infinity ag said:

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titan said:

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Well wasn't saying you were wrong, and it looks like not a small number of posters kind of agree with you. I wouldn't gainsay any of it, because of experience has been working for small businesses and I/T work for them. It wasn't big scale corporate and the owners were generally good guys. However, even back in retail work days, company heads would make sudden decisions just sacrificing great sales and employees to clearly benefit a known ladder climber. So nothing that strange about what you say.

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Many people here think the layoffs are for a real good business reason. Which is fine if that was the case. But no, most layoffs are to cut costs while sacrificing quality leading to the company slowly going down the tubes. The CEO makes money and the company or team is decimated. And money leaves the country forever. We lose as a country. Nowadays "We are laying off for AI" is a common lie. AI isn't taking jobs (yet). But that doesn't stop the lies. America loses.

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Well the cutting costs seems like what you would assume, but what was new learned on the board (maybe your posts) was that RIFs are done just because of how a quarterly report is shaping up, a last minute thing, rather than some well considered trimming of fat. And often does layoff people they still need; yes, to preserve the job of manages or higher above.

Athanasius said:

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than I ever have before. It's staggering.

And the ones getting jobs are taking massive pay cuts.

I think we are in for a very bad few years.

Who's bullish? Why?

---

The unemployment rate is 4.3%. That is very low. During the Ford, Carter, Reagan and Bush I years it was always averaging over six percent. Clinton and Bush II it was still over five percent. Obama it went up to over seven percent again.

https://historyinpieces.com/research/us-unemployment-rates-president

Admiral Nelson said:

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Athanasius said:

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than I ever have before. It's staggering.

And the ones getting jobs are taking massive pay cuts.

I think we are in for a very bad few years.

Who's bullish? Why?

---

The unemployment rate is 4.3%. That is very low. During the Ford, Carter, Reagan and Bush I years it was always averaging over six percent. Clinton and Bush II it was still over five percent. Obama it went up to over seven percent again.

https://historyinpieces.com/research/us-unemployment-rates-president

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I absolutely do not believe that is an accurate reflection.

Too many people have been forced to leave the workforce and are not counted.

Company was purchased in the spring, announced 50% kicker on bonuses as a retention plan to keep people on through close. Have known about impending layoffs/job role changes since then. Offered everyone 2 weeks per year up to 26 weeks of base and 12 months of bonus pay. They offered a job I didn't want to take last week, and final day of work will be in January. Between retention, actual severance and well in advance notice I have a long time to contemplate finding another job. Friend is already working on creating a role for me to fill.

As far as layoffs go it's pretty nice so far.

I'm just saying a blanket statement that everything is bad is just wrong.

titan said:

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infinity ag said:

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titan said:

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Well wasn't saying you were wrong, and it looks like not a small number of posters kind of agree with you. I wouldn't gainsay any of it, because of experience has been working for small businesses and I/T work for them. It wasn't big scale corporate and the owners were generally good guys. However, even back in retail work days, company heads would make sudden decisions just sacrificing great sales and employees to clearly benefit a known ladder climber. So nothing that strange about what you say.

---

Many people here think the layoffs are for a real good business reason. Which is fine if that was the case. But no, most layoffs are to cut costs while sacrificing quality leading to the company slowly going down the tubes. The CEO makes money and the company or team is decimated. And money leaves the country forever. We lose as a country. Nowadays "We are laying off for AI" is a common lie. AI isn't taking jobs (yet). But that doesn't stop the lies. America loses.

---

Well the cutting costs seems like what you would assume, but what was new learned on the board (maybe your posts) was that RIFs are done just because of how a quarterly report is shaping up, a last minute thing, rather than some well considered trimming of fat. And often does layoff people they still need; yes, to preserve the job of manages or higher above.

---

Yes, I sad that in another post/thread, and also said that there is no need to do any traditional hard work in America anymore. Just buy an index fund and sit on it and you will become rich. Well, more or less.
Why?
Because if you rely on your job, you will get laid off at some point and ageism may hit (some industries like tech). Companies today only care about Wall Street. Example: Microsoft. I know from insiders. Only goal is to increase stock price, not build great products. Focus has changed. So how do we deal with it? By being investors first, employees second. Play the rich man's game. If Mr Moneybags makes $1M, you make $100. Good enough. Buy index funds only, never company stock.

As for RIFs, yes, just to meet WS numbers. And they lie to everyone and blame AI, COVID, Moon's gravity, whatever comes to mind. Gullible people and business media just buys it.

Admiral Nelson said:

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Athanasius said:

---

than I ever have before. It's staggering.

And the ones getting jobs are taking massive pay cuts.

I think we are in for a very bad few years.

Who's bullish? Why?

