I've done it causally the past year. It is basically free money if you don't spend more than you normally do to earn the sigm up bonuses. Even if you don't travel much, you can find lots of cash back situations/techniques that give you a nice extra return,on your spend. I use it mostly for travel, but have a brother that earns 3k-4k a year just on cash bonuses (him and his wife combined).

Cash bonuses from bank signups does work nicely when you can fund bonus requirements with credit cards.

You can clear 1500 a person without really trying very hard at all.

I think you may have misunderstood. I transfer to Delta at 1:1 but I find flights where a Delta sky mile is worth 1.5 cpp.

You all convinced me. Approved for CIP today, already have CSP. My journey has begun. Now to spend some money...

foleyt said:

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You all convinced me. Approved for CIP today, already have CSP. My journey has begun. Now to spend some money...

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Hope you had a referral link or you left about 200 bucks on the table for someone.

Chase is not manufactured spend sensitive. You can fund PNC money market accounts at 2k a pop or just buy gift cards at GCM and transfer to Serve all day.

Once you get far enough along you end up meeting spend requirements strictly with manufactured spending on all issuers but Amex. Amex is tougher and will ban you quick.

hypeiv said:

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I am currently working on the CIP and CIU. Plan on paying my property tax to reach the minimum spend on the CIP. I will likely try and see if they will give me the CIC after I hit these minimum spends and then move on to a sapphire since it has been over 48 months since I last received a sapphire sign up offer. You can only have one sapphire open at a time but I hear you can call and downgrade your sapphire to a freedom or something then apply for a new one.

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Spend some time reading up on the flowchart before doing this. Not knowing your goals or ability to hit spend is going to hurt my ability to help you out.

What you say about the personal Sapphire specifically is out dated info. You are now restricted to a 48 month cool down on personal Sapphire products. But there are some sneaky workaound.

Are you suggesting there is a way around the 48 month rule? I know you can do a modified double dip to get around one sapphire rule but I thought the 48 month rule was unbreakable.

pocketrockets06 said:

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Are you suggesting there is a way around the 48 month rule? I know you can do a modified double dip to get around one sapphire rule but I thought the 48 month rule was unbreakable.

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Sorry I had to read up a bit. The 48 rule does still stay if you drop to a freedom. I thought I heard you had to clear that account altogether. Not the case.

I would probably get the double dip done soon before they close it and get your second CIP with EIN after that.

Yep that's correct.

hypeiv said:

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I am currently working on the CIP and CIU. Plan on paying my property tax to reach the minimum spend on the CIP. I will likely try and see if they will give me the CIC after I hit these minimum spends and then move on to a sapphire since it has been over 48 months since I last received a sapphire sign up offer. You can only have one sapphire open at a time but I hear you can call and downgrade your sapphire to a freedom or something then apply for a new one.

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Nice. I've been focusing on CIP's to start, going to get a 4th here soon (thx to P2). How are you spacing out your apps with the business cards? I'm on a once every 6 months rate so far (with just Chase), and have been auto-approved each time. I've also done business cards with other banks in between Chase. I figure spreading things out a bit across different banks helps stay off the radar of any particular bank - if that makes sense. I'm not that hardcore like others are, so I'm probably being a bit overly cautious.

Anyhow, I am not sure how far (or at what pace) Chase approves multiple business cards. CIU and CIC are tempting as well later down the line.. heck, wondering if the SSN / EIN technique works to get other chase business cards as well? Lots of potential points there to get either way.

This is a noob question. I've heard in a podcast that you can accumulate a sign up bonus on the same Chase card every 24 months, but does that mean you are closing the card and then reapplying?

Wel, yes. But they've changed that on most (all?) UR cards. Now it's 48 months.

Awesome thread. I am pretty small time but I have been using a few churns a year to pay for trips.

Have done Chase Sapphire

Completed the Companion Pass last year... it expires a year from now which I'll cancel my cards and get it going again with my wife's account.

Just recently used my wife's account to get the Hyatt bonus (60K), referred my account to the card and working to get that bonus. We should each also use get 10K points from the referral.

