Quote:

---

But that is something any competent man hellbent on survival could learn real fast on the job if his family's lives depended on it

---

This is spoken like someone that's never had to do it...

Teslag said:

---

Quote:

---

But that is something any competent man hellbent on survival could learn real fast on the job if his family's lives depended on it

---

This is spoken like someone that's never had to do it...

---

Almost 0% of the population has ever had to do any of those things. But they are very easy things to do...you can teach the lowest skilled migrants in the world to do every one of those things.

I think you are vastly underestimating the difficulty of farming. Especially when you won't have Youtube and the internet to provide any information.



Very easy it is not.

LMCane said:

---

this was basically the Netflix movie with Julia Roberts that came out a few weeks ago..

and if there is ever an EMP set off over Chicago, the USA will rapidly collapse.

---

The JR movie had a lot of inconsistency if it were an EMP(s). See the army of brand new Tesla's crashing themselves after zero day.

I would have expected an EMP to have fried then on the lot.

Teslag said:

---

I think you are vastly underestimating the difficulty of farming. Especially when you won't have Youtube and the internet to provide any information.



Very easy it is not.

---

especially when you have no one delivering all your parts and implements and actual crops to you and you have to do it all yourself!

it was hard enough to do that in 1847 when people had spent their entire lives on farms.

flakrat said:

---

LMCane said:

---

this was basically the Netflix movie with Julia Roberts that came out a few weeks ago..

and if there is ever an EMP set off over Chicago, the USA will rapidly collapse.

---

The JR movie had a lot of inconsistency if it were an EMP(s). See the army of brand new Tesla's crashing themselves after zero day.

I would have expected an EMP to have fried then on the lot.

---

You are correct sir!!

that movie was a hodge podge of insanity but the overall point was true-

the USA would rapidly collapse if society began to fray..

as opposed to other more united societies such as Korea, Taiwan, Israel, Japan, Poland, Hungary

C@LAg said:

---

YouBet said:

---

As part of our preparation for this, we moved out of the big city a few months ago. About 7 hours away from Dallas, actually.

---

congrats on the new double-wide outside of Corpus.

---

Thanks. We love the open floor plan!

just bought a copy due to the recommendations

BG Knocc Out said:

---

Teslag said:

---

Quote:

---

But that is something any competent man hellbent on survival could learn real fast on the job if his family's lives depended on it

---

This is spoken like someone that's never had to do it...

---

Almost 0% of the population has ever had to do any of those things. But they are very easy things to do...you can teach the lowest skilled migrants in the world to do every one of those things.

---

Yes but I think the problem is that people themselves have grown up in a society where everything comes easy and life is immensely comfortable compared to times prior to the 20th century. In other words, they may have the ability to learn survival skills, but the tenacity and fortitude to continually apply them in the midst of dire events they've never remotely contended with isn't something they can learn. They will either do it, or just freak out under the pressure.
I don't think anyone knows how they truly would handle the situation until they are in it. I think if they are in a good place with their faith and trust in God, that is a great start.

Just look how people freak out when their internet goes down or they can't get a cellular signal.

In 1906, Alfred Henry Lewis stated, "There are only nine meals between mankind and anarchy." Since then, his observation has been echoed by people as disparate as Robert Heinlein and Leon Trotsky.

The key here is that, unlike all other commodities, food is the one essential that cannot be postponed.

That's 3 days. If a major disruption occurred that's how quickly the wheels will come flying off.

If you're in a suburban area, you will nearly zero hope if transporting ceases to exist. And in a remote location there are other issued, the majority being lack of emergency health care due to injury and/or clean water.

The 1 second after series is great, and a 4th novel was released thus last summer "5 years later"

Having grown up in a family where my grandparent turned nearly their entire backyard into a garden to save money, I can also attest, it ain't easy. Lots of time was spent nurturing that thing....and then the harvest and storage.

I can't even begin to tell you the number of beans I snapped and peas I shelled in my life.

And dear god, there is almost nothing better than a fresh, red, ripe tomato out of a garden.

Teslag said:

---

I think you are vastly underestimating the difficulty of farming. Especially when you won't have Youtube and the internet to provide any information.



Very easy it is not.

---

I am not talking about running the man's farm solo. I was responding to a post about pitching in by operating some of the equipment etc. I feel like I could learn how to do some of this stuff under the man's guidance and instruction. And he doesn't have a huge farm. It's a mini-one...more like a garden on steroids. Still requires a lot of work though.

