Madmarttigan said:

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I think Kingpin would equate to someone like the Mountain in GoT. Just absurdly strong but a normal person.

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It depends on the writer. Sometimes, he's like 7 feet tall and 500 pounds of muscle. Some writers make him more realistic. A typical strongman, but more brains than brawn.

Just watched the last episode.

Been avoiding this thread even though it pops up on my watchlist.

Best of the series offerings and it's not close.

As others have said, it took maybe the least of the Avengers and made you really excited about his possibilities. He never did anything when I read comics when I was younger but this was great.

I hope there is a touring company of "Rogers, The Musical" because I don't want to have to travel to NYC to catch a show. I would consider traveling to a Vegas residency. It's outstanding!

Wrapped up everything nicely. Would like to see Yelena and Kate have a team up, but Barton and her did well in the finale.

Did the owl eat those dudes?

Great episode. Yelena & Bishop needs to be a thing that happens.

On the topic of Yelena, I have some questions. Did the mom know she was Nat's sister? If so, does that imply mom and/or Kingpin are working with Lady Hydra? Are the Black Widow assassins even still a thing? Or did Clint just call her that for effect? He would have known about Nat's adventure in Russia

I missed why Kate's mom wanted Hawkeye killed.

Lola68 said:

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I missed why Kate's mom wanted Hawkeye killed.

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I didn't see that either except that he's a good guy and a threat to the underworld business, or maybe as Ronin he had taken out a bunch of Kingpin's goons so she was ordered to rub him out.

Or she was worried he would come back for the suit, the sword, the watch, etc.

I joked that it was the origin story of The Borrowers

I was a LITTLE let down on the depiction of Kingpin. Was very menacing in his early scenes but I thought his fight with Kate was a little cartoonish. Her using his (father's) cufflink was a nice touch, though.

Probably. How does one contract out to a BW assassin when there isn't a Red Room to dispatch them anymore? Did Yelena set up a false contact line so she can find ways to reach others and release them?

It does make Val even sketchier than she was before, if she's having her people do paid assassinations. I guess I thought she was some kind of quasi government entity but maybe not. If she's willing to kill an Avenger, there ain't no way she's anything but a villain.

I have to agree with others here - Hawkeye was the best D+ show from start to finish. I loved the Christmas setting, and the use of clas sic Christmas music especially in the last episode. Loved all the callbacks to the first Avengers movie, with familiar scenes like Clint diving off the building but shown from young Kate's perspective, and the plaque that Clint stares at commemorating what the Avengers did in NY.

In the last episode, Yelena's hair was a bit distracting to me. All I could see was attempting a Creature from the Black Lagoon look with that big pony tail thing she had. Then my wife, ever the realist, had to chime in with criticisms about how many shots to the head that Clint took during the fight with Yelena, to which I had to remind her that it's a show based on comic book characters.

Wandavision - was great for the first couple of episodes as they imitated old sitcoms. It was never a bad series, and ranks as my 2nd favorite.
F&WS - I really wanted to like this one more than I did. Two of the best supporting characters from earlier movies, introducing a new Captain America, and the best non-extraterrestrial villain in Zemo, but this one was just too up and down.
Loki - had its moments, but never really connected for me.
What If? - meh.

While watching the final episode I couldn't stop thinking about that article posted about how hard it was to hear dialog in today's media. My God, the contrast in volume between Kate and Clint is drastic. Kingpin, too. Time for these directors to tell the actors to speak up!

Lol

i really liked the season overall, but it's still #2 behind Loki for me.

if i had a nitpick, it's that the finale felt a little rushed and i think it's because they had so many story lines to try and wrap up. I think the easiest "cut" is to remove Kingpin and, instead, use him as a final reveal. maybe right after they burn the Ronin suit, Yelena texts Kate Bishop the "I know who your mom was working for.." and then the screen grab of Kingpin to tease him for another series?

as for Kingpin, do we think he's actually the same Kingpin as the Netflix universe or will the MCU versions of Kingpin and Daredevil be variants? i say that because i can't imagine their tone/tenor won't be dramatically different than what we've seen on Netflix.

I'm torn on which way this could go. On one hand hand it would be easy to just reboot with same actor. On the other hand Clint knows who he is and that he's a bad guy. Is that bc of SHIELD following the events of Daredevil? Or is it bc of his time as Ronin dealing in the underground?

redline248 said:

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I'm torn on which way this could go. On one hand hand it would be easy to just reboot with same actor. On the other hand Clint knows who he is and that he's a bad guy. Is that bc of SHIELD following the events of Daredevil? Or is it bc of his time as Ronin dealing in the underground?

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I think that the Kingpin has been around for a long time in either scenario. From what I remember in the comics, he was introduced as a behind the scenes controller of all things underworld until he ultimately revealed himself and got more hands on.

Quote:

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Wandavision - was great for the first couple of episodes as they imitated old sitcoms. It was never a bad series, and ranks as my 2nd favorite.
F&WS - I really wanted to like this one more than I did. Two of the best supporting characters from earlier movies, introducing a new Captain America, and the best non-extraterrestrial villain in Zemo, but this one was just too up and down.
Loki - had its moments, but never really connected for me.
What If? - meh.

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They just butchered it - likely because of the pandemic.

And the Karli character was just awful. Zero interest in her.

I think the worst thing about Karli is her accent. She has a few thought-provoking lines of dialogue but it's wasted because it either takes you an extra minute to decipher, and her voice just comes across as entitled and childish.

with his buddy being like "duuuuude, you were in New York, I didn't think you were in New York, that's so cool bro, with the pew pew and the big and the small and the aliens all over. That was some crazy times yo. Wait weren't you in jail bro, how'd you get out for this fight? Bro, I didn't even KNOW"

"uh no."