I also have been using the Cap1 venture card as our daily spender for years, but I just recently signed my wife up for that due to the new 75K bonus.

Flights, hotels, rental cars, and ubers are basically paid for on every vacation my wife and I take.

The biggest problem I have right now is trying to carve out vacation when my wife is a busy dance teacher, I'm a coach, and we have a 4 year old and 7 month old. The points are easy. Finding times for a trip are not.

Bulldog73 said:

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Wel, yes. But they've changed that on most (all?) UR cards. Now it's 48 months.

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what is a ur card?

Culdeus, would you mind shooting me an email to discuss some specific AA churning questions outside of this forum?

hypeiv said:

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I got the CIP and CIU at the same time earlier this month. First time I ever tried for a business card. Some stuff came up with my car and I'll likely hit minimum spend sooner than I expected. My plan was to use the CIP to pay my property taxes since its only a 2.5% fee to use credit then hit the CIU minimum spend in ~2 months with regular purchases. However now I am looking at likely having a $1000 - 1500 car repair bill when my Jeep gets out of the shop so I'll be hitting the minimum spend on the CIU faster than I expected.

I have heard if you apply for Two Chase cards at once they only do a single hard pull... won't know if that is true for a few more weeks when my credit report updates.

I will try for a CIC next month and see if they give it to me (I think Chase will only let you get 2 cards every 30 days). I don't think a rejection is that big of a deal on your credit score once you are established, and I have been advised by other churners to try and get all the ink cards for bonus if you can.

edit edit: I wasn't auto approved for the cards on the webpage, but after 24 hours calling the automated number I got the message saying I was approved for both.

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This velocity sounds too fast. I would sprinkle in a non chase biz card and chill for 3 or so months.

If you have a lot of organic spend Amex is a good spot to put it.

culdeus said:

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Bulldog73 said:

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AA cards are that easy to churn? I may need to get my feet wet there. They have some really good redemptions when you can find SAAver fares.

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If married you should be able to flip a biz card every 95 days (each person) earning roughly 160k miles every 95 days and every 60 days an additional ~65-70k.

If you care about 5/24 status then you are probably hardcapped at about 650k a year. (Again, using wife also)

If you don't care about 5/24 you can pull about 1.8Million a year if you really hustle. 1.5M is realistic.

They are not MS sensitive so if you have a way to turn gift cards into money orders you can do these for about ehhh maybe $35 in fees per card.

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Anyway you can explain this more?

There was a great guide on reddit, that was too great and got some people butthurt and they deleted it.

The basics of this is

• Citi will give you a biz card every 95 days.
• You must cancel biz cards before starting a new application. This is important
• They will give you two cards of any type every 60 days, so you slide personal cards in on that schedule.
• You don't have to cancel personal cards.

So the biz clock is more important, you apply on the 95 day mark like it's your job. Biz cards also don't go on your personal credit.

You either apply your dog, your plant, your mom for AA accounts so they draw mailers or you buy/sell/trade them on reddit. The mailers have no 24month limiting language so you can turn these over and over.

Google GrAAvy train for more info. There are 10,000 post FlyerTalk threads on this topic alone.

Citi is not manufactured spend sensitive. Using giftcardmall is totally ok. I don't put any organic spend on these cards if I can help it. It's all plastiq or GCM or VGC funding. I try to clear the 3k-5k or whatever in the first statement.

Wow. Thanks! Do you need an EIN to not have the business cards go on your personal credit? Or can you use your SSN?

Wow. Thanks! Do you need an EIN to not have the business cards go on your personal credit? Or can you use your SSN?

This is the link I found:

https://www.reddit.com/user/aksurvivorfan/comments/9n0mkn/guide_to_churning_citi_aa_cards/

culdeus said:

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There was a great guide on reddit, that was too great and got some people butthurt and they deleted it.

The basics of this is

• Citi will give you a biz card every 95 days.
• You must cancel biz cards before starting a new application. This is important
• They will give you two cards of any type every 60 days, so you slide personal cards in on that schedule.
• You don't have to cancel personal cards.

So the biz clock is more important, you apply on the 95 day mark like it's your job. Biz cards also don't go on your personal credit.

