*****2022-2023 San Antonio Spurs Thread*****

140,994 Views | 1856 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by West Texan
Guitarsoup
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West Texan said:

Guitarsoup said:

AggieEP said:

At some point if you are Boston though you cannot do that, 50 million for Tatum and 50 million for Brown ties up 100 million in essentially the same position and really limits how you build a team around those guys. They are close to winning right now because they can afford to have Horford, Smart, White, Williams and Brogdon complimenting Tatum and Brown.

If I were them, I'd be exploring how to ship Brown to Portland. Maybe a 3 team trade that sees Brown go to Portland in exchange for Shaedon Sharpe + bad contract to make the numbers work, the #3 pick plus a future first is a deal that Portland could make. Then (to make it Spurs related) Boston ships the number 3 pick + Sharpe + a bad contract to San Antonio in exchange for Keldon and either the Chicago or Toronto future pick.

So:

Portland gets Jaylen Brown to pair with Dame and try to win now and gives up Sharpe , the 2023 #3 pick + 1 future first. A lineup of Dame, Brown, Grant and Jurkic should make them more competitive on paper and satisfies their need to put a star with Dame.

Boston ends up with Keldon and future 1st from Portland plus a future 1st from either Toronto/Chicago. Keldon replaces much of what Brown already gives and is on a value contract for the next 4 years of the Celtics championship window. The Celtics also have would get two additional 1st's in this scenario to continue to upgrade around Tatum. The Celtics don't necessarily get market value for Brown, but they get some flexibility to replace his production and do not tie up 40-50 million per year with him.

Spurs end up with the number 3 pick and Shaedon Sharpe in exchange for Keldon + either the Chicago or Toronto pick. It's a small sample size, but at the end of the year when Sharpe got starter minutes, he averaged 23/6/4 on decent shooting. Now your future lineup can be

Starters:
Amen Thompson (19)
Devin Vassell (22)
Jeremy Sochan (20)
Victor Wembanyama (19)
Zach Collins (25)

Bench:
Shaedon Sharpe (20)
Malaki Branham (20)
Doug McDermott (31)
Bad contract guy

That's obviously a team that is going to lose a lot of games next year being that young, but it's the purest version of finding out what you really have and letting the young guys explore how to develop their games. Perhaps, fill out the team with a couple more veterans that can help mold the young guys into winners and the future looks really bright for that core.

I like the framework for sure, but I think Portland values Sharpe a lot and they need to send out more salary to bring in Brown. Nurkic almost certainly has to be traded, which is fine b/c Portland is way down on him.

How about expanding this way:



Portland gets:
#33 pick from the Spurs
Jaylen Brown from Celtics
Bassey from Spurs

Boston gets (I think they need more here, throw in some seconds?)
Two First Round Picks
Keldon Johnson
Nurkic

Spurs get:
Rob Williams from Boston
Little from Portland
Sharpe from Portland
#6 from Orlando
#11 from Orlando

Orlando gets
#3 from Portland

We bring in Orlando because we don't want Alabama players implicated in major crimes, assuming Scoot goes #2.

At 6 we can pick up Black or Ausar or Hendricks and at 11 we can get Walker or Wallace.

Or maybe we trade 11 to Utah for #16 and #28 and pick up Bilal Coulibaly and Andre Jackson Jr or James Nnaji.

I sure wouldn't be upset to end up with Wemby at 1, Black at 6, Bilal at 16 and Nnaji at 28 with those moves.

Still have some money to go get someone like Bruce Brown

Collins/Rob Williams/Nnaji
Wemby/Doug
Sochan/Bilal/Little
Vassell/Sharpe/Branham
Black/Brown/Wesley


Fultz, Suggs, Cole Anthony, and Scoot is a lot of young PGs for Orlando.
My scenario is we take Scoot at 3 and if Brandon Miller is there and Scoot goes to Charlotte, we trade 3 to Orlando for 6 and 11.

