Ag Natural said:

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AG 2000' said:

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https://ahnfiredigital.com/nba/team-usa-players-are-frustrated-with-gregg-popovich-running-the-san-antonio-offense/

Pop trying to teach Team USA the Spurs offense in three weeks. What a fool.

Get some pick and roll going with your shooters and profit, you old fool.

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All NBA players were missing wide open shots all game. This has nothing to do with any system. They just choked.

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The team is basically set up for Durant and Lillard to carry the load, and when they can't throw the ball in the ocean, we gunna lose.

LawHall88 said:

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Ag Natural said:

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AG 2000' said:

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https://ahnfiredigital.com/nba/team-usa-players-are-frustrated-with-gregg-popovich-running-the-san-antonio-offense/

Pop trying to teach Team USA the Spurs offense in three weeks. What a fool.

Get some pick and roll going with your shooters and profit, you old fool.

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All NBA players were missing wide open shots all game. This has nothing to do with any system. They just choked.

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The team is basically set up for Durant and Lillard to carry the load, and when they can't throw the ball in the ocean, we gunna lose.

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Booker, Tatum, Middleton, and Lavine are all elite scorers as well. The team combined to shoot 36% and 31% from 3. Truly pathetic.

Ag Natural said:

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LawHall88 said:

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Ag Natural said:

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AG 2000' said:

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https://ahnfiredigital.com/nba/team-usa-players-are-frustrated-with-gregg-popovich-running-the-san-antonio-offense/

Pop trying to teach Team USA the Spurs offense in three weeks. What a fool.

Get some pick and roll going with your shooters and profit, you old fool.

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All NBA players were missing wide open shots all game. This has nothing to do with any system. They just choked.

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The team is basically set up for Durant and Lillard to carry the load, and when they can't throw the ball in the ocean, we gunna lose.

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Booker, Tatum, Middleton, and Lavine are all elite scorers as well. The team combined to shoot 36% and 31% from 3. Truly pathetic.

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I don't know what we're going get out of Middleton and Booker given the circumstances (although Holiday was our best player at times). But we desperately need our shooters to make shots, so maybe we throw them in the fire and hope for the best.

It's great they want to play, but we might have been better off limiting the team to players who didn't advance past the first round of the playoffs, to give them time to rest up and then practice with the team. Also, not wasting a spot on Kevin Love might have helped.

LawHall88 said:

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Ag Natural said:

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LawHall88 said:

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Ag Natural said:

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AG 2000' said:

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https://ahnfiredigital.com/nba/team-usa-players-are-frustrated-with-gregg-popovich-running-the-san-antonio-offense/

Pop trying to teach Team USA the Spurs offense in three weeks. What a fool.

Get some pick and roll going with your shooters and profit, you old fool.

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All NBA players were missing wide open shots all game. This has nothing to do with any system. They just choked.

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The team is basically set up for Durant and Lillard to carry the load, and when they can't throw the ball in the ocean, we gunna lose.

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Booker, Tatum, Middleton, and Lavine are all elite scorers as well. The team combined to shoot 36% and 31% from 3. Truly pathetic.

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I don't know what we're going get out of Middleton and Booker given the circumstances (although Holiday was our best player at times). But we desperately need our shooters to make shots, so maybe we throw them in the fire and hope for the best.

It's great they want to play, but we might have been better off limiting the team to players who didn't advance past the first round of the playoffs, to give them time to rest up and then practice with the team. Also, not wasting a spot on Kevin Love might have helped.

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ya think? The hangover and jet lag is enough to kill the legs

Such a bad roster from Colangelo AND Pop

I'm convinced this team would be better with only a few A list scorers like Durant and Lillard, and then just having a bunch of high level role guys similar to Draymond and Holliday. Obviously Klay Thompson wasn't available, but he would have been an ideal guy for this team. Too many iso scorers and not enough guys willing to get scrappy. Like others have previously said, the makeup of this team is definitely odd.

I watched the game this morning closely and the issue isn't about hustle, toughness, or being unselfish. I actual felt like the guys were being too unselfish at times. Superstar shooters passing up open looks.

They got after it on defense. Unfortunately they had the kind of breakdowns you see when guys haven't played together. France ran some well designed plays and we just lost shooters. And France wasn't missing today.

Ag Natural said:

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Ulrich said:

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The Spurs haven't had a good point guard since Parker left. That's the biggest need, and landing one could potentially unlock a lot of the talent on the team.

That said, even with a good point guard they are stuck in purgatory with a ceiling of scrappy second round exit. Totally unsurprising given their roster decisions for the last few years, but at this point they have to get really lucky in the draft or just deal with it until the team collapses. No big free agents are going to San Antonio.

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There's always luck involved unless you are the Lakers. All you can do is keep stacking assets and hope some of these guys become breakout stars or they get valuable enough to bundle and trade for a disgruntled star.

