Political fallout and arguments regarding the US-Israeli action against Iran 022824

191,763 Views | 2351 Replies | Last: 1 hr ago by ATX_AG_08
nortex97
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AG
UAE foreign minister/secretary of state gave a great interview last night;

Quote:

Quote:

The answer is because we are an idea that threatens Iran. Because we are open, we are progressive, we are tolerant, we're a vibrant economy

Nusseibeh said Iran fired over 2,200 missiles and drones at the UAE, rather than negotiate over "well-understood concerns" about its nuclear program, over its ballistic missile program, and over its support for non-state terrorist actors.

Iran apparently thought this would split the UAE off and make them encourage the U.S. to stop. But the opposite is true, "This is a really ruthless regime, and President Trump is right to hold it to account today," she declared.

Iran has just ticked them off even more, just like with Saudi Arabia.

One would think Democrats in the US would politically agree with her. But, TDS.

Not sure if true:

I'd favor 'eliminating' them anyway.
Who?mikejones!
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bobbranco
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FobTies said:

There has been lots of talk about what the term "Regime Change" means in the US poltical landscape. Pretty good context below on the IRGC and what challenges might exist with actual regime change in Iran.



Siding with the Iranian terrorists is a horrible idea.
AGHouston11
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AG
Nancy Mace walked out of the committee this morning saying she's not supporting boots on the ground and what's being presented was not what was initially presented.
LMCane
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the entire world dependent on oil should be thanking the Israeli Air Force today:

FobTies
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FobTies said:


"You hate America and want us to lose"
"You like terrorists and want them to have nukes"
"You are a traitor"


All of these things above were said in the beginning of the Iraq War.


bobbranco said:


Siding with the Iranian terrorists is a horrible idea.
flown-the-coop
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BQ78 said:

Nancy Mace is losing her desire to support the war after getting a brief. She says the admin is changing their objectives for the war versus their original objectives.

Hopefully Trump figures how to end it before he has an embarrassing clash with Congress in April.

Nancy's click meter and funding coffers must have needed a bump. Her faux dissent is noted. Carry on.
Keyno
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AGHouston11 said:

Nancy Mace walked out of the committee this morning saying she's not supporting boots on the ground and what's being presented was not what was initially presented.


Anyone who was paying attention could see this was always going to be another boots on the ground regime change war. Trump can not come out and say that because of how unpopular that is and how much it betrays everything he originally stood for. It was always going to be a bait and switch.
YouBet
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AG
Keyno said:

AGHouston11 said:

Nancy Mace walked out of the committee this morning saying she's not supporting boots on the ground and what's being presented was not what was initially presented.


Anyone who was paying attention could see this was always going to be another boots on the ground regime change war. Trump can not come out and say that because of how unpopular that is and how much it betrays everything he originally stood for. It was always going to be a bait and switch.


Ironically, I think you are completely ignoring the usual argument for which you would actually apply to him...which is that he's impulsive, flies by the seat of his pants, and has no strategic plan.

He can't be both this and a calculated, devious strategist that has always planned this.

In reality, I think this is simply him adjusting to the current outcome and reality of where they are in the conflict. Which is exactly how he typically operates.
flown-the-coop
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AG
Some folks have woken up everyday this week to find out Trump is still winning and I think it may start to affect the mental health and stability of those here, in MSM, on the left / wrong side of things.

They cannot accept the Trump has delivered yet again.
Keyno
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YouBet said:

Keyno said:

AGHouston11 said:

Nancy Mace walked out of the committee this morning saying she's not supporting boots on the ground and what's being presented was not what was initially presented.


Anyone who was paying attention could see this was always going to be another boots on the ground regime change war. Trump can not come out and say that because of how unpopular that is and how much it betrays everything he originally stood for. It was always going to be a bait and switch.


Ironically, I think you are completely ignoring the usual argument for which you would actually apply to him...which is that he's impulsive, flies by the seat of his pants, and has no strategic plan.

He can't be both this and a calculated, devious strategist that has always planned this.

