tk for tu juan said:
Why didn't Obi-Wan just finish off legless, armless Anakin and save the galaxy a whole lot of trouble?
Terrible writing as well!
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Last: 3 mo ago by BadMoonRisin
Terrible writing as well!
It cracks me up people are freaking out over the writing over a show that is following a video game. Interesting
One other thing worth noting, whatever your position on take her/leave her, is that they didn't take her in the game and these events look to be setting up the next big conflict so it's a probably a misplaced expectation to think they'd approach it differently in the show.
LB12Diamond said:
It cracks me up people are freaking out over the writing over a show that is following a video game. Interesting
Come on, we've gone over this before. Just because the source material for a show/movie might be a video game, or comic book, or whatever doesn't mean bad writing can't be pointed out. I mean, heck I watch Reacher, which is about as cheesy as it gets. Everyone who watches that show knows its going to be cheesy, that's kinda part of the fun of it. But there are still well deserved complaints on that thread about really bad parts of the plot or script, even by the diehard Reacher fans.
Not really when apparently they are following the video game as closely as possible. Besides that it's a zombies show. And some are expecting critically acclaimed type of show.
I don't even think this is bad writing.
I'm just laughing at ones getting wrapped up into it bc of the reasons noted.
I don't even think this is bad writing.
I'm just laughing at ones getting wrapped up into it bc of the reasons noted.
Those criticizing the writing… go and read "The Road". This is what TLOU is, with some creative liberty taken here and there
This is not an original story by any stretch
Doesn't mean it's not ****ing awesome though
This is not an original story by any stretch
Doesn't mean it's not ****ing awesome though
Dina had a gun pointed at her temple from the very start and was immediately disarmed before she knew what was even happening. Then she was put to sleep. So she didn't fight as hard as Ellie? Who at least had the jump on them. And that's your issue?
Every point you've made has been debunked or countered and it feels like you're fighting really hard to hate this. If you don't like the conveniences in a zombie show based on a video game with an HBO budget that's understandable. But maybe adjust your expectations going forward.
Every point you've made has been debunked or countered and it feels like you're fighting really hard to hate this. If you don't like the conveniences in a zombie show based on a video game with an HBO budget that's understandable. But maybe adjust your expectations going forward.
Again, my primary issue is with the massive coincidence of Abby randomly running into Joel in the first place. They make a whole deal about the lengths they've taken to hunt him down, and then about how fortified the town is, only for the one guy Abby has spent five years searching for to be found miraculously outside the walls, within eye sight of Abby, at the exact same moment she just so happens to be on watch.
It's bad writing no matter how you slice it. For a video game, and especially for a prestige, award-winning HBO drama - even one based a video game - given the praise season one received and given the relative leeway they have in adapting the source material. To that end, they could have at least taken another episode for the plot mechanics to unspool in slightly different fashion, and not feel so incredibly sudden/forced.
My only issue with the Ellie side of things is that it's yet another convenient coincidence on top of an already massive coincidence. It's putting a hat on a hat, something you're literally taught in screenwriting 101 not to do.
I'm not "fighting hard to hate" anything. In fact, I was one of the few people here last week to express how much I loved the first episode this season. My gut reaction to the Joel/Abby coincidence this episode, however, was natural, rational, and shared by others on this board/online. I admit that I was nitpicking the hell out of the Abby/Ellie side of things, but mainly as a second convenience in the same episode, not necessarily in a vacuum. Also, people are pushing back on me just as much as I'm pushing back on them, and that kind of back-and-forth is simply what happens sometimes on a message board like this with a week between episodes.
It's bad writing no matter how you slice it. For a video game, and especially for a prestige, award-winning HBO drama - even one based a video game - given the praise season one received and given the relative leeway they have in adapting the source material. To that end, they could have at least taken another episode for the plot mechanics to unspool in slightly different fashion, and not feel so incredibly sudden/forced.
