The art of the...deal?Farmer_J said:
This will blow over. Deals often have at least one "walk-away." Trump strengthened his hand. Zelensky weakened his hand. That's where we needed to be.
Trump-Vance-Zelenskyy
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Last: 5 mo ago by ts5641
I give Teslag a bit of understanding here as he did combat directly against Russia in Syria. I can not imagine. And I never fault the individual soldier/marine/sailor/airman for being deployed into sht situations.Heineken-Ashi said:Why are the war proponents the ones sounding the most emotional?Old RV Ag said:Send me your address and I'll send you a one way first class ticket to your motherland Russia so you can live with your hero.usmcbrooks said:mallen said:
Zelensky is a hero, Trump and Vance are imbeciles.
You and the 95 who starred this nonsense, send me your addresses. I'll purchase y'all one way airfare so you can go live with your hero.
But once again...... another war/conflict that we should have never gotten involved with.
Our boys here in America mean more to me than cannon fodder for endless non-defensive wars that line up nicely with military industrialists. And I don't want my money going to support hopeless situations in Ukraine either.
We need a cease fire NOW.
mallen said:
Zelensky is a hero, Trump and Vance are imbeciles.
What are the idiots who starred this basing this on? Insane.
As it should be. **** that goon.Birdwatcher said:
Vance and Trump were so rude and disrespectful to Zelenskyy, who was the only good, decent and honorable person among them. My respect for Zelensky increases for not sitting there and taking it. I hope Europe is able and willing to pick up the slack as America stabs Ukraine in the back. Trump and Vance are unhinged facists
And yet, like clockwork, the roaches crawl out and expose themselves to the light. When the deal is made and the US wins, they will act like they didn't get embarrassed, again, like every other time.Gigem314 said:The art of the...deal?Farmer_J said:
This will blow over. Deals often have at least one "walk-away." Trump strengthened his hand. Zelensky weakened his hand. That's where we needed to be.
JayM said:I agree. I'm not sure Trump has any diplomatic talent in his administration. And for now Rubio will toe the line or "You're Fired!"Birdwatcher said:
Vance and Trump were so rude and disrespectful to Zelenskyy, who was the only good, decent and honorable person among them. My respect for Zelensky increases for not sitting there and taking it. I hope Europe is able and willing to pick up the slack as America stabs Ukraine in the back. Trump and Vance are unhinged facists
Zelenskyy took that photo op down to the gutter.
Enough carrot. It's time for the stick. Trump wont be nice about it either.
Birdwatcher said:
Vance and Trump were so rude and disrespectful to Zelenskyy, who was the only good, decent and honorable person among them. My respect for Zelensky increases for not sitting there and taking it. I hope Europe is able and willing to pick up the slack as America stabs Ukraine in the back. Trump and Vance are unhinged facists
Go back to watching birds ...
Zelensky knows the American media hates Trump/Vance and adores him. He gambled that he could "take things public" and he lost bigly because he also should have known Trump or Vance don't give a **** what the media writes about them or this.
^ This is correct. Putin/Russian war propaganda has been far more successful at galvanizing broad support for the war and has caused Putin to become more entrenched in his hold on power there.DTP02 said:FIDO_Ags said:Quote:
Your concern is noted. I don't think you are cut out for big boy politics.
And neither are you Jbob. Despite what Trump says, for three years Ukraine has held off the Russians, yes somewhat with US aid, but not solely. They've used limited resources well while Russia has thrown enormous resources at Ukraine and barely holds a quarter of the country.
And JD Vance needs to stay in his lane regarding press gangs in Ukraine rounding up soldiers. How many drafts have the Russians had in three years? They had to borrow conscripts from North Korea too.
Who's saying Russia isn't forcing its fighting age men into the meatgrinder? The whole point in saying that is that Ukraine is running out of people willing to fight and that Ukraine needs a peace deal. Russia is the same but has more people to sacrifice and a more authoritarian govt willing to do so.