Wendell Carter
Paolo Banchero
Brandon Miller
Franz Wagner
Anthony/Fultz
West Texan
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Guitarsoup said:

West Texan said:

Guitarsoup said:

AggieEP said:

At some point if you are Boston though you cannot do that, 50 million for Tatum and 50 million for Brown ties up 100 million in essentially the same position and really limits how you build a team around those guys. They are close to winning right now because they can afford to have Horford, Smart, White, Williams and Brogdon complimenting Tatum and Brown.

If I were them, I'd be exploring how to ship Brown to Portland. Maybe a 3 team trade that sees Brown go to Portland in exchange for Shaedon Sharpe + bad contract to make the numbers work, the #3 pick plus a future first is a deal that Portland could make. Then (to make it Spurs related) Boston ships the number 3 pick + Sharpe + a bad contract to San Antonio in exchange for Keldon and either the Chicago or Toronto future pick.

So:

Portland gets Jaylen Brown to pair with Dame and try to win now and gives up Sharpe , the 2023 #3 pick + 1 future first. A lineup of Dame, Brown, Grant and Jurkic should make them more competitive on paper and satisfies their need to put a star with Dame.

Boston ends up with Keldon and future 1st from Portland plus a future 1st from either Toronto/Chicago. Keldon replaces much of what Brown already gives and is on a value contract for the next 4 years of the Celtics championship window. The Celtics also have would get two additional 1st's in this scenario to continue to upgrade around Tatum. The Celtics don't necessarily get market value for Brown, but they get some flexibility to replace his production and do not tie up 40-50 million per year with him.

Spurs end up with the number 3 pick and Shaedon Sharpe in exchange for Keldon + either the Chicago or Toronto pick. It's a small sample size, but at the end of the year when Sharpe got starter minutes, he averaged 23/6/4 on decent shooting. Now your future lineup can be

Starters:
Amen Thompson (19)
Devin Vassell (22)
Jeremy Sochan (20)
Victor Wembanyama (19)
Zach Collins (25)

Bench:
Shaedon Sharpe (20)
Malaki Branham (20)
Doug McDermott (31)
Bad contract guy

That's obviously a team that is going to lose a lot of games next year being that young, but it's the purest version of finding out what you really have and letting the young guys explore how to develop their games. Perhaps, fill out the team with a couple more veterans that can help mold the young guys into winners and the future looks really bright for that core.

I like the framework for sure, but I think Portland values Sharpe a lot and they need to send out more salary to bring in Brown. Nurkic almost certainly has to be traded, which is fine b/c Portland is way down on him.

How about expanding this way:



Portland gets:
#33 pick from the Spurs
Jaylen Brown from Celtics
Bassey from Spurs

Boston gets (I think they need more here, throw in some seconds?)
Two First Round Picks
Keldon Johnson
Nurkic

Spurs get:
Rob Williams from Boston
Little from Portland
Sharpe from Portland
#6 from Orlando
#11 from Orlando

Orlando gets
#3 from Portland

We bring in Orlando because we don't want Alabama players implicated in major crimes, assuming Scoot goes #2.

At 6 we can pick up Black or Ausar or Hendricks and at 11 we can get Walker or Wallace.

Or maybe we trade 11 to Utah for #16 and #28 and pick up Bilal Coulibaly and Andre Jackson Jr or James Nnaji.

I sure wouldn't be upset to end up with Wemby at 1, Black at 6, Bilal at 16 and Nnaji at 28 with those moves.

Still have some money to go get someone like Bruce Brown

Collins/Rob Williams/Nnaji
Wemby/Doug
Sochan/Bilal/Little
Vassell/Sharpe/Branham
Black/Brown/Wesley


Fultz, Suggs, Cole Anthony, and Scoot is a lot of young PGs for Orlando.
My scenario is we take Scoot at 3 and if Brandon Miller is there and Scoot goes to Charlotte, we trade 3 to Orlando for 6 and 11.