I understand the impatience but its no use trying to rush anything.

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Impatience was deciding that DeRozan was a better idea than whatever picks we could get. We're paying for that now.

Ag Natural said:

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I watched the game this morning closely and the issue isn't about hustle, toughness, or being unselfish. I actual felt like the guys were being too unselfish at times. Superstar shooters passing up open looks.

They got after it on defense. Unfortunately they had the kind of breakdowns you see when guys haven't played together. France ran some well designed plays and we just lost shooters. And France wasn't missing today.

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Those back-to-back corner threes on French inbounds plays were hard to watch. So was missing what felt like a dozen consecutive open threes. Is the international ball still a different size?

France definitely looked more like a team, but 50% of our issue was good shooters missing open looks, and 40% was a bunch of guys trying to figure out how to play defense together on the fly.

BREAKING: San Antonio’ DeMar DeRozan tells Shannon Sharpe on his podcast ‘Club Shay Shay’ that he is looking to win and compete for a championship with his next move this free agency.

This should now ultimately kill any rumours that DeMar will return to the Spurs this offseason.

— Zach (@zachcolwell_) July 26, 2021

Or maybe he's just that confident he can put Lonnie Walker and gang on his back for a deep playoff run.

All along I've given it about a 5% chance that DD plays for SA next year. It's way more likely they do a sign and trade or he just walks and signs for low money.

As the rumor mill heats up getting closer to the draft.

SI mentioned the Spurs are looking to trade into the Top-10, though they didn't mentioned how far up. https://t.co/kq0U9CiQZ4

On an upcoming Spurscast episode, we look at some trade deals for 10th with New Orleans or 9th with the Kings

— Paul Garcia (@PaulGarciaNBA) July 26, 2021

West Texan said:

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As the rumor mill heats up getting closer to the draft.

SI mentioned the Spurs are looking to trade into the Top-10, though they didn't mentioned how far up. https://t.co/kq0U9CiQZ4

On an upcoming Spurscast episode, we look at some trade deals for 10th with New Orleans or 9th with the Kings

— Paul Garcia (@PaulGarciaNBA) July 26, 2021

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DD for Lonzo and 10.

Enzo The Baker said:

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I want us to try something so badly. Make some sort of move. Of course not just for the sake of making it. But at least take a swing. Worst case, we make a mistake, have a bad record and are in a better draft position in the future. But the past will tell us that we are standing pat.

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That's what I wanted us to do the year before last. Get some damn assets for LaMarcus before he fell apart and get something for DD.

Instead, we extend White, losing a ton of cap flexibility and we let LMA go for nothing.

I could see Patty going to Dallas and fitting perfectly there. Hope he shows up and earns money in the Olympics.

I can see us offering a big contract to Collins, ATL matching, then splitting the cash between Duncan Robinson and Lauri.

Guitarsoup said:

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Enzo The Baker said:

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I want us to try something so badly. Make some sort of move. Of course not just for the sake of making it. But at least take a swing. Worst case, we make a mistake, have a bad record and are in a better draft position in the future. But the past will tell us that we are standing pat.

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That's what I wanted us to do the year before last. Get some damn assets for LaMarcus before he fell apart and get something for DD.

Instead, we extend White, losing a ton of cap flexibility and we let LMA go for nothing.

I could see Patty going to Dallas and fitting perfectly there. Hope he shows up and earns money in the Olympics.

I can see us offering a big contract to Collins, ATL matching, then splitting the cash between Duncan Robinson and Lauri.

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The rumor was we offered LMA for Josh Jackson. He's been a bust so far but I guess you could make he case he would have developed better in SA.

I think we have a lot of young guys with great potential. It's tough to decide who to give up on.

Ag Natural said:

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Guitarsoup said:

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Enzo The Baker said:

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I want us to try something so badly. Make some sort of move. Of course not just for the sake of making it. But at least take a swing. Worst case, we make a mistake, have a bad record and are in a better draft position in the future. But the past will tell us that we are standing pat.

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That's what I wanted us to do the year before last. Get some damn assets for LaMarcus before he fell apart and get something for DD.

Instead, we extend White, losing a ton of cap flexibility and we let LMA go for nothing.

I could see Patty going to Dallas and fitting perfectly there. Hope he shows up and earns money in the Olympics.

I can see us offering a big contract to Collins, ATL matching, then splitting the cash between Duncan Robinson and Lauri.

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The rumor was we offered LMA for Josh Jackson. He's been a bust so far but I guess you could make he case he would have developed better in SA.

I think we have a lot of young guys with great potential. It's tough to decide who to give up on.

