I'm at the gym. But that characterization is delusional. Sorry.

Yup. Simp behavior.

Logos Stick said:

---

I'm at the gym. But that characterization is delusional. Sorry.

---

Think you need to work on a different kind of flex right now

The marxists and fascists are both on the left. See: Biden regime.

Malibu said:

---

Its as much a fact that Democrats are openly Marxist now as it is that Republicans are openly fascist. Good for f16 or blue sky karma farming, less useful at articulating actual complicated reality. If that's where most of the board's head is at, I'll go back to my self imposed exile, not really much fruitful discussion to be had.

As for the rest, its the system we have. There's no reason why 9 SCOTUS justices instead of 7 and 2 senators instead of 1 or 3 is the mathematically correct system in a Democracy, just political tradition and its good enough. Arguments against electoral college system is a potential for the majority to have a permanent democratic deficit (system design where structurally the majority always loses), and that leads to balkanization (Brexit and the EU). I think our system is good enough to not need to reform the EC, but that could change with more gerrymandering and assigning voters by districts won.

The current tit-for-tat game were playing isn't useful for anyone.

---

The current and future of the Democrat Party is Marxism. This is a fact. WSJ even ran an article over the weekend walking through how Bernie has ultimately positioned himself as the behind the scenes power broker for DSA and the Democrats. See Mamdani. See AOC. See VA AG threatening to murder his adversary and his kids. Party is pro-open borders. Party is for child mutilation. Polling of younger generations all show them as Marxists. I'm not sure why one would deny this reality and then try to play "both sides".

There was a very brief period post Trump's election where a group of "moderate" Democrats tried to push a new ideology of "Abundance" that was a bit more business and economics friendly, and that movement was quickly destroyed by mainline Democrats. It's been memory holed at this point.

Don't really have any Fascism examples by Republicans although I realize once normal policies held by both parties are now considered Fascist by Democrats. Many Republicans won't even respond in kind to repeated Democrat attempts to fundamentally and permanently change the country in their favor. See Indiana. See the Senate where the Republicans are above such gauche behaviors. Meanwhile, the Dems just smile and nod at them and will remove all pretense of wanting to work together as soon as they get power back.

Guess we will go out taking the high road though for whatever good that will do anyone.

BusterAg said:

---

Ag83 said:

---

richardag said:

---

Ag83 said:

---

Quote:

---

The conservative movement including MAGA wants the Constitution followed

---

No they don't. They only want it followed when it suits them - otherwise they're happy to trash it just like liberals.

---

Citations please.

---

We could start with FISA 702.

---

Pretty sure most Maga hates FISA 702.

Got anything else?

---

MAGA follows whatever Trump tells them to think. Mr. MAGA himself has been pushing for a "clean" extension of FISA 702. Got any better rebuttal? I just gave one recent example.

Malibu said:

---

Its as much a fact that Democrats are openly Marxist now as it is that Republicans are openly fascist. Good for f16 or blue sky karma farming, less useful at articulating actual complicated reality. If that's where most of the board's head is at, I'll go back to my self imposed exile, not really much fruitful discussion to be had.

As for the rest, its the system we have. There's no reason why 9 SCOTUS justices instead of 7 and 2 senators instead of 1 or 3 is the mathematically correct system in a Democracy, just political tradition and its good enough. Arguments against electoral college system is a potential for the majority to have a permanent democratic deficit (system design where structurally the majority always loses), and that leads to balkanization (Brexit and the EU). I think our system is good enough to not need to reform the EC, but that could change with more gerrymandering and assigning voters by districts won.

The current tit-for-tat game were playing isn't useful for anyone.

---

WOW! The people following the Constitution are the fascists? Really? Not a great way to start a post if you wanted to actually make a valid point. But you don't have a valid point in the rest of that post either.

Stop bemoaning about the popular vote being the "majority" that always loses versus the Electoral College because that is just historically false. And ignores the 12th Amendment, which again reflects our status as a republic of states. One state, one vote under the 12th. (Why Gore conceded in 2000. Taking that election to the House would not have changed the outcome. At least Gore could do that math.)

