We get the 2nd worst pick out of okc, heat, rockets and nets

YNWA_AG said:

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We get the 2nd worst pick out of okc, heat, rockets and nets

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We can keep our own if we get 4 or lower.

AG@RICE said:

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YNWA_AG said:

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We get the 2nd worst pick out of okc, heat, rockets and nets

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We can keep our own if we get 4 or lower.

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Which probably isn't happening unless we legit tank right now from here on out and sit better players vs worse **** teams.

Aggie09Derek said:

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AG@RICE said:

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YNWA_AG said:

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We get the 2nd worst pick out of okc, heat, rockets and nets

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We can keep our own if we get 4 or lower.

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Which probably isn't happening unless we legit tank right now from here on out and sit better players vs worse **** teams.

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We arent that far off the losing pace. We have been "trying" to win all season and we only have 1 more win than the team in the 4th draft position.

Im not keen on racing Wood back after that injury, so playoffs might be impossible. If you trade Olidipo and Tucker, shut down Wall and Wood for several weeks then it shouldnt be hard to work our way into the bottom 4.

Playoff team when fully healthy.

Just sayin

HotardRat said:

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Playoff team when fully healthy.

Just sayin

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I believe so as well, but this crew just doesn't seem like it will play enough games at full health.

HotardRat said:

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Playoff team when fully healthy.

Just sayin

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Need to build for future. Getting to playoffs is pointless if just get drummed in first round.

It still makes no sense to tank this year because we aren't bad enough to be one of the worst 4 teams in order to get the best pick odds.

Agree. Unless just made it very very intentional and got lucky.

This team is hard to watch

Just frustrated that's all

Kid's got game.

Better to have it be an easy choice than to be the 6 seed and hold on to guys like Tucker & Oladipo to try and make a run and then get nothing for them after getting bounced early in the playoffs.

I wouldn't mind holding onto Wall to have some leadership, but we need to get what we can for Boogie, Oladipo & Tucker. IMO Stone will be able to find a trade for Gordon without having to give up picks (maybe a package with some of the others).

I'd like to see Porter jr. & Martin jr. get called up for some run with the big boys. If we're going to get pounded anyway I'd rather have the future of the franchise getting seasoning than to see EG and Boogie out there.

We could get a new pair of Jordans for Boogie. That's about it. Unfortunately, the dude is washed.

We are so bad without Wood in the lineup.

Thanks to no cable, missing tonight's game

Nice to see us show some fight in the 4th but it seems like it it time to trade anyone with value to kick off the rebuild.

HotardRat said:

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We could get a new pair of Jordans for Boogie. That's about it. Unfortunately, the dude is washed.

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Hes a shadow of what he was, but he's averaging 13 & 11 in 26 min as a starter and playing his was into shape - 37 min (19 & 8) tonight.

Even at whatever diminished % of his peak he is, bigs that can play don't grow on trees. Think of some of the spares that have gotten major PT at the 5 for playoff and even championship teams

If you don't think a few playoff teams would give up a second rounder or a project player for Boogie on a dirt cheap expiring deal you're crazy. I know, woo hoo second rounder...but I'd rather have a scratch off ticket & watch KJ Martin getting better out there.

Harry Dunne said:

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HotardRat said:

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We could get a new pair of Jordans for Boogie. That's about it. Unfortunately, the dude is washed.

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Hes a shadow of what he was, but he's averaging 13 & 11 in 26 min as a starter and playing his was into shape - 37 min (19 & 8) tonight.

Even at whatever diminished % of his peak he is, bigs that can play don't grow on trees. Think of some of the spares that have gotten major PT at the 5 for playoff and even championship teams

If you don't think a few playoff teams would give up a second rounder or a project player for Boogie on a dirt cheap expiring deal you're crazy. I know, woo hoo second rounder...but I'd rather have a scratch off ticket & watch KJ Martin getting better out there.

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Here is the only problem. Boogie signed with us because he wanted to play with John Wall. He was very vocal and outspoken about this intention and I don't think he wants to be traded. We could still trade him, but I don't think the 2nd rounder we get would be worth the negative press. We need to stay appealing as a potential FA location if we hope to turn the team around within a year or 2.

Also - Boogies poor defense might be the best tanking tool we have...

WES2006AG said:

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Nice to see us show some fight in the 4th but it seems like it it time to trade anyone with value to kick off the rebuild.

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I think building around Wood, and holding onto Kenyon, Kevin Porter, and maybe Tate is a good foundation for a something special in a couple years.

AG@RICE said:

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Also - Boogies poor defense might be the best tanking tool we have...

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Yeah, that's definitely what it looks like as Joel Embiid is blowing by him like he's a statue, but the advanced stats say he's playing some of the best defense (all relative, of course) of his career.

The problem is his offense. He was an incredibly explosive player that used to bully people inside, but the injuries have totally sapped him of that. I was reading a thing the other day where is he is currently the worst in the NBA within 5' of the basket. He is still rebounding very well and TBH I can't explain the good defensive rating but like the rebounding, he must be finding a way to get it done inside despite being near useless anywhere near the perimeter.

Believe it or not he's only 30. I don't know how much of his explosiveness will return, if any. Regardless, a big man that can rebound and hit the 3 (and play decent defense?!?!) still has value as long as he continues to figure out what he is and what he no longer is and starts being smarter with his shot selection.

Anyhow, if we continue on our current trajectory, I can't imagine we would get any bad press from trading a guy on a 1-year contract at the deadline while we are in the cellar. If he really wants to play with Wall (and we keep Wall), then he can sign a team-friendly 2-year deal and mentor Wood, who apparently he is close to.

Could you provide some of these advanced stats showing Boogie's great defense?

He leads the team in defensive win shares and defensive box plus/minus. Meanwhile he's in the negatives in the offensive versions of both. Which is not surprising considering how bad he's shot it inside.
Just go to basketball reference and sort it.

I'm sure some will say that those are "imperfect" stats, and I'm sure they are (like all stats are), but they are more reliable than the "eyeball test" that tells you Boogie is slow laterally and gets burned in space but doesn't tell the whole story.

To be clear I'm not trying to say he's a plus defender. I'm saying that he's not playing bad D by his standards but his previously dominant offense in the paint is what he's really struggling with.

Cousins is awful at everything besides shooting 3s and passing.

YNWA_AG said:

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Cousins is awful at everything besides shooting 3s and passing.

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He's only hitting 34% from three. 37% is league average. His rebounding is still pretty good.