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I hadn't heard that about Josh Jackson. That guy's a spare, rather lose LMA for nothing than Josh with nothing else. Still can't believe PHX picked him over D'Aaron Fox, Donovan Mitchell, and Bam. Such a stacked drafted and #1 and #4 were complete busts.

It's amazing that PHX is where they are despite some of their draft selections. Last year's selection was super questionable. They could have taken Halliburton to be the heir apparent to CP and would have been set up as a sure fire contender for over a decade.

Enzo The Baker said:

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It's amazing that PHX is where they are despite some of their draft selections. Last year's selection was super questionable. They could have taken Halliburton to be the heir apparent to CP and would have been set up as a sure fire contender for over a decade.

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Seems like every year, there was a better option. They traded Zhaire Smith and the unprotected Miami 1st this year to get Brdges, who is good for them. But they picked him over Michael Porter, Shai GA,

In 2019, they traded back to get Sakic and Cameron Johnson. Could have been Keldon, Herro,

Like you said, Jalen Smith over Halliburton.

In 16, they took Dragan Bender 4th overall and he's out of the league. Jamal Murray, Buddy Hield, Brogdon, Pascal, LaVert, Sabonis, DeJounte,

How did they get to the Finals with drafting that bad literally every ear?

Guitarsoup said:

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Enzo The Baker said:

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It's amazing that PHX is where they are despite some of their draft selections. Last year's selection was super questionable. They could have taken Halliburton to be the heir apparent to CP and would have been set up as a sure fire contender for over a decade.

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Seems like every year, there was a better option. They traded Zhaire Smith and the unprotected Miami 1st this year to get Brdges, who is good for them. But they picked him over Michael Porter, Shai GA,

In 2019, they traded back to get Sakic and Cameron Johnson. Could have been Keldon, Herro,

Like you said, Jalen Smith over Halliburton.

In 16, they took Dragan Bender 4th overall and he's out of the league. Jamal Murray, Buddy Hield, Brogdon, Pascal, LaVert, Sabonis, DeJounte,

How did they get to the Finals with drafting that bad literally every ear?

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They hit on Devin Booker at 13, then got the #1 pick in a strong draft and picked Ayton. I've seen some articles about how the Suns should be the standard for how to build a team, but the fact is they got lucky on a late lottery pick turning into a stud and then won the lottery. They've had a couple other picks already mentioned that are solid pieces (bridges, Johnson) but it's not like they're some kind of draft experts. I think there are several teams that draft much better, but haven't been high enough or hit on that one random late lottery guy who explodes.

Yea Booker is the main one. And Ayton is, at best, the third best player in that draft (as of today).

Josh Giddey is the name I've heard Memphis is presumed to be targeting by moving up https://t.co/JHwXqouDez

— Jonathan Wasserman (@NBADraftWass) July 26, 2021

Well there (potentially) goes 1 of the 2 guys I like best for the Spurs at 12.

Enzo The Baker said:

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Yea Booker is the main one. And Ayton is, at best, the third best player in that draft (as of today).

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Yes, but he's still a very good player who is a strong piece to build around.

Damn. I liked Giddey too. That's interesting that's the selection they would go with. They have a franchise PG. And Anderson is a good playmaker with similar size. But what do I know.

Edit: Guess if the Spurs really want him they can leap frog them into the top 10.

West Texan said:

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Enzo The Baker said:

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Yea Booker is the main one. And Ayton is, at best, the third best player in that draft (as of today).

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Yes, but he's still a very good player who is a strong piece to build around.

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I agree. I'm just saying it's not the Suns being 'savvy'.

Enzo The Baker said:

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West Texan said:

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Enzo The Baker said:

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Yea Booker is the main one. And Ayton is, at best, the third best player in that draft (as of today).

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Yes, but he's still a very good player who is a strong piece to build around.

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I agree. I'm just saying it's not the Suns being 'savvy'.

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Agreed. It's easy to look good when you get the #1 pick.

Jazz looking to dump Favors's salary for their #30 pick. Wouldn't be a bad move for the Spurs if they don't intend to use all of their cap space on a FA this season.

Enzo The Baker said:

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Jazz looking to dump Favors's salary for their #30 pick. Wouldn't be a bad move for the Spurs if they don't intend to use all of their cap space on a FA this season.

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Pass. 2y20mm and Favors put up 5/5 last year. Can't shoot, can't create for others. He's a 15-20min rebounder at this point. That can't be that hard to get and we already have Eubanks playing that role.

I wouldn't make the trade for Favors. If there is someone still there at #30 I think it would be worth it. We have a lot of guys on their rookie scale. He could always be bought out too. If we don't intend on using the cap space why not?

Edit: Also it's not likely we are competing for anything more than a 1st round exit at best the next couple of years regardless. Getting another 1st rounder would at least give us another swing.

