I enjoyed the premiere, though I still don't remember (and couldn't tell from the flashbacks) what happened at the end of S3. This is a show that I watch because of the vibes. It looks cool and I like the actors/performances, so I will watch even if I don't know what's happening with the story.
Westworld Season 4
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Last: 3 yr ago by oragator
Thanks. I may still watch it, but not until all episodes are released. I really hate weekly episode releases for content that requires some sort of thinking to follow along. Watching an hour a week just doesn't keep it fresh in my brain enough to keep up. I'd much rather binge watch it in 2-3 nights in a row to better absorb everything.TCTTS said:javajaws said:I liked your original post better since it explains why I've pretty much given up on this series. There's "out there" and then there's Westworld...not sure its worth the time investment to re-watch all previous 3 seasons to try and begin to understand S4.TCTTS said:
I won't pull them all, but there are a number of shots of what looks to be a *functioning* Westworld as well. Or, at least, semi-functioning.
So, yeah, I have absolutely no idea what's going on, and I kind of love it...
Personally, I love causally trying to unravel the clues. That, and you don't need to understand/remember everything from the previous three seasons to appreciate what's going on this season. Just watch those recaps I posted a few days ago, and that should be enough.
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Ben Franklin
For those of you who aren't quite as up to speed on some of the key details of the past three seasons, I'll try and break down what I think are the most relevant aspects as they relate to what we're seeing now, in season four. And if I miss anything, please feel free to fill in any gaps or add any thoughts/context...
Anyway, I hope this helps. Again, let me know if I'm missing any major beats as they pertain to what we saw last night, or I happen to get any details wrong, as I did this mostly from memory, after having to look up a couple names.
- When Delos took over Westworld, it became their covert mission to gather data on all the park guests. As we discovered, at the same time as Bernard, the repeating host narratives/"loops" weren't for the hosts, they were for the guests, as a "control" from which to catalogue everything about everyone who ever visited the park. That data became *the* most valuable asset Delos owned, more so than the park or the product itself, for two reasons: 1) it was valuable in the same way that user data is valuable to Google, Facebook, etc, but more importantly, 2) the ultimate aim was to gather enough information about a select group of guests so as to copy their consciousness into hosts, making them de facto immortal (something for which those guests would presumably pay a fortune). This was all spurred by James Delos himself, suffering from terminal cancer and wanting to live forever. Finally, this guest data was stored in "The Forge," located in a remote, underground area at the edge of the park.
- At the end of season two, however, Dolores steals the guests data from The Forge and beams it to a Delos satellite. During this transfer, she *also* beams to the same satellite The Valley Beyond/The Sublime, a virtual world created by Ford, populated by hosts who chose to live there, freely away from humans (when those hosts voluntarily passed through "The Door" at the end of season two, their consciousness arrived in/was uploaded to The Valley Beyond/The Sublime on the other side).
- Dolores is then killed by who we think is Charlotte Hale. However, it turns out Dolores (aka "Dolores Prime" - the OG Delores) made a copy of herself before beaming the data, and put that copy of herself in a host body made to look identical to Charlotte Hale. That copy then killed the real Charlotte, "killed" Dolores Prime, and took Dolores Primes' pearl and left Westworld with it. Not only that, but she made/took three other copies of herself, in addition to Bernard's pearl, off-island, (all part of Dolores Prime's plan). A new host body is then printed for Dolores Prime on the mainland, in the house Ford left for them (Arnold's old house). So, at the end of season two, we have OG "Delores Prime" back in her Dolores body, and then the first copy of Dolores still in the Charlotte/host body (we eventually/simply start calling these two "Dolores" and "Halores" (Hale + Dolores), respectfully). Dolores, we learn, also printed a new body for Bernard. In the final scene of season two (one of my favorites of the entire series), Dolores then tells Barnard they are to be adversaries, and go their separate ways, but that Barnard still has a "role" to play, which is why she spares him/gives him second chance (also mercifully giving him the "choice" humanity never gave her).
- In season three, we are at first are led to believe that Dolores wants to end humanity, but eventually learn that her mission is to *free* humanity from the "loops" that the A.I. Rehoboam has set for them. She grows to have empathy for the human race, having been in the same position in the park. In turn, she finds a human - Caleb - whom she knows will be sympathetic to *her* cause, seeing as Caleb was used and discarded by Rehoboam in the same, traumatic fashion (something we and Caleb learn toward the end of the season).
- However, while Dolores is trying to take down Rehoboam, Serac, Rehoboam's creator, is attempting to hunt down Dolores (using/blackmailing Maeve), because he believes that the access key to the valuable Delos guest data + The Valley Beyond/The Sublime is stored in Dolores' mind. Ultimately, though, after capturing Dolores and attempting to extract the access key from her mind, we learn that she never had the key in the first place - she gave it to Bernard (hence the "role" he still had to play). Unfortunately, Dolores dies during the extraction attempt, but, with the aid of Caleb and Maeve, manages to destroy Rehoboam in the process, setting humanity free.