In reality, I think this is simply him adjusting to the current outcome and reality of where they are in the conflict. Which is exactly how he typically operates.

This is if you assume Trump is ultimately in charge of how this conflict is escalating. Unfortunately, he listens to the wrong people about this war. People with the intention of regime change and who are far more strategically intelligent than him.
FIDO_Ags
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Quote:

In reality, I think this is simply him adjusting to the current outcome and reality of where they are in the conflict. Which is exactly how he typically operates


That's just spin. AirPower alone has never won a war. If he thought that Iranians were going to rise up and overthrow the govt, then that was a miscalculation.

Maybe rank and file Iranians will rise up, but that is yet to be determined, and if they do, there will most likely be a civil war as factions fight for control which at some point will require boots on the ground.
flown-the-coop
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AG
Keyno said:

YouBet said:

Keyno said:

AGHouston11 said:

Nancy Mace walked out of the committee this morning saying she's not supporting boots on the ground and what's being presented was not what was initially presented.


Anyone who was paying attention could see this was always going to be another boots on the ground regime change war. Trump can not come out and say that because of how unpopular that is and how much it betrays everything he originally stood for. It was always going to be a bait and switch.


Ironically, I think you are completely ignoring the usual argument for which you would actually apply to him...which is that he's impulsive, flies by the seat of his pants, and has no strategic plan.

He can't be both this and a calculated, devious strategist that has always planned this.

In reality, I think this is simply him adjusting to the current outcome and reality of where they are in the conflict. Which is exactly how he typically operates.

This is if you assume Trump is ultimately in charge of how this conflict is escalating. Unfortunately, he listens to the wrong people about this war. People with the intention of regime change and who are far more strategically intelligent than him.

You talking points are inconsistent with the Trump cabinet meeting happening right now and available for you to get firsthand information.

Where does the concept of Trump being dumb come from?

Oh, and Hegseth giving a lashing to MSM in the room for lying about the war. Lies we see oft reposted here.

Laughable to think Trump is not in charge. Laughable. Delusional even.
nortex97
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AG
The obvious question in reply to me would be 'who should Trump be listening to?' I think his Secretary of State is a good voice, and seems fully aligned/informed.
flown-the-coop
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AG
Preach.

Rubio continues to shine. JD did a good job too, but Rubio is just a bit better on he technical delivery one would desire in both SecState and POTUS.
Keyno
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flown-the-coop said:

Keyno said:

YouBet said:

Keyno said:

AGHouston11 said:

Nancy Mace walked out of the committee this morning saying she's not supporting boots on the ground and what's being presented was not what was initially presented.


Anyone who was paying attention could see this was always going to be another boots on the ground regime change war. Trump can not come out and say that because of how unpopular that is and how much it betrays everything he originally stood for. It was always going to be a bait and switch.


Ironically, I think you are completely ignoring the usual argument for which you would actually apply to him...which is that he's impulsive, flies by the seat of his pants, and has no strategic plan.

He can't be both this and a calculated, devious strategist that has always planned this.

In reality, I think this is simply him adjusting to the current outcome and reality of where they are in the conflict. Which is exactly how he typically operates.

This is if you assume Trump is ultimately in charge of how this conflict is escalating. Unfortunately, he listens to the wrong people about this war. People with the intention of regime change and who are far more strategically intelligent than him.

You talking points are inconsistent with the Trump cabinet meeting happening right now and available for you to get firsthand information.

Where does the concept of Trump being dumb come from?

Oh, and Hegseth giving a lashing to MSM in the room for lying about the war. Lies we see oft reposted here.

Laughable to think Trump is not in charge. Laughable. Delusional even.

I don't necessarily think Trump is dumb. I just said he is taking his war counsel from people who want regime change war and who are strategically smarter than him. Iran was never going to agree to any of our terms from air strikes alone. Someone told Trump otherwise, and he believed it. But we are bombing them, and obviously we can't just stop without our objectives being met, so it needs to escalate.