---

The unemployment rate is 4.3%. That is very low. During the Ford, Carter, Reagan and Bush I years it was always averaging over six percent. Clinton and Bush II it was still over five percent. Obama it went up to over seven percent again.

https://historyinpieces.com/research/us-unemployment-rates-president

---

I think 4.3% is a fake number. Does not pass the smell test. We are in terrible shape.
Kids from top univs with good majors cannot get jobs. I am going through it now also some friends are.

jja79 said:

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I'm just saying a blanket statement that everything is bad is just wrong.

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Got it. In that context, I was specifically talking about Tech (other than AI)

infinity ag said:

---

Admiral Nelson said:

---

Athanasius said:

---

than I ever have before. It's staggering.

And the ones getting jobs are taking massive pay cuts.

I think we are in for a very bad few years.

Who's bullish? Why?

---

The unemployment rate is 4.3%. That is very low. During the Ford, Carter, Reagan and Bush I years it was always averaging over six percent. Clinton and Bush II it was still over five percent. Obama it went up to over seven percent again.

https://historyinpieces.com/research/us-unemployment-rates-president

---

I think 4.3% is a fake number. Does not pass the smell test. We are in terrible shape.
Kids from top univs with good majors cannot get jobs. I am going through it now also some friends are.

---

Know kids in our neighborhood that have graduated and no jobs. I know of Engineering major kids at A&M that are also finding it hard after graduation, can't get jobs in their Engineering field.

I find the unemployment numbers hard to believe. I would expect them to go high at the very least because of DOGE right? Not even a blip.

deddog said:

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infinity ag said:

---

Admiral Nelson said:

---

Athanasius said:

---

than I ever have before. It's staggering.

And the ones getting jobs are taking massive pay cuts.

I think we are in for a very bad few years.

Who's bullish? Why?

---

The unemployment rate is 4.3%. That is very low. During the Ford, Carter, Reagan and Bush I years it was always averaging over six percent. Clinton and Bush II it was still over five percent. Obama it went up to over seven percent again.

https://historyinpieces.com/research/us-unemployment-rates-president

---

I think 4.3% is a fake number. Does not pass the smell test. We are in terrible shape.
Kids from top univs with good majors cannot get jobs. I am going through it now also some friends are.

---

Know kids in our neighborhood that have graduated and no jobs. I know of Engineering major kids at A&M that are also finding it hard after graduation, can't get jobs in their Engineering field.

I find the unemployment numbers hard to believe. I would expect them to go high at the very least because of DOGE right? Not even a blip.

---

WSJ had an article last week on this. The unemployment rate for college grads is closer to 10%. It's not 4.3% for them. It's the highest for them in decades because they are competing with all of the experienced people getting laid off.

I had a Product Manager position I was hiring for last year and 3/4 of the people I interviewed were very senior people (as in people in their 40s and 50s) who were interviewing way down from their resume because they were desperate for the job. I also had a high weight of former Dell employees because they've had a few layoffs in the last two years where they shed senior, high earners. It was frankly a somewhat stressful interview process for me simply because I had so many overqualified people applying for the role and I just felt bad for them. Never really had that happen before and I've hired quite a few people in my career.

With all these CEOs doing the wrong thing (according to some) it's a wonder more of those who feel that way don't become CEOs themselves and take action to increase costs rather than cut costs, reduce the stock price, pay higher wages for work that could be done at lower wage costs, keep too many people employed, etc. They have all the answers it seems, but never reach the level where they can implement them!

deddog said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

Admiral Nelson said:

---

Athanasius said:

---

than I ever have before. It's staggering.

And the ones getting jobs are taking massive pay cuts.

I think we are in for a very bad few years.

Who's bullish? Why?

---

The unemployment rate is 4.3%. That is very low. During the Ford, Carter, Reagan and Bush I years it was always averaging over six percent. Clinton and Bush II it was still over five percent. Obama it went up to over seven percent again.

https://historyinpieces.com/research/us-unemployment-rates-president

---

I think 4.3% is a fake number. Does not pass the smell test. We are in terrible shape.
Kids from top univs with good majors cannot get jobs. I am going through it now also some friends are.

---

Know kids in our neighborhood that have graduated and no jobs. I know of Engineering major kids at A&M that are also finding it hard after graduation, can't get jobs in their Engineering field.

I find the unemployment numbers hard to believe. I would expect them to go high at the very least because of DOGE right? Not even a blip.

---

Yes, the number is a lie. What is shocking is people see so much carnage around and trot out the number so nonchalantly.

My son is looking, he is graduating next year. He delayed his graduation solely for job hunting, else he would have been done in 3 years. He was down in the dumps after his Doordash interview did not work out. It was 3 hours online, with manager, team mate and 1 programming round. Then he had one for an intership with Tesla, it did not work out either. Earlier he had a few ones that went "well" but no offer.