And again I need to remind you of our form of government. We are not a pure democracy, at best a watered down version of a representative democracy (except in Virginia now).

So your concerns are without merit and not supported historically.

We are a republic of states. Our Constitution was written with that main goal in mind.

I think you're taking a few useful detours to arrive at a conclusion. On Democrats and Marxism, first, lets quickly avert our eyes to another government funded equity stake in a private business led by this administration (welcome aboard to Comrade Airlines, nee Spirit), and address it head on and with fairness. Yes, the left is more redistributiony than the right and always has been. Mamdani, AOC, Bernie, and co are certainly examples of this in extrema, but I'd caution against overplaying your hand here.

Mamdani was against Eric Adams (corrupt, unpopular), Cuomo (corrupt, rapey, and murdery) and got to 50.78% of the vote in a very liberal city. Bernie lost in 2020. The Democrats still havent had a progressive at the top of the ticket, and when Biden governed as one, he lost voters. We'll see who the nominee is in 2028, and I suspect if the progressives win it will be another L in November.

As for what have Republicans done that has made the country squirrly, free advice is not to copy paste Minneapolis tactics across the country, nor keep beating the drum about taking territory from allies.

I don't think that someone could read my post in good faith and respond the way that you did. You're arguing against arguments that I never made

Malibu said:

---

I don't think that someone could read my post in good faith and respond the way that you did. You're arguing against arguments that I never made

---

I read words. Words have meaning. Not my fault your language is loose and inaccurate. I read it a few times in good faith, hoping there were a few words missing that would change the tenor. I failed to discern such an oversight so was left with what you wrote.

Now instead of attacking me, do you have any rejoinder to the facts I have set out and the reasons therefor?

No not really. You're not saying anything that I disagree with so there's nothing to argue against

Malibu said:

---

I think you're taking a few useful detours to arrive at a conclusion. On Democrats and Marxism, first, lets quickly avert our eyes to another government funded equity stake in a private business led by this administration (welcome aboard to Comrade Airlines, nee Spirit), and address it head on and with fairness. Yes, the left is more redistributiony than the right and always has been. Mamdani, AOC, Bernie, and co are certainly examples of this in extrema, but I'd caution against overplaying your hand here.

Mamdani was against Eric Adams (corrupt, unpopular), Cuomo (corrupt, rapey, and murdery) and got to 50.78% of the vote in a very liberal city. Bernie lost in 2020. The Democrats still havent had a progressive at the top of the ticket, and when Biden governed as one, he lost voters. We'll see who the nominee is in 2028, and I suspect if the progressives win it will be another L in November.

As for what have Republicans done that has made the country squirrly, free advice is not to copy paste Minneapolis tactics across the country, nor keep beating the drum about taking territory from allies.

---

No, I'm not. I'm sharing reality. And I already addressed Trump's brain dead, dumbass decision on Spirit. You can see my comment on it on other thread. And he's always been left of center until he ran for POTUS as a Republican who, by the way, are as left on the political scale as they've ever been. This country has only ever moved to the left. Trump is also pro choice and squishy on guns as well. Not my preferred candidate but his good outweighs the bad and he's still better than any Democrat who are full blown far left now.

Eric Adam's and Cuomo were both Democrats. Those are points you made in my favor.

Regarding 2028, I think it will be Gavin. He will run left in the primary and then tack to middle in the general and then go back to open borders (direct Marxist policy) and whatever other grab bag of far left idiocy the party wants.

I think I'm more pointing out that calling the democrats Marxist when the current administration is taking some control over the means of production, seems to be ignoring the Barbarians already past the gate. My point about Mamdani was that it was more of a Roy Moore situation than philosophical win for the progressive faction and extrapolating conclusions about the direction of the party should be tempered. And if the democrats are stupid enough to nominate newsom they deserve to lose.

Quote:

---

I think I'm more pointing out that calling the democrats Marxist when the current administration is taking some control over the means of production

---

Such as?

Malibu said:

---

I think I'm more pointing out that calling the democrats Marxist when the current administration is taking some control over the means of production

---

No clear-minded person would insinuate republicans are the party of big government when compared to democrats. That is beyond a laughable assertion.

