anymore.

In 2016, Trump's rhetoric was "build a wall, deport everyone, lock her up, end corruption, tariffs, Iraq was a mistake, no new wars, nationalism not globalism will be our credo, etc". Vance was a "Never Trump" guy during this time.

I am Never Vance.

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The Democrats won't betray you. They'll look you straight in the eye and tell you they're going to **** you over.

Good luck with them...

Ag with kids said:

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Keyno said:

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MemphisAg1 said:

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Keyno said:

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Vance was a "Never Trump" guy for all of Trump's first term (back when Trump's rhetoric and policies were actually America First). I am Never Vance.

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And Trump was once a Democrat.

Still is on some days, lol, but he was clearly the best option given the alternate choice of Kamala.... by a longshot.

I don't care about their history. What are you doing for me today?

Gotta roll with what we got!

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Yeah I am done with the "we have to vote GOP because what if the democrats win"?! The GOP has betrayed me (and probably you) so many times that its just not worth it anymore.

In 2016, Trump's rhetoric was "build a wall, deport everyone, lock her up, end corruption, tariffs, Iraq was a mistake, no new wars, nationalism not globalism will be our credo, etc". Vance was a "Never Trump" guy during this time.

I am Never Vance.

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The Democrats won't betray you. They'll look you straight in the eye and tell you they're going to **** you over.

Good luck with them...

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Correct. The enemy (democrats) is open. The traitor (the GOP) pretends they for you and then betrays you. The traitor is worse