Enzo The Baker said:

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I wouldn't make the trade for Favors. If there is someone still there at #30 I think it would be worth it. We have a lot of guys on their rookie scale. He could always be bought out too. If we don't intend on using the cap space why not?

Edit: Also it's not likely we are competing for anything more than a 1st round exit at best the next couple of years regardless. Getting another 1st rounder would at least give us another swing.

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There might be better offers, and I am sure the Spurs plan to do something.

There are a few teams in bad cap situations.

Utah: 1.5mm of space under lux tax with 11 players. Mike Conley is a free agent. That's rough for them. They need Conley and he will get a lot of interest, since FA is so bad. If they want to salary dump, I'd rather have Ingles or Bojan.

GSW: 31mm over the LUX tax with the 7&14 picks. Current lux tax bill is $120mm.

Brooklyn: 7 guaranteed contracts for 26mm over lux tax. Dinwiddie, Blake Griffin, Jeff Green, and Bruce Brown are FAs.

Washington: 7 guaranteed contracts with just 12mm under the lux tax. Lots of FAs.

Minn: 3mm in lux tax space with 10 guaranteed contacts.

Philly: 4mm in cap space with 9 guaranteed contracts. Danny Green, Dwightmare FA.

Lakers: 12mm in lux tax space for 6 guaranteed contracts. Caruso, Schroeder, Matthews, Drummond, THT, maybe Trez, Morris bro are FAs.

Bucks: 11mm over lux tax and 8 guaranteed contracts. PJ Tucker, Bryn Forbes, Jeff Teague all FAs.

Blazers: 20mm in lux tax space, but just 7 guaranteed contracts. Norman Powell, Kanter, Collins, Melo are FAs.

There are 8 teams with 20mm+ in cap space. No other teams have any practical cap space.

Thanks for the info. Good stuff.

I thought GSW would make sense given how we scratched their back with Criss. But apparently they really 'value' Wiggins and aren't looking to deal any of their picks (especially 7) unless it's for an all star or near all star win now type players per the Lowe Post.

We will see.

Enzo The Baker said:

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Thanks for the info. Good stuff.

I thought GSW would make sense given how we scratched their back with Criss. But apparently they really 'value' Wiggins and aren't looking to deal any of their picks (especially 7) unless it's for an all star or near all star win now type players per the Lowe Post.

We will see.

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GSW's cap is pretty interesting. They have 13 players under contract, but 4 are unguaranteed.
9 under contract/guaranteed:

C: Wiseman/Looney
PF: Green/Paschall
SF: Wiggins/Toscano-Anderson
SG: Klay/Poole
PG: Curry

Total salary: 159.4mm

Two picks:
#7: 5.5mm
#14: 3.6mm

= 168.5 for 11 contracts.

+.7mm for dead cap on Shaun Livingston

=169.2mm

Lux Tax Threshold = 136mm

So with the draft picks, that's 33.2mm over the luxury tax. Plus need one more roster spot, so add a million.

34mm over luxury tax spot.


That's 138mm in taxes once you add in the 12th roster spot and the two draft picks.



Trade away Wiggins+#7 and you are at 133mm, or 6 million in space before luxury tax. That move saves Golden State's owners a total of $175.1 million. That's a lot of cash.

Just to make it interesting:

Warriors trade:
Wiggins to Spurs
Pick #7 to Toronto

Warriors receive:
Trade Exception of 32mm; saves $175mm in salary+tax

Toronto Trades:
Pick #4 to Spurs

Toronto receives:
Derrick White
Pick #7 from Warriors

San Antonio Trades:
Derrick White to Toronto

San Antonio receives:
Andrew Wiggins
Pick #4 from Toronto

Spurs draft Jalen Suggs

Spurs cap:
Wiggins: 31.6mm
#4 pick 7.8mm
#12 pick 3.9
Murray 15.4
Poetl: 8.8
Lonnie 4.4
Vassell 4.3
Luka 2.9
Keldon 2.1
Eubanks 1.7
Tre Jones 1.5


11 players, 84.4mm, plus 1 empty roster charge of .9 plus 1.2 for Demarre Carroll.

86.5mm from 112.4 cap.

Leaves 25.9 to bid on a free agent. The max for John Collins starts at 28mm. We could get there by making Toronto take on Luka Samanic in the trade. Or if the warriors demand #12 back and we keep Luka, we have enough money to offer Collins the max at 28mm.

C Poetle/Eubanks
PF Collins/Keldon
SF: Wiggins/Vassell
SG: Murray/Lonnie
PG: Suggs/Tre Jones

Bryn declined his option. Any takers?

Enzo The Baker said:

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Bryn declined his option. Any takers?

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If we strike out everywhere else, maybe. Nice to have a shooter. I think Dallas or Philly may take him. Both need the shooting.

He'd be a great fit with the 6ers. They have the defense to mask his deficiencies.