Today he got a call from Palantir (for interview)! Maybe this is the one? I am hoping and praying that it is. All that heart break would be worth it. Stock is through the roof too. It's been a struggle for him and for us.

infinity ag said:

---

deddog said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

Admiral Nelson said:

---

Athanasius said:

---

than I ever have before. It's staggering.

And the ones getting jobs are taking massive pay cuts.

I think we are in for a very bad few years.

Who's bullish? Why?

---

The unemployment rate is 4.3%. That is very low. During the Ford, Carter, Reagan and Bush I years it was always averaging over six percent. Clinton and Bush II it was still over five percent. Obama it went up to over seven percent again.

https://historyinpieces.com/research/us-unemployment-rates-president

---

I think 4.3% is a fake number. Does not pass the smell test. We are in terrible shape.
Kids from top univs with good majors cannot get jobs. I am going through it now also some friends are.

---

Know kids in our neighborhood that have graduated and no jobs. I know of Engineering major kids at A&M that are also finding it hard after graduation, can't get jobs in their Engineering field.

I find the unemployment numbers hard to believe. I would expect them to go high at the very least because of DOGE right? Not even a blip.

---

Yes, the number is a lie. What is shocking is people see so much carnage around and trot out the number so nonchalantly.

My son is looking, he is graduating next year. He delayed his graduation solely for job hunting, else he would have been done in 3 years. He was down in the dumps after his Doordash interview did not work out. It was 3 hours online, with manager, team mate and 1 programming round. Then he had one for an intership with Tesla, it did not work out either. Earlier he had a few ones that went "well" but no offer.

Today he got a call from Palantir (for interview)! Maybe this is the one? I am hoping and praying that it is. All that heart break would be worth it. Stock is through the roof too. It's been a struggle for him and for us.

---

Palantir is a great company to work for.

one safe place said:

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With all these CEOs doing the wrong thing (according to some) it's a wonder more of those who feel that way don't become CEOs themselves and take action to increase costs rather than cut costs, reduce the stock price, pay higher wages for work that could be done at lower wage costs, keep too many people employed, etc. They have all the answers it seems, but never reach the level where they can implement them!

---

You need to be a ruthless unscrupulous heartless scumbag to be a CEO of a somewhat large company. Most of us don't want to sell our souls to the devil. I sure don't. I don't need any corporation's money myself. I am just worried for our kids because we are leaving them a devastated economy.

one safe place said:

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With all these CEOs doing the wrong thing (according to some) it's a wonder more of those who feel that way don't become CEOs themselves and take action to increase costs rather than cut costs, reduce the stock price, pay higher wages for work that could be done at lower wage costs, keep too many people employed, etc. They have all the answers it seems, but never reach the level where they can implement them!

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The CEO hate-fest is overblown. There's some bad ones for sure, but there are many more good ones. I've worked with a number who are high integrity leaders that work endless hours to move their companies forward, which everyone in the company benefits from.

Roles comes and go as organizations evolve. Some people view it through the lens of a victim. Others adapt to the ongoing change and thrive. Some mumble by and merely survive until a headcount reduction thins them out.

CEOs and rich people are an easy target for people frustrated with their situation. You could confiscate all of their wealth and redistribute to the poor, and it wouldn't move the needle much. Plus, many of them would spend what little they received and be right back in the same spot.

Work ethic and the ability to delay gratification are huge factors for succeeding financially. Way too many people in our country today have no concept of either.

Some of us with talent, intelligence and a disdain for the bullkaka are unwilling to stick around and fail up to the mahogany walls and plush carpet.

Now, i dont understand the guy who hates on the c suite and corporate policy whilst enjoying the concept that his paycheck comes every two weeks, his healthcare is negotiated on his behalf, same for his retirement.

His email and corporate cellphone function and he never sees a bill for it. His tough decisions are who to go to lunch with and what flavored creamer to put in their coffee.

But by god they know that H1Bs are the antichrists army that must be stopped.

There are more than a couple more seasoned folks around here who can opine that it's takes hard work, strong focus, tough guts and being prepared when opportunity presents itself (some call that part luck).

one safe place said:

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With all these CEOs doing the wrong thing (according to some) it's a wonder more of those who feel that way don't become CEOs themselves and take action to increase costs rather than cut costs, reduce the stock price, pay higher wages for work that could be done at lower wage costs, keep too many people employed, etc. They have all the answers it seems, but never reach the level where they can implement them!

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CEOs are not necessarily the problem. But when you have a public corporation with a lot of leadership, it takes only a few lousy execs to screw things for the whole company.

Also, there is a Bell curve for CEOs too. The problem isn't the bad ones. Its the mediocre ones, and there's a lot of them. Not bad enough to fire, but not good enough to get companies out of tough situations either. Offshoring is an "easy win"

What's his degree? Maybe you posted that earlier and I missed it.

jja79 said:

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What's his degree? Maybe you posted that earlier and I missed it.