A lot of analysts think the political and internal pressure on Putin is much less with them on a war footing than it would be otherwise, so they have less incentive to stop until their goals are achieved.
Russia had problems with defections and refusals to serve early in the war that have largely dissipated.
The Ukrainian incursion into Russia itself and the Ukrainian strikes inside Russia also galvanized the people as well.
neither side really wins here, but the U.S. should not be the Bank for this damn thing, regardless of where you stand on the situation.
Heard on Clay & Buck the executive staff of the White House press office was getting to eat it instead. Sounds like their lunch plans got an unexpected upgrade!IndividualFreedom said:
I do not like the cameras being on. That was advantage to Zelensky. DJT and Vance had to kick the Ukraines out. It all bout respeck.
My favorite part was that they got kicked out before lunch was served. Like HR after they fire IT on a Friday have an immediate security escort, do not stop by the desk for the things.
There's no way to know the true thoughts of the Russian people.
Buh bye. 👋 pic.twitter.com/iz2zqa2TjQ
— Breaking911 (@Breaking911) February 28, 2025
Trump is no longer playing 4-D chess.4stringAg said:
Zelensky knows the American media hates Trump/Vance and adores him. He gambled that he could "take things public" and he lost bigly because he also should have known Trump or Vance don't give a **** what the media writes about them or this.
This is 5-D.
Lindsey Graham just said he doesn't know if he can continue to support Ukraine given what has occurred. Never thought I would see the day.
So Russia enters Ukraine and finishes the deal with tacit approval from Trump. And Europe realizes they have no ally in the US. That may satisfy your sugar cravings and good for you. We can do it on our own over here. We can declare we are of the same stature as Russia and China in moving the chess pieces along the global chess board.Sid Farkas said:JayM said:I agree. I'm not sure Trump has any diplomatic talent in his administration. And for now Rubio will toe the line or "You're Fired!"Birdwatcher said:
Vance and Trump were so rude and disrespectful to Zelenskyy, who was the only good, decent and honorable person among them. My respect for Zelensky increases for not sitting there and taking it. I hope Europe is able and willing to pick up the slack as America stabs Ukraine in the back. Trump and Vance are unhinged facists
Zelenskyy took that photo op down to the gutter.
Enough carrot. It's time for the stick. Trump wont be nice about it either.
Amen. People also show how little real world negotiation experience they have. Whether directly or even indirectly. Most people are clueless and only regurgitate whatever echo chamber there in is saying.
Especially when a big chunk our "aid" just disappeared. Wonder how much of it made it back into American politician's offshore accounts?NPH- said:
neither side really wins here, but the U.S. should not be the Bank for this damn thing, regardless of where you stand on the situation.
BREAKING: US State Department terminates U.S. support of Ukraine energy grid restoration after White House kicks out Zelensky
— unusual_whales (@unusual_whales) February 28, 2025
I bet europe butt puckered watching that.
.........and if you wanna hear God laugh, tell him your plans.
Time will tell. The U.S. killed over 2MM north Vietnamese and we know how that turned out.
10% to the big guyTailgate88 said:Especially when a big chunk our "aid" just disappeared. Wonder how much of it made it back into American politician's offshore accounts?NPH- said:
neither side really wins here, but the U.S. should not be the Bank for this damn thing, regardless of where you stand on the situation.
NEW: The White House is having press staffers eat President Zelensky's lunch after he was kicked out of the Oval Office, according to Fox News.
— Collin Rugg (@CollinRugg) February 28, 2025
"Zelensky, we're told, was begging to stay..."
"The lunch that they were supposed to have is sitting right outside the hallway, and… pic.twitter.com/5I8Lc8sKBi
Yes there is.Teslag said:
There's no way to know the true thoughts of the Russian people.
When they are family and friends and they are here visiting.
And yes - there is a large segment of the Russian population that opposes the war --- but they are a distinct minority.