Wendell Carter
Paolo Banchero
Brandon Miller
Franz Wagner
Anthony/Fultz


Ah, I misread. That makes a lot more sense for Orlando.

As far as trading up for a PG, I'm not so sure I don't like Cason Wallace better than Black. He's smaller at 6'3", but has a 6'9" wingspan. He's also a very good defender and I think has the frame and length to be able to switch and guard up like Black is able to. Offensively I believe in his jumper much more and he averaged more assists and less turnovers than Black.
Guitarsoup
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West Texan said:

Guitarsoup said:

West Texan said:

Guitarsoup said:

AggieEP said:

At some point if you are Boston though you cannot do that, 50 million for Tatum and 50 million for Brown ties up 100 million in essentially the same position and really limits how you build a team around those guys. They are close to winning right now because they can afford to have Horford, Smart, White, Williams and Brogdon complimenting Tatum and Brown.

If I were them, I'd be exploring how to ship Brown to Portland. Maybe a 3 team trade that sees Brown go to Portland in exchange for Shaedon Sharpe + bad contract to make the numbers work, the #3 pick plus a future first is a deal that Portland could make. Then (to make it Spurs related) Boston ships the number 3 pick + Sharpe + a bad contract to San Antonio in exchange for Keldon and either the Chicago or Toronto future pick.

So:

Portland gets Jaylen Brown to pair with Dame and try to win now and gives up Sharpe , the 2023 #3 pick + 1 future first. A lineup of Dame, Brown, Grant and Jurkic should make them more competitive on paper and satisfies their need to put a star with Dame.

Boston ends up with Keldon and future 1st from Portland plus a future 1st from either Toronto/Chicago. Keldon replaces much of what Brown already gives and is on a value contract for the next 4 years of the Celtics championship window. The Celtics also have would get two additional 1st's in this scenario to continue to upgrade around Tatum. The Celtics don't necessarily get market value for Brown, but they get some flexibility to replace his production and do not tie up 40-50 million per year with him.

Spurs end up with the number 3 pick and Shaedon Sharpe in exchange for Keldon + either the Chicago or Toronto pick. It's a small sample size, but at the end of the year when Sharpe got starter minutes, he averaged 23/6/4 on decent shooting. Now your future lineup can be

Starters:
Amen Thompson (19)
Devin Vassell (22)
Jeremy Sochan (20)
Victor Wembanyama (19)
Zach Collins (25)

Bench:
Shaedon Sharpe (20)
Malaki Branham (20)
Doug McDermott (31)
Bad contract guy

That's obviously a team that is going to lose a lot of games next year being that young, but it's the purest version of finding out what you really have and letting the young guys explore how to develop their games. Perhaps, fill out the team with a couple more veterans that can help mold the young guys into winners and the future looks really bright for that core.

I like the framework for sure, but I think Portland values Sharpe a lot and they need to send out more salary to bring in Brown. Nurkic almost certainly has to be traded, which is fine b/c Portland is way down on him.

How about expanding this way:



Portland gets:
#33 pick from the Spurs
Jaylen Brown from Celtics
Bassey from Spurs

Boston gets (I think they need more here, throw in some seconds?)
Two First Round Picks
Keldon Johnson
Nurkic

Spurs get:
Rob Williams from Boston
Little from Portland
Sharpe from Portland
#6 from Orlando
#11 from Orlando

Orlando gets
#3 from Portland

We bring in Orlando because we don't want Alabama players implicated in major crimes, assuming Scoot goes #2.

At 6 we can pick up Black or Ausar or Hendricks and at 11 we can get Walker or Wallace.

Or maybe we trade 11 to Utah for #16 and #28 and pick up Bilal Coulibaly and Andre Jackson Jr or James Nnaji.

I sure wouldn't be upset to end up with Wemby at 1, Black at 6, Bilal at 16 and Nnaji at 28 with those moves.