CDUB98 said:

---

Having grown up in a family where my grandparent turned nearly their entire backyard into a garden to save money, I can also attest, it ain't easy. Lots of time was spent nurturing that thing....and then the harvest and storage.

I can't even begin to tell you the number of beans I snapped and peas I shelled in my life.

And dear god, their is almost nothing better than a fresh, red, ripe tomato out of a garden.

---

Sounds like my grandfather. Had an amazing 3/4 acre size farm in his big backyard. Along with a small vineyard. He grew up a poor farm boy so it was easy for him.

Your "small vineyard" line reminded me. There was a small grape vine that grew on their back fence. Nobody knew where it came from. It was completely wild. But, damn, the family picked those grapes and made a crapton of jelly out of them.

LMCane said:

---

flakrat said:

---

LMCane said:

---

this was basically the Netflix movie with Julia Roberts that came out a few weeks ago..

and if there is ever an EMP set off over Chicago, the USA will rapidly collapse.

---

The JR movie had a lot of inconsistency if it were an EMP(s). See the army of brand new Tesla's crashing themselves after zero day.

I would have expected an EMP to have fried then on the lot.

---

You are correct sir!!

that movie was a hodge podge of insanity but the overall point was true-

the USA would rapidly collapse if society began to fray..

as opposed to other more united societies such as Korea, Taiwan, Israel, Japan, Poland, Hungary

---

Going to Taiwan, the first thing I noticed on the train ride from the airport to Taipei was that nearly every yard has their own green, lush garden. Many people were in their yards tending to their small garden as the train went by.

What I saw on the train ride was reinforced throughout our stay by the freshness of the vegetables. They actually burst with flavor, as opposed to the mass produced crap we get from south of the border and corporate farms.

jrdaustin said:

---

LMCane said:

---

flakrat said:

---

LMCane said:

---

this was basically the Netflix movie with Julia Roberts that came out a few weeks ago..

and if there is ever an EMP set off over Chicago, the USA will rapidly collapse.

---

The JR movie had a lot of inconsistency if it were an EMP(s). See the army of brand new Tesla's crashing themselves after zero day.

I would have expected an EMP to have fried then on the lot.

---

You are correct sir!!

that movie was a hodge podge of insanity but the overall point was true-

the USA would rapidly collapse if society began to fray..

as opposed to other more united societies such as Korea, Taiwan, Israel, Japan, Poland, Hungary

---

Going to Taiwan, the first thing I noticed on the train ride from the airport to Taipei was that nearly every yard has their own green, lush garden. Many people were in their yards tending to their small garden as the train went by.

What I saw on the train ride was reinforced throughout our stay by the freshness of the vegetables. They actually burst with flavor, as opposed to the mass produced crap we get from south of the border and corporate farms.

---

One thing my doc keeps harping on me is to take vitamins. The quality of our produce is less "rich" than in prior generations.

https://www.bbc.com/future/bespoke/follow-the-food/why-modern-food-lost-its-nutrients/#:~:text=A%202004%20US%20study%20found,middle%20of%20the%2020th%20Century.

38% less than mid century and the study was done in 2004. Vitamin D is also a big issue.

My beautiful former fiancee has enough vitamin D, choking levels of plentiful. No issues for her.

Quote:

---

corporate farms.

---

Ahhh, the mythical, evil, "corporate farms"

CDUB98 said:

---

Having grown up in a family where my grandparent turned nearly their entire backyard into a garden to save money,

---

Having done large gardens...you don't really save money. It's all about freshness and flavor.

Teslag said:

---

I think you are vastly underestimating the difficulty of farming. Especially when you won't have Youtube and the internet to provide any information.



Very easy it is not.

---

Let's imagine that you have the skills already. You have equipment or hand tools necessary to grow a garden. You have land, water, seeds, fertilizer, weed control. You are in a secure area, hidden away from looters, and you have guns and ammo laid up.

You are 100% prepared to grow a survival garden.

The Chinese pop an EMP on Thanksgiving Day.

Now what?

It's 90-150 days until you can plant anything, and another 60 days until the crop matures.

CanyonAg77 said:

---

CDUB98 said:

---

Having grown up in a family where my grandparent turned nearly their entire backyard into a garden to save money,

---

Having done large gardens...you don't really save money. It's all about freshness and flavor.

---

I know you're a farmer by trade, but I'm wondering what you'd be spending large amounts of money on.