My only issue with the Ellie side of things is that it's yet another convenient coincidence on top of an already massive coincidence. It's putting a hat on a hat, something you're literally taught in screenwriting 101 not to do.
I'm not "fighting hard to hate" anything. In fact, I was one of the few people here last week to express how much I loved the first episode this season. My gut reaction to the Joel/Abby coincidence this episode, however, was natural, rational, and shared by others on this board/online. I admit that I was nitpicking the hell out of the Abby/Ellie side of things, but mainly as a second convenience in the same episode, not necessarily in a vacuum. Also, people are pushing back on me just as much as I'm pushing back on them, and that kind of back-and-forth is simply what happens sometimes on a message board like this with a week between episodes.
I don't often agree with this poster unless we're one of the few recognizing the greatness of an underrated show called "Dave" featuring a rapper with a small peen, but I must say TC's assessment of this one has been nails, especially coming from their non-gamer perspective.TCTTS said:Brian Earl Spilner said:
Makes sense. Also makes sense Joel would make no mention of Ellie, her immunity, or why he did what he did.
Again, as I explained earlier, it makes zero difference what Joel did or didn't tell them. I'm simply breaking down the situation logically...
- Who did Abby think her father was operating on? Why would any single operation require so many guards and so much firepower if not for someone/something incredibly important?
- Post-massacre, Abby spoke to the surviving nurses, seeing as they're the ones who described Joel's appearance to her. You're telling me the nurses didn't know who they were operating on and why? You're telling me that Abby didn't ask or care, if she somehow didn't already know?
- Never mind the fact that this girl was so important to Joel as well, that he basically committed genocide to save her.
After all of that, Abby & co weren't concerned with who this girl was? Because, IMO, there's no way the mystery/identity surrounding the girl wouldn't have been sky high.
Fast-forward to the lodge in last night's episode, and suddenly the situation is reversed. This random girl shows up out of nowhere to save Joel, clearly displaying a deep love/affection for him, and Abby & co don't even question whether she might be the girl who caused this entire situation in the first place? The girl who was the catalyst for all kinds of mystery, drama, and death five years prior?
It doesn't matter what the game did or didn't do. In conjunction with the aforementioned insanely ridiculous coincidence of Joel being the one guy Abby randomly ran into, basically in the middle of no where, outside the walls of the highly guarded town, I'm sorry, but by every measure it's all bad, unbelievably convenient writing.
The show is simply not good and this is coming from someone that had high hopes for it becoming one of the best top 10-15 series ever created.
Sigh.
I really don't understand the complaints on how a bunch of teenagers would/should have known all this detail.
The head fire fly lady from last year was pretty up front that this whole thing was a highly sensitive "need to know" operation.
Hell joel brought this "baggage" half way across the country and he didn't know the whole story. why would they tell a bunch of teenage kids?
No way those kids would have been important enough to have been let in on something that huge. At most they would have heard whispered rumors about it. Conspiracy theories as it were. And somebody like Abby(sp?) wouldn't have been interested in wild conspiracy theories. Only revenge.
The head fire fly lady from last year was pretty up front that this whole thing was a highly sensitive "need to know" operation.
Hell joel brought this "baggage" half way across the country and he didn't know the whole story. why would they tell a bunch of teenage kids?
No way those kids would have been important enough to have been let in on something that huge. At most they would have heard whispered rumors about it. Conspiracy theories as it were. And somebody like Abby(sp?) wouldn't have been interested in wild conspiracy theories. Only revenge.
Abby don't play.
Was it already mentioned that the director for this episode was also the director for the "Connor's Wedding" episode of Succession?
Ghost of Bisbee said:
Those criticizing the writing… go and read "The Road". This is what TLOU is, with some creative liberty taken here and there
This is not an original story by any stretch
Doesn't mean it's not ****ing awesome though
I've read The Road a while back. No one claimed this was an original story. I don't understand your point.
What is Dave Franco doing here?easttexasaggie04 said:
Abby don't play.