- The other big season three arc is Halores eventually turning on Dolores and becoming the new big bad. While playing the role of Charlotte in the real world (no one knows Charlotte is dead), Halores grows to love Charlotte's family as her own, and feels betrayed by Dolores when Dolores seemingly leaves her for dead. By season's end, think of Dolores and Halores as the yin/yang of Dolores Prime. Dolores eventually grows to feel empathy for humanity and sets out to free it, while Halores eventually grows to despise humanity (even more) and is now setting out to destroy it.
- In the final scene of season three, William's goal is to destroy everything he helped create - Delos, the hosts, etc - but when he confronts Halores at the Delos international headquarters in Dubai, she reveals that she's made a perfect host copy of William, and that host copy, essentially under Halores' control, then slits the real William's throat. As William bleeds from his neck, we see that Halores is planning to create hundreds, if not thousands of hosts, either under her control or to aid her in ending humanity.
- At the beginning of season four, which takes place seven years after the events of season three, we see that, in the opening Hoover Dam sequence, the evil host copy of William (under Halores' direction, no doubt), wants to buy the entire server/data center, which the Hoover Dam now powers, and is considered the most impenetrable/dependable server/data center on the planet (according to the cartel member who helps own/run it). Also, remember that to everyone else in the real world, the real William and the real Charlotte Hale are still running Delos. No one knows that it's secretly Halores and evil host William now. Regardless, Halores/evil host William have somehow come to the conclusion that the guest data that Dolores stole + The Valley Beyond/The Sublime was apparently beamed by Dolores from the Delos satellite to the hyper-secure Hoover Dam servers, at some point before Dolores' death at the end of season three. So Halores/evil host William take over the Hoover Dam facility, and they now have the data… but they still don't have the access key (the same access key that Serac was after). Which no one but Bernard and Stubbs knows is in Bernard's mind. So, my guess is, somehow, someway, Halores/evil host William are attempting to find that access key by any means necessary. Maybe that's part of what "Manhattan World" is for, maybe not.
- Further, at the end of season three, we see that Dolores not only gave Bernard the access key to The Valley Beyond/The Sublime, but also gave him a way to access it, via headset, which beams his consciousness to The Valley Beyond/The Sublime. So, in one of the last scenes of season three, sitting on the edge of a bed in a cheap motel room, with Stubbs worse for wear in the bathroom tub, we see Bernard access The Valley Beyond/The Sublime… then we see him come back from it, years later (seeing as the room/Bernard is now covered in a thick layer of dust/soot). Which leaves us to presume that Bernard's/Stubb's storyline in season four takes place in the same seven-years-later timeline, after Bernard comes back from the The Valley Beyond/The Sublime (but *maybe* even further in the future, even after the events of the rest of the show, which would be pretty wild, if true, though who knows what the filmmakers actually have planned in that regard).
- As for any other loose ends… Dolores Prime is 100% dead. That pearl is gone, that iteration of the character never to return. However, of the other four Delores pearls remaining, Halores is obviously one, Maeve presumably has another (after she sent Clementine and Hanaryo to cut off Musashi/Dolores' head), a third is still in host Lawrence's head (Clifton Collins Jr), who helped Bernard/Stubbs escape in the season three finale, and then the fourth is in Halores' possession - NOT the Dolores pearl that's in her head, but another, separate Dolores pearl. So "Christine" from episode one could very well be derived in some way from the Dolores pearl Halores has in her possession, we just don't know yet. And then finally, it appears as if the real Williams *isn't* actually dead, and is instead somehow being kept alive by Halores/evil host William, which we'll hopefully get clarification on next episode.
Anyway, I hope this helps. Again, let me know if I'm missing any major beats as they pertain to what we saw last night, or I happen to get any details wrong, as I did this mostly from memory, after having to look up a couple names.
Actually, scratch one thing from this post and another I had above it. Because the soot/dust that collected in the motel room where Bernard was when we last saw him, while he was in The Valley BeyondThe Sublime, likely collected over the seven years since we last saw him. I keep forgetting about the seven years thing. Granted, it could still be longer than that and, say, 20 years in the future, but seven years feels like enough time for the motel room to look like that. Though, how it went undisturbed for either seven or 20 years, I have no idea. Either way, in other words, Bernard and Stubbs may very well be, and probably are, in the same year/timeline as everyone else. That would make a lot more sense.
Just watched the premiere and I'm back in. Time to get back on the wild theory wagon.
Very helpful summary. Thanks for taking the time. I can't quick Westworld.
TCTTS
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I'm out. I'm done.
Love this show. Thanks for the recap!
Your loyal hosts are back online and the Westworld S4E1 pod is up! Join me & @jowrotethis seven years in the future, and @Danny_Heifetz, who is definitely in some sort of simulation. https://t.co/yEqKZuGQS0
— David Shoemaker (@DavidShoemaker) June 28, 2022
I can't decide if tctts is way smarter than me or has knowledge coming from places other than the 1st episode. (granted I never watched the trailer).