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I didn't know you had to cancel for biz cards. I got my hands on my first mailers w/out 24-month language - good thing it isn't going to waste, lol

On AA - I would add in, don't forget about Barclays! They are harder to get approved on, but once you are approved their bonus requirements are usually super easy. I'd suggest doing theirs first before getting too deep into CITI cards. If you are in way deep on the grAAvy train already, you are probably better off just sticking with CITI.

Cyprian said:

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On AA - I would add in, don't forget about Barclays! They are harder to get approved on, but once you are approved their bonus requirements are usually super easy. I'd suggest doing theirs first before getting too deep into CITI cards. If you are in way deep on the grAAvy train already, you are probably better off just sticking with CITI.

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Barclays biz is an easy 60k miles but you pay the AF on those cards. Honestly if you are AF averse you can do better paying the GCM fees over Barclay's fees and get more miles per $$$.

Just 0.02. If you don't MS much then yeah, Barclays needs to be in your mix. Their A+ card is actually quite nice so don't sleep on that one and piss them off by going lol/24 on AA mailers too fast.

Yes, while I'd trade $95 for 60k points anytime, that's definitely a fair point on the AF comparison. I do 95+% of this organically - just an occasional gift card here or there. I can help thank child care and their willingness to take credit cards for payments for meeting a lot of our MSRs...

I'd love to hear about any cool redemption's. I'm finally doing my first family one (4 of us) - taking them to Disney this summer. Points from mostly cards took care of all the flights, stay on property (Disney Swan) (5 nights), plus a couple nights over in Clearwater beach area before heading back. Definitely kept the typical Disney costs down to a more reasonable level!

There is a 10000 post thread in Reddit on churning Disney.

The tldr is hammer all the UR cards. Disney is not like Hawaii or something you can get third party cards for a specific redemption

hypeiv said:

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culdeus said:

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hypeiv said:

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I got the CIP and CIU at the same time earlier this month. First time I ever tried for a business card. Some stuff came up with my car and I'll likely hit minimum spend sooner than I expected. My plan was to use the CIP to pay my property taxes since its only a 2.5% fee to use credit then hit the CIU minimum spend in ~2 months with regular purchases. However now I am looking at likely having a $1000 - 1500 car repair bill when my Jeep gets out of the shop so I'll be hitting the minimum spend on the CIU faster than I expected.

I have heard if you apply for Two Chase cards at once they only do a single hard pull... won't know if that is true for a few more weeks when my credit report updates.

I will try for a CIC next month and see if they give it to me (I think Chase will only let you get 2 cards every 30 days). I don't think a rejection is that big of a deal on your credit score once you are established, and I have been advised by other churners to try and get all the ink cards for bonus if you can.

edit edit: I wasn't auto approved for the cards on the webpage, but after 24 hours calling the automated number I got the message saying I was approved for both.

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This velocity sounds too fast. I would sprinkle in a non chase biz card and chill for 3 or so months.

If you have a lot of organic spend Amex is a good spot to put it.

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I might tap the brakes a bit and stretch these two cards out for the full 3 months to hit the minimum spend. My car repair bill ended up being $1300 and I am taking my dog to the vet today and will buy a years worth of medication so I should be able to spend $8000 between the cards without having to put much (or any) of my property taxes on the cards. I'll see where I stand in a month and make a decision then. I went ahead and had them lower my credit limit on both ink cards down from 12000 each to 5000 each. I think that might help get approved for the CIC in a few months since they were previously okay giving me a 24k limit and now I only have 10k.

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This is a really risky way to go about this. There are a lot of other biz cards out there. It is a known loophole you used to get 2 biz cards in same day with Chase and is absolutely not advised to use it because it has triggered shutdowns.

The current recommended spacing is 3 months per biz card. It's your call but i would advise:

• Finish spend organically
• In 5 months from your double application drop credit limits
• Wait additional month to apply for new card

The safer way to do this is to wait even longer. You do not want eyes on your account when you drop CL because they WILL spot the fact you loopholed your way into two biz cards.

Go get other biz cards and chill. This is a marathon, not a sprint.