eric76 said:

---

DeschutesAg said:

---

Xi holds enormous leverage on Iran. That means the coming Trump visit to China might be massive in determining what happens next in the Iran war.

Xi knows Trump is in a self-inflicted Kobyashi Maru box with this Iran war. There is a substantial probability Trump may ask Xi to help get him out of this mess. If Trump does that, the question then becomes "What will Trump be willing to trade or give to Xi in return?"

---

Xi is in the driver's seat, now. He has Trump to thank for it.

---

This morning, President Trump was complaining about the Kurds because he said that weapons were given to them for the purpose of arming Iranian patriots. Trump said the Kurds kept the weapons. Perhaps they would rather use them against the Turks.

Quote:

---

"make them hurt multiples more than they make us hurt" lens, and doesn't account for capacity to hurt.

---

Well said. I hope we get the uranium and the strait open but I'm afraid that was the thinking for this war.

aggiehawg said:

---

DeschutesAg said:

---

Xi holds enormous leverage on Iran. That means the coming Trump visit to China might be massive in determining what happens next in the Iran war.

Xi knows Trump is in a self-inflicted Kobyashi Maru box with this Iran war. There is a substantial probability Trump may ask Xi to help get him out of this mess. If Trump does that, the question then becomes "What will Trump be willing to trade or give to Xi in return?"

---

LOL. Only if Trump has a personality transplant. He's not known for approaching any meeting with hat in hand.

---

Either people are simply uneducated, extremely biased or totally delusioned on Trump to arrive at Trump is begging Iran and China for a way to end this "war" and that Trump had no strategy or plan or ability to course correct.

The man who went from being charged by every Blue court in the nation and STILL managed to survive an assassins bullet to achieve the most improbable of a non-contiguous 2nd term.

Yet, here we are.

Yea, no.

If one puts on their TDS shade of spectacles, they can arrive of those impossibly bad takes.

Epstein files all released proving Trump correct that there was no there there.

Russians calling Trump saying they now want to be rational, as long as the Great Z plays along this time. Trumps inability to get Ukraine solved in 48 hours was based on irrational behavior of the other parties.

Can you explain how folks not acting rationally or logically is Trumps fault?

You can paint all the stripes you want on Trump and I can come along and very reasonably paint them back over. Who's right? History will decide but I like my chances.

You do you.

flown-the-coop said:

---

Yea, no.

If one puts on their TDS shade of spectacles, they can arrive of those impossibly bad takes.

Epstein files all released proving Trump correct that there was no there there.

Russians calling Trump saying they now want to be rational, as long as the Great Z plays along this time. Trumps inability to get Ukraine solved in 48 hours was based on irrational behavior of the other parties.

Can you explain how folks not acting rationally or logically is Trumps fault?

You can paint all the stripes you want on Trump and I can come along and very reasonably paint them back over. Who's right? History will decide but I like my chances.

You do you.

---

Brother, I have the last thing possible to TDS. Having Dc Draino, Libs of Tiktok and others parading folders that say "EPSTEIN FILES" on them at the white house, and then refusing to release them and claiming a set-up is a fumble of such gigantic proportions it's obvious, even for a supporter of the Trump presidency.

What was logical about expecting Russia or Ukraine to end a year long war on multiple fronts within 2 days of Trump being sworn in? Why should we expect people with a history of acting Irrational to suddenly act rational?

So binders make Trump incompetent in dealing with Iran?

Fantastic logic there.

In the interim Trump is doing what is needed with Iran and Ukraine, as he is also doing so in Cuba, VZ and will be doing with China.

I am a Trump supporter. As such, I will defend Trump and call out his enemies. I do believe 100% Trump is acting in Americas best interests as he sees him which aligns very well with how I see them.

Horse**** comments about empty binders from 18 months ago, any continued infatuation with Epstein for that matter, is not in Americas best interests.

Blabbering about "he said 48 hours and missed the deadline" is more nonsense by enemies of Trump.

And saying Trump is stepping on his dick (and Americas) by having no plan, no strategy in Iran, Iran holds are the cards, he is going to have to beg Iran and China for a peace deal… all talking points of the enemies of Trump, enemies of America.

I support Trump because he is doing the right things, the hard things. And he deserves the support of Americans, not the constant crying and moaning day in and day out because you just don't like the guy.

flown-the-coop said:

---

So binders make Trump incompetent in dealing with Iran?

Fantastic logic there.

In the interim Trump is doing what is needed with Iran and Ukraine, as he is also doing so in Cuba, VZ and will be doing with China.

I am a Trump supporter. As such, I will defend Trump and call out his enemies. I do believe 100% Trump is acting in Americas best interests as he sees him which aligns very well with how I see them.

Horse**** comments about empty binders from 18 months ago, any continued infatuation with Epstein for that matter, is not in Americas best interests.