Ha, what is "smart" about any of this stuff I'm saying? I've merely recapped past events, and pointed out things in trailers via screenshots. Either way, I have zero inside info, and know nothing beyond the first episode of the season.
Lol, just the stuff you were saying about Delores writing scripts for hosts. Maybe that's in the trailers, idk. Or maybe it's obvious.
The guy who kept harassing her seemed extremely freaked out, basically convinced that she was somehow controlling his decision making process. Combine that with...
- Her telling the guy on the date that she programs the "background" characters of a video game...
- Her at work, sitting down to write a script that was at first identical to Delores' narrative/loop in Westworld...
- The three guys who pass her on her way to work, excited talking as if New York is a park, in the exact same way guests talked about Westworld...
... it just made sense to me that she's most likely (unbeknownst to her) writing scripts for either "background" hosts, or humans who are being controlled in the same way as hosts, and that she's living in some kind of park or simulation, whether real/tangible or virtual.
- Her telling the guy on the date that she programs the "background" characters of a video game...
- Her at work, sitting down to write a script that was at first identical to Delores' narrative/loop in Westworld...
- The three guys who pass her on her way to work, excited talking as if New York is a park, in the exact same way guests talked about Westworld...
... it just made sense to me that she's most likely (unbeknownst to her) writing scripts for either "background" hosts, or humans who are being controlled in the same way as hosts, and that she's living in some kind of park or simulation, whether real/tangible or virtual.
Yeah, the only thing I'm fairly sure of so far is that where Delores is isn't "real."
Thanks, that was very helpful
TCTTS
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I was told there'd be no math.
Try it again but slower.
Try it again but slower.
At the end of last season, Bernard went into The Valley Beyond/The Sublime. Post credits, they then showed him waking up/coming back from The Valley Beyond/The Sublime, what looked to be years and years later, seeing as though he and the motel room he was in were covered in a thick layer of soot/dust.
There were seven years between the end of season three and season four. So, Bernard was either in The Valley Beyond/The Sublime for those seven years, and his timeline this season takes place simultaneously with everyone else's - or - he was gone *longer* than seven years, and his timeline takes place even farther in the future,
There were seven years between the end of season three and season four. So, Bernard was either in The Valley Beyond/The Sublime for those seven years, and his timeline this season takes place simultaneously with everyone else's - or - he was gone *longer* than seven years, and his timeline takes place even farther in the future,
I'm a little torn here, because the latter would be more fun, but I've also been kind of hoping this season was going to be a little more straightforward.
But this is Westworld, let's get weird. I hope we have a concurrently told story set way in the future.
But this is Westworld, let's get weird. I hope we have a concurrently told story set way in the future.
It would be a little sad if Bernard and Stubbs never reunited with the rest of the cast again, but yeah, let's get weird. Way in the future could be a lot of fun.
Wait - these are robots we're talking about. They don't age. So Bernard and Stubbs could absolutely be reunited with the cast… way in the future.
Let's do this.
Let's do this.
We already know that there's a virtual version of the Hoover Dam thing because in the trailer we see William on horseback looking at it and he sees the same rip in reality that the door to the valley beyond was in season two.
Whatever Stubbs and Bernard are doing could be part of that in the future.
Whatever Stubbs and Bernard are doing could be part of that in the future.
Thanks for this summary!
where are all of these still from? I could not find them on HBO's site..
I took them myself from the trailers.
Sorry, now seeing the exact post you were responding to. Just watch the three trailers. There are at least a dozen shots in them, if not more, from the Westworld park itself. Some of it's of dead bodies at the saloon, and other shots seem to be of host William there as well, along with a few other things.
TL;DR
Just kidding. Holy crap that was very helpful. Thanks TCTTS!
Just kidding. Holy crap that was very helpful. Thanks TCTTS!
bobinator said:
We already know that there's a virtual version of the Hoover Dam thing because in the trailer we see William on horseback looking at it and he sees the same rip in reality that the door to the valley beyond was in season two.
Whatever Stubbs and Bernard are doing could be part of that in the future.
Just FYI, the rip in reality is virtual (or, rather, augmented reality) - something only hosts can see - but the Hoover Dam itself is a real, tangible location in-show. There's likely no virtual version of it.
That just gave me an idea, though. In season two, yeah, the rip in reality was the door to The Valley Beyond for the hosts. Their consciousness was uploaded as they passed through it, but their bodies fell lifelessly to the reservoir below. I wonder if a more malicious version of that is what Halores has planned for the humans in season four. Maybe she infects as many as she can with the flies and then makes them "see" the tear in reality… which happens to be right over the dam itself (as shown in the trailer). But instead of being uploaded, they simply fall to their deaths down the dam into the water below. I've stood next to that very ledge and looked down that impossibly steep dam and it's one of most terrifying things ever, to imagine falling down that thing. Would be really "cool" way to try and end a swath of humanity, though…
TCTTS
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