F Ukraine and F zelenskyy. Go back home and leave the American people out of your fight with Russia.
Also... Give the tax payers their money back.
Also... Give the tax payers their money back.
Taxes are just a yearly subscription to the country you live in.
aggiedata said:BREAKING: US State Department terminates U.S. support of Ukraine energy grid restoration after White House kicks out Zelensky
— unusual_whales (@unusual_whales) February 28, 2025
FAFO
Trump knew Zelensky would behave as such. So he let the world see. Zelensky just wants tbe grift to continue to buy more mansions around the world while he gets to play dress up GI Joe
Ellis Wyatt said:I hope he's searching real estate brochures for where he's going to spend his exile now.Quote:
He's a hero because when the entire western world was making plans to give Ukraine to Russia and was negotiating his exile. He held his country together
Maybe. The last time the experts planned his exile he proceeded to whip Russia's a**. My guess is we have galvanized all of Ukraine and Europe against the United States and Russia and they are probably going to finish the job which is fine but we have given up soft power in Europe. Something we have dominated since the end of WWII.
A war that probably doesn't happen if JFK was not killed by the deep state and his VP.FIDO_Ags said:
Time will tell. The U.S. killed over 2MM north Vietnamese and we know how that turned out.
Yeah ... I said it.
TheEternalOptimist said:Zelensky can't win an election right now if he allowed one...... even with the pro-Russian east under occupation.TommyBrady said:
If only California, New York, and Massachusetts were allowed to vote in elections I wonder if the dems would win in a landslide?
Facts.
Well, I would hope so since the dictator of Ukraine outlawed all opposition parties. That would be kinda embarrassing if he did lose.
TheEternalOptimist said:Yes there is.Teslag said:
There's no way to know the true thoughts of the Russian people.
When they are family and friends and they are here visiting.
And yes - there is a large segment of the Russian population that opposes the war --- but they are a distinct minority.
You aren't the only one with family and friends from Russia
So, you are a Ruskie. horosho sidimTheEternalOptimist said:Yes there is.Teslag said:
There's no way to know the true thoughts of the Russian people.
When they are family and friends and they are here visiting.
And yes - there is a large segment of the Russian population that opposes the war --- but they are a distinct minority.
Birdwatcher said:
Vance and Trump were so rude and disrespectful to Zelenskyy, who was the only good, decent and honorable person among them. My respect for Zelensky increases for not sitting there and taking it. I hope Europe is able and willing to pick up the slack as America stabs Ukraine in the back. Trump and Vance are unhinged facists
NPH- said:
neither side really wins here, but the U.S. should not be the Bank for this damn thing, regardless of where you stand on the situation.
It's about more than that to me. A peace deal, even with the concessions, is the best thing for the Ukrainian people even if their leaders don't see it. I understand why they want to keep fighting, but I also think they're too close to it to be objective.
Without a peace deal they're going to continue to lose more and more people and ultimately more territory as well.
pressitup said:
I bet europe butt puckered watching that.
Again, I think that is probably Trump's objective.
Zelenskyy is playing poker with everyone else's money. To some extent, so is Russia now that they are using foreign troops. Regardless, Trump is not afraid to walk away from the table because he is tired of bankrolling Z and has little to lose. He isn't going to get the money back, but there is a chance he gets something back in the form of minerals.
Before he does, he is trying to let Europe know that it is time for them deuce or get off the pot because they do stand a chance of losing something. Again this is something Europe should be taking the lead on, not the US
4stringAg said:
Zelensky knows the American media hates Trump/Vance and adores him. He gambled that he could "take things public" and he lost bigly because he also should have known Trump or Vance don't give a **** what the media writes about them or this.
Whoever gave Zelensky advice to do what he did totally backfired. It was odd that it was in front of the cameras so it had to be a power play on the part of Zelensky thinking that we would back down due to public criticism. Well guess what?? We didn't and made things worse for him.
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