Blabbering about "he said 48 hours and missed the deadline" is more nonsense by enemies of Trump.

And saying Trump is stepping on his dick (and Americas) by having no plan, no strategy in Iran, Iran holds are the cards, he is going to have to beg Iran and China for a peace deal… all talking points of the enemies of Trump, enemies of America.

I support Trump because he is doing the right things, the hard things. And he deserves the support of Americans, not the constant crying and moaning day in and day out because you just don't like the guy.

---

You're trying too hard to defend the guy, but seems like you're dug in, so I'll let you have the 'w'.

aggiehawg said:

---

DeschutesAg said:

---

Xi holds enormous leverage on Iran. That means the coming Trump visit to China might be massive in determining what happens next in the Iran war.

Xi knows Trump is in a self-inflicted Kobyashi Maru box with this Iran war. There is a substantial probability Trump may ask Xi to help get him out of this mess. If Trump does that, the question then becomes "What will Trump be willing to trade or give to Xi in return?"

---

LOL. Only if Trump has a personality transplant. He's not known for approaching any meeting with hat in hand.

---

You might be right about Trump.

But Xi is the other ruler in this meeting between the world's two superpowers. Xi has shown time and time again he is firm, experienced, knowledgeable, intelligent, patient, disciplined, and methodical. Rulers like Xi insist on a pre-set format and require the bulk of negotiations take place ahead of time between underlings.

What leverage does the war between the USA and Iran have over Xi and China? The only leverage that comes to mind is Xi and China *might* not want a war to occur in the ME that destroys the O&G infrastructure there.

Weakkneed lack of action Trump is meeting with his war council at the White House now. Word is they have Macron on the Teams call to discuss the best way for the US to capitulate.

WH press briefing coming up this hour so the questions will be entertaining, but with the discussions ongoing I would expect nothing major, but who knows. Trump sort of let the meeting slip out whilst taking questions after doing more to lower drug prices.

Looks like the Blue Sky and Reddit story lines will shift from Trump was led into Iran by the septum ring BiBi has him by to Trump can only get out of this with the Great Xi bailing him out.

It takes a special kind of derangement against Trump to arrive at those conclusions.

FWTXAg said:

---

Watching Trump die-hards (fewer and fewer of them every day) get ratio'd on an overwhelmingly friendly forum for team Trump shows us plain as day that the worm has turned.

Shrink the government, no new wars, gut spending, gut regulations. Time for the real America party to get started. Let's ride.

---

Possibly people are just getting tired of responding to the same. Terrible takes over and over again...
Many people have TDS. We get it. People with the brain who supported Trump before still support him. Most people who have some sense of history and have been in this world long enough to know what Iran stands for and the mess that they make in the world fully support actions against Iran. The Iran issue was not of Trump's making.

Very well said.

Pooh-ah95_ESL said:

---

FWTXAg said:

---

Watching Trump die-hards (fewer and fewer of them every day) get ratio'd on an overwhelmingly friendly forum for team Trump shows us plain as day that the worm has turned.

Shrink the government, no new wars, gut spending, gut regulations. Time for the real America party to get started. Let's ride.

---

Possibly people are just getting tired of responding to the same. Terrible takes over and over again...
Many people have TDS. We get it. People with the brain who supported Trump before still support him. Most people who have some sense of history and have been in this world long enough to know what Iran stands for and the mess that they make in the world fully support actions against Iran. The Iran issue was not of Trump's making.

---

Possibly, but no.

Vox Clamantis said:

---

flown-the-coop said:

---

aggiehawg said:

---

DeschutesAg said:

---

Xi holds enormous leverage on Iran. That means the coming Trump visit to China might be massive in determining what happens next in the Iran war.

Xi knows Trump is in a self-inflicted Kobyashi Maru box with this Iran war. There is a substantial probability Trump may ask Xi to help get him out of this mess. If Trump does that, the question then becomes "What will Trump be willing to trade or give to Xi in return?"

---

LOL. Only if Trump has a personality transplant. He's not known for approaching any meeting with hat in hand.

---

Either people are simply uneducated, extremely biased or totally delusioned on Trump to arrive at Trump is begging Iran and China for a way to end this "war" and that Trump had no strategy or plan or ability to course correct.

The man who went from being charged by every Blue court in the nation and STILL managed to survive an assassins bullet to achieve the most improbable of a non-contiguous 2nd term.

Yet, here we are.

---

Meh. he's human. Too many times we tend to ascribe any sort of misstep or fumble as some sort of esoteric wheels within wheels 54D underwater backgammon like strategy.