Furthermore, and I can't believe this even needs to be said, but you really can't just blindly trust whatever Hegseth says either. We are at war, and he is the Secretary of War. Of course he is going to say it's going perfectly according to plan.
flown-the-coop
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AG
Keyno said:

flown-the-coop said:

Keyno said:

YouBet said:

Keyno said:

AGHouston11 said:

Nancy Mace walked out of the committee this morning saying she's not supporting boots on the ground and what's being presented was not what was initially presented.


Anyone who was paying attention could see this was always going to be another boots on the ground regime change war. Trump can not come out and say that because of how unpopular that is and how much it betrays everything he originally stood for. It was always going to be a bait and switch.


Ironically, I think you are completely ignoring the usual argument for which you would actually apply to him...which is that he's impulsive, flies by the seat of his pants, and has no strategic plan.

He can't be both this and a calculated, devious strategist that has always planned this.

In reality, I think this is simply him adjusting to the current outcome and reality of where they are in the conflict. Which is exactly how he typically operates.

This is if you assume Trump is ultimately in charge of how this conflict is escalating. Unfortunately, he listens to the wrong people about this war. People with the intention of regime change and who are far more strategically intelligent than him.

You talking points are inconsistent with the Trump cabinet meeting happening right now and available for you to get firsthand information.

Where does the concept of Trump being dumb come from?

Oh, and Hegseth giving a lashing to MSM in the room for lying about the war. Lies we see oft reposted here.

Laughable to think Trump is not in charge. Laughable. Delusional even.

I don't necessarily think Trump is dumb. I just said he is taking his war counsel from people who want regime change war and who are strategically smarter than him. Iran was never going to agree to any of our terms from air strikes alone. Someone told Trump otherwise, and he believed it. But we are bombing them, and obviously we can't just stop without our objectives being met, so it needs to escalate.

Furthermore, and I can't believe this even needs to be said, but you really can't just blindly trust whatever Hegseth says either. We are at war, and he is the Secretary of War. Of course he is going to say it's going perfectly according to plan.

You do not know what Trump was told and believed. And getting continually hung up on"regime change" is nonsensical and practically irrelevant.

We are not escalating as much as we are securing and cleaning up for next steps.

And I cannot believe this needs to be said, but just because you wake up Mad @ Orange Man Bad and declare Hegseth is lying because you don't like him and he is SecWar.

Do you have evidence of things not going as planned?
Keyno
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flown-the-coop said:

Keyno said:

flown-the-coop said:

Keyno said:

YouBet said:

Keyno said:

AGHouston11 said:

Nancy Mace walked out of the committee this morning saying she's not supporting boots on the ground and what's being presented was not what was initially presented.


Anyone who was paying attention could see this was always going to be another boots on the ground regime change war. Trump can not come out and say that because of how unpopular that is and how much it betrays everything he originally stood for. It was always going to be a bait and switch.


Ironically, I think you are completely ignoring the usual argument for which you would actually apply to him...which is that he's impulsive, flies by the seat of his pants, and has no strategic plan.

He can't be both this and a calculated, devious strategist that has always planned this.

In reality, I think this is simply him adjusting to the current outcome and reality of where they are in the conflict. Which is exactly how he typically operates.

This is if you assume Trump is ultimately in charge of how this conflict is escalating. Unfortunately, he listens to the wrong people about this war. People with the intention of regime change and who are far more strategically intelligent than him.

You talking points are inconsistent with the Trump cabinet meeting happening right now and available for you to get firsthand information.

Where does the concept of Trump being dumb come from?

Oh, and Hegseth giving a lashing to MSM in the room for lying about the war. Lies we see oft reposted here.

Laughable to think Trump is not in charge. Laughable. Delusional even.

I don't necessarily think Trump is dumb. I just said he is taking his war counsel from people who want regime change war and who are strategically smarter than him. Iran was never going to agree to any of our terms from air strikes alone. Someone told Trump otherwise, and he believed it. But we are bombing them, and obviously we can't just stop without our objectives being met, so it needs to escalate.