Still have some money to go get someone like Bruce Brown

Collins/Rob Williams/Nnaji
Wemby/Doug
Sochan/Bilal/Little
Vassell/Sharpe/Branham
Black/Brown/Wesley


Fultz, Suggs, Cole Anthony, and Scoot is a lot of young PGs for Orlando.
My scenario is we take Scoot at 3 and if Brandon Miller is there and Scoot goes to Charlotte, we trade 3 to Orlando for 6 and 11.

Wendell Carter
Paolo Banchero
Brandon Miller
Franz Wagner
Anthony/Fultz


Ah, I misread. That makes a lot more sense for Orlando.

As far as trading up for a PG, I'm not so sure I don't like Cason Wallace better than Black. He's smaller at 6'3", but has a 6'9" wingspan. He's also a very good defender and I think has the frame and length to be able to switch and guard up like Black is able to. Offensively I believe in his jumper much more and he averaged more assists and less turnovers than Black.
I think that is totally reasonable and think that Wallace will be more effectively offensively than Black, but with Black's height, there is the expectation that he can guard more positions.

However, Wallace has an inch longer wingspan and his standing reach is just 1" less.

I could also see a scenario play out where we draft Taylor Hendricks at 6 and Wallace at 11, if we think Wallace falls past both Washington and Utah. That would be freaking amazing, and I think Hendricks will be better than keldon.
Guitarsoup
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20% goes to Pop for being his upstream recruiter.
West Texan
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Guitarsoup said:




20% goes to Pop for being his upstream recruiter.


Monty will be really good for the young pistons.
superunknown
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AggieEP
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I just hope the Spurs are in conversations here with some of these scenarios because I think there will be assets to be had. The Blazers and Mavs both have motivation to upgrade their rosters fast and the Spurs could be a useful 3rd wheel to any deal because we can throw in future draft compensation and help make salaries work.

Even the Rockets at 4 if the player they want isn't there have reasons to try and get more established players around their core.

After all the build up, I'll be disappointed if the Spurs just sit tight and do nothing on draft day.
Guitarsoup
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Interesting stat I heard:

On pull up threes, Wemby was ~20%.

On catch and shoot threes, Wemby was 42%.

Yeah, we're gonna need you to go ahead and wait to shoot threes when assisted.
Ag Natural
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Guitarsoup said:

Interesting stat I heard:

On pull up threes, Wemby was ~20%.

On catch and shoot threes, Wemby was 42%.

Yeah, we're gonna need you to go ahead and wait to shoot threes when assisted.
I've been watching his playoff games going on right now and he seems to be pretty smart with shot selection. He's only attempting a few a game and really only when he's got a really good look. I have to imagine that during the regular season he was doing a little more experimentation.
Guitarsoup
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Ag Natural said:

Guitarsoup said:

Interesting stat I heard:

On pull up threes, Wemby was ~20%.

On catch and shoot threes, Wemby was 42%.

Yeah, we're gonna need you to go ahead and wait to shoot threes when assisted.
I've been watching his playoff games going on right now and he seems to be pretty smart with shot selection. He's only attempting a few a game and really only when he's got a really good look. I have to imagine that during the regular season he was doing a little more experimentation.
And he is the primary creator. It seems he is a very high IQ guy. His mom being a professional basketball player and coach certainly doesn't hurt, but he (and his parents) have been surrounding himself with the right people by all accounts.

I am not really worried about a 17yo taking too many step back or pull up threes, but the fact that he is making >40% shows his actual shot is great and I think with time and experience that will improve even more.
FTAG 2000
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Guitarsoup said:

Interesting stat I heard:

On pull up threes, Wemby was ~20%.

On catch and shoot threes, Wemby was 42%.

Yeah, we're gonna need you to go ahead and wait to shoot threes when assisted.
I've watched some tape on him.

Can definitely see the pull up threes being a low percentage. So many of them he is trying to shake a guy - crossover, stepbacks, shake and bake. Usually results in him rushing the shot or taking something with a hand in his face.