He absolutely fumbled the Epstein files thing, his proclamations about ending the Ukraine-Russia War were dramatically not met, and he's on his 11th iteration of "we will completely destroy Iran if they don't open the strait". I think he realizes that the strait of Hormuz is something Iran can still keep closed even if there's not 1 stone left on top of each other in Tehran, because its so easy to keep closed. Throw a few drones that don't even hit, and the risk profile will stop ships from trying to cross, so he's hoping he can octuple down on his threats and they'll bite this time.

---

I genuinely wonder if Trump is compromised and not in complete control. No, I do not think it is Epstein stuff...but if there IS dirt on you...Mossad (and other intel agencies) probably have it.

eric76 said:

---

DeschutesAg said:

---

Xi holds enormous leverage on Iran. That means the coming Trump visit to China might be massive in determining what happens next in the Iran war.

Xi knows Trump is in a self-inflicted Kobyashi Maru box with this Iran war. There is a substantial probability Trump may ask Xi to help get him out of this mess. If Trump does that, the question then becomes "What will Trump be willing to trade or give to Xi in return?"

---

Xi is in the driver's seat, now. He has Trump to thank for it.

---

It's amusing how some of you all of a sudden started caring about China and Xi using the U.S. for leverage after years of silence on it when the narrative wasn't convenient.

Quote:

---

I genuinely wonder if Trump is compromised and not in complete control.

---

Seems like quite a stretch. He's the least compromised President we've had in a long time. In fact, what people complain about so much is that he does things his way even when his own advisors tell him not to.

Quote:

---

Seems like quite a stretch. He's the least compromised President we've had in a long time. In fact, what people complain about so much is that he does things his way even when his own advisors tell him not to.

---

Wouldn't that be a benchmark of him being compromised by foreign powers? Disregarding cabinet and domestic expert advice and doing his own (or his benefactors) bidding?

The mental gymnastics some of our f16 TDS'ers go through to "get Trump" is pure comedy!

Trump has been compromised by foreign assets and they have used this leverage to injure themselves and piss themselves off.

Makes a lot of sense.

Rockdoc said:

---

The mental gymnastics some of our f16 TDS'ers go through to "get Trump" is pure comedy!

---

its pretty sad they are actively rooting against their own country.

Iced-T14 said:

---

Quote:

---

Seems like quite a stretch. He's the least compromised President we've had in a long time. In fact, what people complain about so much is that he does things his way even when his own advisors tell him not to.

---

Wouldn't that be a benchmark of him being compromised by foreign powers? Disregarding cabinet and domestic expert advice and doing his own (or his benefactors) bidding?

---

Seems like quite the conspiracy that Trump alone is compromised and no one else connected with him in his leadership and he's acting completely on his own. That's "Secret Russian agent for Putin" level paranoia.

He's not compromised lol

He was bought, just like every single President and Congressman in history.
Sometimes they have domestic buyers, sometimes foreign. But they're all bought.

Last time I checked, people don't hand out a quarter of a billion dollars for nothing.

Gigem314 said:

---

Iced-T14 said:

---

Quote:

---

Seems like quite a stretch. He's the least compromised President we've had in a long time. In fact, what people complain about so much is that he does things his way even when his own advisors tell him not to.

---

Wouldn't that be a benchmark of him being compromised by foreign powers? Disregarding cabinet and domestic expert advice and doing his own (or his benefactors) bidding?

---

Seems like quite the conspiracy that Trump alone is compromised and no one else connected with him in his leadership and he's acting completely on his own. That's "Secret Russian agent for Putin" level paranoia.

---

Same line of logic that because he's unorthodox he surely isn't compromised

I think fellow right wingers need to be comfortable with actual Conservatism being larger than Trump itself. Trump is a vehicle not an end.

The ideas that all politicians have sold their soul, and that Trump is one of the best Presidents we've ever had are not mutually exclusive.

FWTXAg said:

---

He's not compromised lol

He was bought, just like every single President and Congressman in history.
Sometimes they have domestic buyers, sometimes foreign. But they're all bought.

Last time I checked, people don't hand out a quarter of a billion dollars for nothing.

---

A multi billionaire is using a position that puts him literally in the line of fire so he can graft off people using his office for bribery and corruption?

When he could use his name, celebrity and the fact he was already a former potus to graft off those same people?

Yea, still not making a bit of sense.

Iced-T14 said:

---

Gigem314 said:

---

Iced-T14 said:

---

Quote:

---

Seems like quite a stretch. He's the least compromised President we've had in a long time. In fact, what people complain about so much is that he does things his way even when his own advisors tell him not to.

---

Wouldn't that be a benchmark of him being compromised by foreign powers? Disregarding cabinet and domestic expert advice and doing his own (or his benefactors) bidding?

---

Seems like quite the conspiracy that Trump alone is compromised and no one else connected with him in his leadership and he's acting completely on his own. That's "Secret Russian agent for Putin" level paranoia.