Seeds and storage items were the only input costs. Everything else was labor from the family. They didn't buy fertilizer. They composted organic waste. It really was quite the efficient little operation when all of us family pitched in. Sadly, it died off as more of my uncles moved off out of Amarillo and the free labor was gone.

Seed, plants, fertilizer, weed killer, drip irrigation, tillage.

Can you lower the cost by starting your own tomatoes, for example? Sure. And use pure line varieties, not hybrids, and save the seed. If you have labor (as your grandparents did) then don't spend money on weed killers and automatic drip. Get out there with a hose and a hoe.

Even after that, you have to consider the value of labor. If your uncles were putting in 20 hours a week on a garden, for $50 worth of produce, would it had been better if they got part time jobs for 3-4x as much money?

By free labor, I mean us grandkids and the uncles before they had kids.

Yes, there is an argument to be made about value of labor from a pure business standpoint, but you'll just have to trust me that the cost to feed all these people through the garden was less than if they had to buy all these groceries all the time.

Grandma was a SAHM too, so when the kids weren't around, she spent a couple of hours a day tending to the garden.

CanyonAg77 said:

---

Quote:

---

corporate farms.

---

Ahhh, the mythical, evil, "corporate farms"

---

Not at all. They're a necessity. But I'll put up my tomatoes, cucumbers, peppers, etc. against their produce any day of the week.

It helps that that windmill I talked about produces the most god-awful tasting & smelling sulfur water.

But the plants sure love it....

jrdaustin said:

---

CanyonAg77 said:

---

Quote:

---

corporate farms.

---

Ahhh, the mythical, evil, "corporate farms"

---

Not at all. They're a necessity. But I'll put up my tomatoes, cucumbers, peppers, etc. against their produce any day of the week.

---

Again, the vast majority of your food comes from family farms, not mythical corporate farms.

And I'm not about to argue against home grown produce. Farms have to grow crops that are determinate (ready to be harvested all at the same time), mechanical harvest ready, can tolerate shipping, and many are picked before fully ripe.

Home gardens get to choose varieties based on taste and personal preference.

I mean depends on the EMP I guess but let's say you got half the country including one coast. You're probably going to lose at least 30 million people? That's kind of inconvenient.

So we're in agreement then. As I said, I have nothing against corporate farms, or cantaloupes & such that come from Central America. Taiwan has the luxury of getting most all their produce from locally grown private gardens.

We in the US don't have that luxury. We also have a ton more people. It's just the reality.

Only going to take 30 days and all the fatties gonna drop that can't refill their diabeetus prescription. Prescriptions not being refilled will hammer the storyline.

Ever had sex with skinny bipolar ladies, it's magnificent.

If you are in an urban are (say any city larger than San Marcos) and you wake up one morning and the lights do not work, your cell phone is dead, and your car won't start - - you have about 24hrs to get out of the city. After three days, it will be Medieval.

Estimates range from 70 to 90% will die in and EMP/MCE event before any level of normal can return.

FInd a job that lets you work remote. Buy a few acres at least 60miles outside of any urban area. Stock up on the "4Bs" (beans, bullets, band aids, bullion - food, guns, first aid/Rx, and gold/silver). Drill a water well and run it off of solar or wind. Raise some chickens and sheep/goats. Learn to garden.

I've done all of this and a little more.

Quote:

---

Prescriptions not being refilled will hammer the storyline.

---

Would be chaos.

A bunch of zombies going into withdrawal from SSRI / SNRIs and other psychotropics.

You'd have people trying to survive doing the best they can and then eventually be dealing with people out of their minds from drug discontinuation.

Would be a problem that got progressively worse as people run out of medication.

There will be phases of die-off.

Phase 1: First day - airplanes falling from the sky, those on life support or in surgery in a hospital, car crashes
Phase 2: First week - deaths from looting
Phase 3: First month - those requiring regular, lifesaving medical (dialysis) and those who cannot get medical treatment (all the hospitals will be closed - the people that work there will not be coming to work and no Rx being refilled)
Phase 4: First 6 months - starvation, dysentery, violence over food

If you can survive the first 6 months, you will have a chance.

Apache said:

---

Quote:

---

An EMP today would be inconvenient.

But in 50 years, we'd go back to the stone age .

---

Read "One Second After".

An EMP or severe Mass Coronal Ejection from the sun could do some pretty catastrophic damage to a large region. Let's hope it isn't here in the US.

---

Just finished this book last night. Terrifying.

Yeah finished this book a few months ago.