When his team moves the ball and gets open for a catch and shoot, that stroke is silky smooth.
Enzo The Baker
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Per hoopshype

Quote:

Spurs a "dark horse" team for Austin Reaves? Jovan Buha: I think the Lakers are going to retain him. Obviously, their preference would be to sign him to the four-year, $54 million deal. I've heard that there are going to be multiple suitors out there in talking with people around the league. You mentioned Orlando and Houston. I've heard San Antonio could be a dark horse team that will try to poach Austin from the Lakers.
Guitarsoup
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I don't think so at all. He's not a great defender, not really a point or primary playmaker and the Lakers will match anyways
Enzo The Baker
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Even if it's just to put the Lakers in cap hell, I'm good with it.
Sher Thing
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I don't see that either. I actually don't think the Spurs should hand out more than a 2 year deal this off-season to a free agent. Especially with the CBA changes coming up. If they are interested in signing someone like Lopez I would still only offer something like 2/$30mm. While the next year or two isn't necessarily pivotal, the Spurs need to maintain flexibility moving forward with eyes at making a big free agency push around 2025 IMO. Spurs still also have to extend Vassell.

Tre Jones is interesting if we are in a position to need him back but a 2/$30mm deal might be beneficial to both parties rather than giving him some sort of 4/$40mm deal and tying up more money long-term.

Someone on ST recommended the Spurs reach out to OKC about Vasilije Micic. I had forgotten about him but I think that would be a solid addition as he's probably the best player in Europe right now and might entertain the move over considering the minutes available at PG and the addition of Wemby.

Enzo The Baker
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I agree with the short term contract notion.

I do actually think Reaves would be a great fit with us. He can create his own shot, has a high iq, had great shooting splits last season and is tough. Probably not worth what we would have to offer for LAL not to match though.
Guitarsoup
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Enzo The Baker said:

I agree with the short term contract notion.

I do actually think Reaves would be a great fit with us. He can create his own shot, has a high iq, had great shooting splits last season and is tough. Probably not worth what we would have to offer for LAL not to match though.
If LA doesn't match, they have to hope they just hit gold with another undrafted FA or cut player. They are matching anything that any other team throws out there.

I think Reaves is portable to any team simply because he can shoot and make good decisions, but Spurs really need defensive players, and he ain't it.
Ag Natural
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Guitarsoup said:

Enzo The Baker said:

I agree with the short term contract notion.

I do actually think Reaves would be a great fit with us. He can create his own shot, has a high iq, had great shooting splits last season and is tough. Probably not worth what we would have to offer for LAL not to match though.
If LA doesn't match, they have to hope they just hit gold with another undrafted FA or cut player. They are matching anything that any other team throws out there.

I think Reaves is portable to any team simply because he can shoot and make good decisions, but Spurs really need defensive players, and he ain't it.
I was really impressed with Reaves. I'd be all for making an offer. But there is no chance that the Lakers don't match. Labron will threaten to retire.
Enzo The Baker
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Guitarsoup said:

Enzo The Baker said:

I agree with the short term contract notion.

I do actually think Reaves would be a great fit with us. He can create his own shot, has a high iq, had great shooting splits last season and is tough. Probably not worth what we would have to offer for LAL not to match though.
I think Reaves is portable to any team simply because he can shoot and make good decisions, but Spurs really need defensive players, and he ain't it.


I think Wemby is going to do wonders for our defense. He will let Devin be energized more on the defensive end and Sochan is a monster. I wouldn't be too concerned about that. Not like there are a lot of good defensive guards out there anyways.