My wife is done watching after pascal died. Zombie shows are no fun if you know the main characters are going to make it all the way.
Go read about the coincidences around Archduke Ferdinand's assassination. Crazy coincidences happen all the time. Especially when most of humanity is all in the same place.
Ol Jock 99 said:She was 19 when the attack happened. And was off with her friends doing who knows what. The head Firefly lady was VERY "needs to know" on stuff...which makes sense given her background.Quote:
After everything I just laid out, I genuinely do not understand how anyone can come to this conclusion. At the very least they'd be highly curious, considering the series of events that brought them there.
You are caught up on "why didn't they waste Ellie"...well, why not Dina? Some age and gender, which is ABSOLUTE BEST CASE all they had to work with.
Simplest answer is the best: it has been 5 years since a teenager lost her dad in a horrific way. In those 5 years, she's had one goal---Kill Joel. Continuing her father's work isn't even part of the calculus.
Gotta disagree.
Sure maybe she was of doing whatever. And it's been 5 years. But she knows the guy who killed her dad because she must have talked to someone like the nurses. So it stands to reason that they also might have said "this lunatic came in and killed your dad to rescue this girl we were about to do surgery on that would have killed her too". So sure she is hunting Joel but she knows it was about a girl who might then seek revenge on them and they find Joel with a girl about that age and another one shows up too. So no she doesn't care about her dads work presumably she would have no ability to continue it anyway as she isn't a doctor apparently. But maybe just maybe kill the 2 girls that might be the reason Joel killed her dad and leave no survivors to rat you out to the town of 300 others that might then hunt you down and seek revenge on you for killing him.
Or conveniently leave them alive out of some honor code that would not exist in this world any more just so we can continue the show.
We made it two weeks guys. Congrats.
let's beat this dead horse some more....please
Joels dead horse?Diggity said:
let's beat this dead horse some more....please
Wes97 said:
I really don't understand the complaints on how a bunch of teenagers would/should have known all this detail.
The head fire fly lady from last year was pretty up front that this whole thing was a highly sensitive "need to know" operation.
Hell joel brought this "baggage" half way across the country and he didn't know the whole story. why would they tell a bunch of teenage kids?
No way those kids would have been important enough to have been let in on something that huge. At most they would have heard whispered rumors about it. Conspiracy theories as it were. And somebody like Abby(sp?) wouldn't have been interested in wild conspiracy theories. Only revenge.
Doesn't matter if they were let in on the importance of her - but this guy storming in and murdering 30 people to save one girl was something the nurses he left alive absolutely knew and there is no way that detail wasn't also passed along.
Abby: "What the hell happened to my dad?"
Nurses: "This psycho came in shot the place up killed 30 people and left."
Abby: "What the hell, why?"
Nurses: "Dunno but he took this girl we were about operate on."
Abby thoughts <Hmmmm... well I'm gonna kill this mfer if is the last thing I do and.... if he happens to be with this girl I'm gonna either find out why or kill her too....but I'm not gonna ignore two girls who happen to be with him and/or try to save him>
Abby thoughts 5 years later <sweet I stumbled upon the ONE guy I was looking for how convenient... time to kill him and make it hurt.... but there was this other thing about him... what was it??? oh well can't remember. and who is this girl who is so desperate to save him. shrug. let's roll.>
Hard to repopulate the planet if you are killing off women; that group probably has more than one code
Quad Dog said:
Go read about the coincidences around Archduke Ferdinand's assassination. Crazy coincidences happen all the time. Especially when most of humanity is all in the same place.
Next you're going to tell me that Jefferson and Adam's died on the same day. AND that day just so happened to be the 50th anniversary of the signing of the Declaration of Independence!
That's lazy writing and absolute fan service.
Agree to disagree then. But in ny experience most human beings that are filled with the desire for revenge are not that interested in understanding the motivations of someone that are going after to satisfy that revenge.