Republicans suck. Democrats are borderline communists today.

aggiehawg said:

---

Quote:

---

I think I'm more pointing out that calling the democrats Marxist when the current administration is taking some control over the means of production

---

Such as?

---

Taking equity stakes in private enterprises. Like intel, and today Spirit.

Malibu said:

---

Its as much a fact that Democrats are openly Marxist now as it is that Republicans are openly fascist. Good for f16 or blue sky karma farming, less useful at articulating actual complicated reality. If that's where most of the board's head is at, I'll go back to my self imposed exile, not really much fruitful discussion to be had.

As for the rest, its the system we have. There's no reason why 9 SCOTUS justices instead of 7 and 2 senators instead of 1 or 3 is the mathematically correct system in a Democracy, just political tradition and its good enough. Arguments against electoral college system is a potential for the majority to have a permanent democratic deficit (system design where structurally the majority always loses), and that leads to balkanization (Brexit and the EU). I think our system is good enough to not need to reform the EC, but that could change with more gerrymandering and assigning voters by districts won.

The current tit-for-tat game were playing isn't useful for anyone.

---

Seems the Democratic Party leadership wants to abolish the electoral college.
Senate Democrats push plan to abolish Electoral College

• Sens. Brian Schatz (D-Hawaii,) Dick Durbin (D-Ill.) and Peter Welch (D-Vt.), three leading progressive Senate voices, say it's time to "restore democracy" by allowing for the direct election of presidents through the popular vote alone.

How to Finally Abolish the Electoral College

• That dynamic has led to growing Democratic calls to abolish the Electoral College, even by the party's vice presidential nominee Tim Walz.

The disdain for the Constitution held by the Democratic Party leadership is tragic, amoral & dishonorable.

Malibu said:

---

aggiehawg said:

---

Quote:

---

I think I'm more pointing out that calling the democrats Marxist when the current administration is taking some control over the means of production

---

Such as?

---

Taking equity stakes in private enterprises. Like intel, and today Spirit.

---

U.S. government takes 10% stake in Intel, as Trump expands control over private sector
Not an ideal situation, however, Intel is a national security issue due to China.
note:Intel said that the U.S. government won't have a board seat or other governance rights.
So the title of the article is a lie

As far as Spirit Airlines, the previous administration blocked the acquisition of Spirit by JetBlue which would have saved the airline.I believe in this instance let market forces determine outcome but an equity stake seems better than a bailout, maybe, we'll have to see.

richardag said:

---

Seems the Democratic Party leadership wants to abolish the electoral college.
Senate Democrats push plan to abolish Electoral College

• Sens. Brian Schatz (D-Hawaii,) Dick Durbin (D-Ill.) and Peter Welch (D-Vt.), three leading progressive Senate voices, say it's time to "restore democracy" by allowing for the direct election of presidents through the popular vote alone.

How to Finally Abolish the Electoral College

• That dynamic has led to growing Democratic calls to abolish the Electoral College, even by the party's vice presidential nominee Tim Walz.

The disdain for the Constitution held by the Democratic Party leadership is tragic, amoral & dishonorable.

---

Only 3 percent of Americans approve of Democrats in congress.

Quote:

---

The 3 percent figure for Democrats is not a one-off. Democrats' approval of Congress has hovered in the low single digits for nearly a year, a stretch that coincides almost exactly with Democrats' sustained campaign of obstruction against the Republican majority's agenda. Rather than engaging legislatively, Democrat "leaders" have leaned into delay tactics, including filibuster threats and procedural blocks, and their own voters have noticed. At 3 percent, Democrats are not just disapproving of Congress; they are registering a verdict on their own party's strategy.
...
At 3 percent approval, Democrats are effectively registering no confidence in Congress at all but that number is also a mirror. A party that has spent the past year blocking legislation, rejecting compromise, and prioritizing obstruction over governance has little standing to be surprised when its own base stops believing in the institution. Democrat leadership chose the strategy of resistance. The 3 percent figure is what that strategy looks like when the voters who sent them there finally stop pretending it's working.

---

I suspect that is over-stating their actual support, though.