I also don't think Reaves is a slouch on defense. He had the fourth best defensive rating in the playoffs at 108. The effort is there and he is smart enough to know how to play good team defense.
M.C. Swag
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Ya I like Reaves. Ham put him on Steph in Game 3 and I thought he acquitted himself well. He's not a stopper but he's a ton better than Keldon lol.
West Texan
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I like Reaves and think he's the type of guy we need to be targeting. He definitely upgrades our roster, adds shooting, some play making, he's a competitor that won't shy away from big moments, and he's only 25. As mentioned, he's not a defensive stopper, but he's not completely awful either. He shouldn't break the bank and adds value to our roster.
West Texan
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In non-Spurs news:

West Texan
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Enzo The Baker
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Guitarsoup
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Enzo The Baker said:




Until he signs his extension:

jteagle
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jteagle
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jteagle
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Who the Spurs might be trading back into the first round for:

Scoot Henderson (Very long shot)
Amen Thomson (Also long shot)
Cason Wallace (More realistic but still iffy)
Anthony Black (Same as Wallace)
Jalen Hood Schifino (Much more realistic)

Spurs second round picks from various mock drafts (if they keep them)

33rd
Andre Jackson Jr. SG UConn
James Nnaji C Barcelona
Brandin Podziemski PG Santa Clara
Colby Jones SF Xavier
Amari Bailey G UCLA

44th
Marcus Sasser PG Houston
Julian Strawther SF Gonzaga
Sidy Cissoko SG G League Ignite
Tristan Kukcevic C KK Partizan
Emoni Bates SF Eastern Michigan
Jordan Walsh SF Arkansas
Seth Lundy SG Penn St
Bobi Klintman F Wake Forest
Adama Sanogo PF UConn
Chris Livingston G/F Kentucky
Sher Thing
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Jordan Walsh is interesting in the second round. I like his game and he is a very high IQ player. Definitely needs work but I like him in the second round.
Guitarsoup
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Sher Thing said:

Jordan Walsh is interesting in the second round. I like his game and he is a very high IQ player. Definitely needs work but I like him in the second round.
Walsh, Sasser, Julian Phillips, Strawther, and Maxwell Lewis are all no brainers if they are there at 44.

Nanji, Andre Jackson, Sasser, and Kris Murray all work at 33.

I wouldn't be surprised if one or both get moved to move up into the 1st round, though.
FTAG 2000
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jteagle said:

Who the Spurs might be trading back into the first round for:

Scoot Henderson (Very long shot)
Amen Thomson (Also long shot)
Cason Wallace (More realistic but still iffy)
Anthony Black (Same as Wallace)
Jalen Hood Schifino (Much more realistic)

Spurs second round picks from various mock drafts (if they keep them)

33rd
Andre Jackson Jr. SG UConn
James Nnaji C Barcelona
Brandin Podziemski PG Santa Clara
Colby Jones SF Xavier
Amari Bailey G UCLA

44th
Marcus Sasser PG Houston
Julian Strawther SF Gonzaga
Sidy Cissoko SG G League Ignite
Tristan Kukcevic C KK Partizan
Emoni Bates SF Eastern Michigan
Jordan Walsh SF Arkansas
Seth Lundy SG Penn St
Bobi Klintman F Wake Forest
Adama Sanogo PF UConn
Chris Livingston G/F Kentucky


Wemby's wingman Bilal Coulibaly is who the Spurs will be trading up into the first to get. Book it.

Enzo The Baker
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That would be a little disappointing tbh. He had a good game yesterday but hasn't been that impressive in the games I've seen.

Edit: But according to SI, he has a promise in late lottery.
AggieEP
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If Victor and Bilal are close friends and the Spurs think he's a good influence on him, it might be worth it to trade up into the late teens for him, if for nothing else than to help provide a good and familiar environment for Wemby.

Of course this is only if none of the more ambitious trade options are workable. I'd much rather get Amen than Bilal.
M.C. Swag
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Bilal has been rocketing up draft boards. I've seen some analysts have him as the #2 SF in the draft behind only Brandon Miller.
Guitarsoup
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M.C. Swag said:

Bilal has been rocketing up draft boards. I've seen some analysts have him as the #2 SF in the draft behind only Brandon Miller.
I've seen him as high as 12th player taken, but definitely not above Hendricks and Whitmore.
 
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