---

Same line of logic that because he's unorthodox he surely isn't compromised

---

Just because you want him to be and need him to fail doesn't make it so...or make any sense. Keep reaching for the tin foil hat though.

Vox Clamantis said:

---

I think fellow right wingers need to be comfortable with actual Conservatism being larger than Trump itself. Trump is a vehicle not an end.

The ideas that all politicians have sold their soul, and that Trump is one of the best Presidents we've ever had are not mutually exclusive.

---

America is not majority "conservative" as such, our politicians will not reflect conservatism in the majority, assuming we are doing things right.

What you need to worry about is how a minority of socialist have captured a party that used to represent a "majority" of voters.

FWTXAg said:

---

He was bought, just like every single President and Congressman in history.

---

Someone bought him to do what, exactly? Raise gas prices? Piss off other countries with America-focused trade policies?

Politics by nature lends itself to people trying to buy influence from leaders. I just find it hilarious that some people all of a sudden care A LOT about it under a President who has been the least likely to play that game because he does things more his way and he doesn't need the golden parachute. So it was acceptable in the past. But now it's so bad that they HAVE to speak out about it. Right.

flown-the-coop said:

---

FWTXAg said:

---

He's not compromised lol

He was bought, just like every single President and Congressman in history.
Sometimes they have domestic buyers, sometimes foreign. But they're all bought.

Last time I checked, people don't hand out a quarter of a billion dollars for nothing.

---

A multi billionaire is using a position that puts him literally in the line of fire so he can graft off people using his office for bribery and corruption?

When he could use his name, celebrity and the fact he was already a former potus to graft off those same people?

Yea, still not making a bit of sense.

---

Lmao

He wasn't a "multi billionaire" before all of this. He was a reality TV star/genius (a very successful one, and still is I will add). This notoriety and position as President has made him and his family 10x more money than they ever had through both publicity as well as corrupt good ole boy deals. Just like every other President ever, only more so. He's not the President out of the goodness of his heart lol

flown-the-coop said:

---

Vox Clamantis said:

---

I think fellow right wingers need to be comfortable with actual Conservatism being larger than Trump itself. Trump is a vehicle not an end.

The ideas that all politicians have sold their soul, and that Trump is one of the best Presidents we've ever had are not mutually exclusive.

---

America is not majority "conservative" as such, our politicians will not reflect conservatism in the majority, assuming we are doing things right.

What you need to worry about is how a minority of socialist have captured a party that used to represent a "majority" of voters.

---

You should read Naseem Taleb's "least tolerant minority". Great article about how a very small minority can exert hugely disproportionate amounts of power and influence merely by being inflexible.

Gigem314 said:

---

Iced-T14 said:

---

Gigem314 said:

---

Iced-T14 said:

---

Quote:

---

Seems like quite a stretch. He's the least compromised President we've had in a long time. In fact, what people complain about so much is that he does things his way even when his own advisors tell him not to.

---

Wouldn't that be a benchmark of him being compromised by foreign powers? Disregarding cabinet and domestic expert advice and doing his own (or his benefactors) bidding?

---

Seems like quite the conspiracy that Trump alone is compromised and no one else connected with him in his leadership and he's acting completely on his own. That's "Secret Russian agent for Putin" level paranoia.

---

Same line of logic that because he's unorthodox he surely isn't compromised

---

Just because you want him to be and need him to fail doesn't make it so...or make any sense. Keep reaching for the tin foil hat though.

---

Don't need him to fail and am actively rooting for him and America to succeed. However, I'm not afraid to call a spade a spade and decry him for terrible leadership and not following through on campaign promises. Here's to hoping for a better second half of his presidency

Iced-T14 said:

---

Gigem314 said:

---

Iced-T14 said:

---

Gigem314 said:

---

Iced-T14 said:

---

Quote:

---

Seems like quite a stretch. He's the least compromised President we've had in a long time. In fact, what people complain about so much is that he does things his way even when his own advisors tell him not to.

---

Wouldn't that be a benchmark of him being compromised by foreign powers? Disregarding cabinet and domestic expert advice and doing his own (or his benefactors) bidding?

---

Seems like quite the conspiracy that Trump alone is compromised and no one else connected with him in his leadership and he's acting completely on his own. That's "Secret Russian agent for Putin" level paranoia.

---

Same line of logic that because he's unorthodox he surely isn't compromised

---

Just because you want him to be and need him to fail doesn't make it so...or make any sense. Keep reaching for the tin foil hat though.

---

Don't need him to fail and am actively rooting for him and America to succeed. However, I'm not afraid to call a spade a spade and decry him for terrible leadership and not following through on campaign promises. Here's to hoping for a better second half of his presidency

---

Says the person who, without any compelling shred of evidence, says he's compromised and any other conclusion isn't valid because you have all the answers. Doesn't seem genuine to me. You are going to consider him a failure no matter what he does.