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Computer Science.

NEW - HP will cut 4,000 and 6,000 jobs by the end of fiscal 2028, due to AI integrations. The company estimates it will save approximately $1 billion — CNBC

— Disclose.tv (@disclosetv) November 25, 2025

at least that's the plan now until people realize how limiting and ****ty AI actually is for most things (not all, obviously)

Cue the AI "expert" who works in the field to tell us that is a lie by HP and that AI is worthless.

It's quite bizarre. A person who works in AI says it's total bull**** and can't be used to improve productivity, increase efficiency and reduce human labor.

I'm making more money than I ever had. Doing a double shift today by choice and volunteered for tomorrow if needed. Been laid off 3 times. The last two were back to back thanks to Obama. You got to keep plugging away and not expect things to fall in your lap.

BadMoonRisin said:

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at least that's the plan now until people realize how limiting and ****ty AI actually is for most things (not all, obviously)

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It's not AI. They are just using AI as an excuse because you will believe it and the execs are off the hook for their sheety management.

Anubus said:

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I'm making more money than I ever had. Doing a double shift today by choice and volunteered for tomorrow if needed. Been laid off 3 times. The last two were back to back thanks to Obama. You got to keep plugging away and not expect things to fall in your lap.

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That is great news, congratulations!

If you don't mind sharing, what do you do? How has recent events helped make you more money?

infinity ag said:

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Anubus said:

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I'm making more money than I ever had. Doing a double shift today by choice and volunteered for tomorrow if needed. Been laid off 3 times. The last two were back to back thanks to Obama. You got to keep plugging away and not expect things to fall in your lap.

---

That is great news, congratulations!

If you don't mind sharing, what do you do? How has recent events helped make you more money?

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I'm a Packing Machine Technician. We have a niche product so the market is basically cornered. Good or bad economy doesn't matter all that much.

I do know there are jobs that's desperately are needing employees such as Trucking and ATC.

Anubus said:

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infinity ag said:

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Anubus said:

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I'm making more money than I ever had. Doing a double shift today by choice and volunteered for tomorrow if needed. Been laid off 3 times. The last two were back to back thanks to Obama. You got to keep plugging away and not expect things to fall in your lap.

---

That is great news, congratulations!

If you don't mind sharing, what do you do? How has recent events helped make you more money?

---

I'm a Packing Machine Technician. We have a niche product so the market is basically cornered. Good or bad economy doesn't matter all that much.

I do know there are jobs that's desperately are needing employees such as Trucking and ATC.

---

Well done!
An wish you the best in the future!

infinity ag said:

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Anubus said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

Anubus said:

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I'm making more money than I ever had. Doing a double shift today by choice and volunteered for tomorrow if needed. Been laid off 3 times. The last two were back to back thanks to Obama. You got to keep plugging away and not expect things to fall in your lap.

---

That is great news, congratulations!

If you don't mind sharing, what do you do? How has recent events helped make you more money?

---

I'm a Packing Machine Technician. We have a niche product so the market is basically cornered. Good or bad economy doesn't matter all that much.

I do know there are jobs that's desperately are needing employees such as Trucking and ATC.

---

Well done!
An wish you the best in the future!

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Thank you!

I don't personally know anyone who's been laid off, but morale feels low almost everywhere. It's pretty discouraging, to say the least.

Artimus Gordon said:

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This is Hillary's big reset. Btw the Texas economy is exploding. You can't even get out on the highway without the risk of getting run over by an 18 wheeler!

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Or an illegal that doesn't know how to drive !

BadMoonRisin said:

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at least that's the plan now until people realize how limiting and ****ty AI actually is for most things (not all, obviously)

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Once companies realize Average Intelligence isnt that valuable the AI bubble will burst. Are there applications for AI, yes. Are they the crazy dreams that executives think, no.

Doubt it. Its presently on an ever-improving curve. There are some things where it is very easy to see that it is already on the way to perfecting what it does and its just a matter of fine turning. The most obvious of these is its ability to render movies without cast or sets but look like it was filmed with both. That's only a domestic simple example. There are others.

It might be true its not turning into Skynet, but it will definitely prove to be as real a change as Windows/Apple and the Internet were to business.

Admiral Nelson said:

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Athanasius said:

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than I ever have before. It's staggering.

And the ones getting jobs are taking massive pay cuts.

I think we are in for a very bad few years.

Who's bullish? Why?

---

The unemployment rate is 4.3%. That is very low. During the Ford, Carter, Reagan and Bush I years it was always averaging over six percent. Clinton and Bush II it was still over five percent. Obama it went up to over seven percent again.

https://historyinpieces.com/research/us-unemployment-rates-president

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Do not confuse the OP with facts, it blows the narrative.

Yall need to realize we are quite a biased group. The best of the best dont get laid off much.