Hell anyone attempting/trying to understand the motivations of al Qaeda, for example, was called a terrorist sympathizer by a significant % of this country for a long time. Point being, people propelled largely by revenge seldom care about understanding their targets motivations all that much.
Hell anyone attempting/trying to understand the motivations of al Qaeda, for example, was called a terrorist sympathizer by a significant % of this country for a long time. Point being, people propelled largely by revenge seldom care about understanding their targets motivations all that much.
Yeah right. And Grizzly Adams had a beard.Swarely said:Quad Dog said:
Go read about the coincidences around Archduke Ferdinand's assassination. Crazy coincidences happen all the time. Especially when most of humanity is all in the same place.
Next you're going to tell me that Jefferson and Adam's died on the same day. AND that day just so happened to be the 50th anniversary of the signing of the Declaration of Independence!
That's lazy writing and absolute fan service.
Brian Earl Spilner said:Yeah right. And Grizzly Adams had a beard.Swarely said:Quad Dog said:
Go read about the coincidences around Archduke Ferdinand's assassination. Crazy coincidences happen all the time. Especially when most of humanity is all in the same place.
Next you're going to tell me that Jefferson and Adam's died on the same day. AND that day just so happened to be the 50th anniversary of the signing of the Declaration of Independence!
That's lazy writing and absolute fan service.
I really don't undersrand the coincidence issue some folks are having
No, Joel's horse is still alive...unlike Joel.jokershady said:Joels dead horse?Diggity said:
let's beat this dead horse some more....please
Now the story gets GOOD!
Speaking of horses. The only thing that bugged me in this last episode was them dragging him back like that instead of putting over one of the other horses. And they just let the two other horse go?
Why didn't the WLF people take the horses? Long walk in the winter back to Seattle.
Even better, Abby's group of five needs to get away from the area quickly before being caught. Let's not take the three available horses and slowly walk across the wide open hilly terrain
Edit: damn, typed too slow
Edit: damn, typed too slow
IVE MENTIONED THE HORSES TWICE!! 
The WLFers not taking them makes a LITTLE sense. They don't have food for them, and are trying to make a stealthy exit. Horses aren't stealthy.
Now, how Ellie and insert Asian dude's name could only find 2 of the 4….there is the mystery!!
The WLFers not taking them makes a LITTLE sense. They don't have food for them, and are trying to make a stealthy exit. Horses aren't stealthy.
Now, how Ellie and insert Asian dude's name could only find 2 of the 4….there is the mystery!!
tk for tu juan said:
Hard to repopulate the planet if you are killing off women; that group probably has more than one code
Having watched the episode knowing that Joel would die (bc of spoilers, not the video game), I did think it was really a great episode of television. The attack on Jackson Hole and Joel's downfall were super tense and it felt like a Game of Thrones episode in a good way.
My nitpick is that they shouldn't have shown Ellie getting pinned by a girl one episode after she broke free of a large guy's pin. The juxtaposition of those images was pretty silly IMO.
Not sure how Jackson Hole survived/will go on after that - are the zombie roots still there waiting to get them?? - but I'm assuming we will be moving on from Jackson Hole in the next episode or two to go on the Ellie revenge tour.
My nitpick is that they shouldn't have shown Ellie getting pinned by a girl one episode after she broke free of a large guy's pin. The juxtaposition of those images was pretty silly IMO.
Not sure how Jackson Hole survived/will go on after that - are the zombie roots still there waiting to get them?? - but I'm assuming we will be moving on from Jackson Hole in the next episode or two to go on the Ellie revenge tour.
Agree with your review.
As far as the zombie roots. The primary reason that took place is bc the roots senses the city and all the people there. Which directed the heard of zombies to the city and they quit chasing Joel. That was their only reason. The survivors will burn them or whatever now.
As far as the zombie roots. The primary reason that took place is bc the roots senses the city and all the people there. Which directed the heard of zombies to the city and they quit chasing Joel. That was their only reason. The survivors will burn them or whatever now.
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