Furthermore, and I can't believe this even needs to be said, but you really can't just blindly trust whatever Hegseth says either. We are at war, and he is the Secretary of War. Of course he is going to say it's going perfectly according to plan.

You do not know what Trump was told and believed. And getting continually hung up on"regime change" is nonsensical and practically irrelevant.

We are not escalating as much as we are securing and cleaning up for next steps.

And I cannot believe this needs to be said, but just because you wake up Mad @ Orange Man Bad and declare Hegseth is lying because you don't like him and he is SecWar.

Do you have evidence of things not going as planned?

You need to look at this from a grand strategy point of view, not just whatever Trump says. Our stated objectives went from no nuclear enrichment program last year, then we added no missiles and no funding proxies this year. Iran was never going to agree to any of that. By never, I mean they would rather die than agree to that. This is obvious. So the logical conclusion is- if we want those objectives met, we need to remove the regime.

We threatened escalation last week with the threat of bombing Iran's energy infrastructure. Iran replied by saying they would start bombing desalination in the ME (matching our escalation). Trump backed off this threat when he realized how badly that would mess up ME stability (and the markets) and then came out with this 5 day grace period (conveniently lining up with the markets closing). As this is going on, we are deploying ground troops to the region (Marines and 82nd Airborne).

Trump is saying that he is "talking with Iran" while Iran denies this. So what could potentially happen is Trump can say "oh well those talks fell through again, we have no choice but to use troops".

You really have to look at what is happening more than what is being said.
FobTies
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Keyno said:

I just said he is taking his war counsel from people who want regime change war

Solid point. The diversity of Trump's advisement is what is in question, not whether he is "in charge". For some reason, its controversial to question that. All of America should want Trump's experts to be balanced in presenting risks.

So far, based on how the war has gone, and inside info from those who have resigned, its clear Trumps advisement is pursuing the regime change path Israel has openly pushed for. What's crazy is how Bibi's rhetoric now is identical to when he urged the US to replace Saddam.



Im hopeful Trump will eventually push back against those forces urging him to replace the IRGC. A path that will almost certainly hijack the last 2 years of his admin. Not sure if its going to take a military contraint, congressional obstacle, or American polling....but still plenty room to take an offramp and claim victory. Then blame any fallout on Bibi for forcing his hand, or his enemies here at home for hamstringing him. The clock is ticking, and that swift victory option becomes less likely with each week things get escalated.
flown-the-coop
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AG
Trump reveals during cabinet meeting that the gift from Iran was 10 tankers of oil.

Always running a deal that man is.
nortex97
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AG
Leverage...decreasing.
flown-the-coop
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AG
Keyno said:

flown-the-coop said:

Keyno said:

flown-the-coop said:

Keyno said:

YouBet said:

Keyno said:

AGHouston11 said:

Nancy Mace walked out of the committee this morning saying she's not supporting boots on the ground and what's being presented was not what was initially presented.


Anyone who was paying attention could see this was always going to be another boots on the ground regime change war. Trump can not come out and say that because of how unpopular that is and how much it betrays everything he originally stood for. It was always going to be a bait and switch.


Ironically, I think you are completely ignoring the usual argument for which you would actually apply to him...which is that he's impulsive, flies by the seat of his pants, and has no strategic plan.

He can't be both this and a calculated, devious strategist that has always planned this.

In reality, I think this is simply him adjusting to the current outcome and reality of where they are in the conflict. Which is exactly how he typically operates.

This is if you assume Trump is ultimately in charge of how this conflict is escalating. Unfortunately, he listens to the wrong people about this war. People with the intention of regime change and who are far more strategically intelligent than him.

You talking points are inconsistent with the Trump cabinet meeting happening right now and available for you to get firsthand information.

Where does the concept of Trump being dumb come from?

Oh, and Hegseth giving a lashing to MSM in the room for lying about the war. Lies we see oft reposted here.

Laughable to think Trump is not in charge. Laughable. Delusional even.

I don't necessarily think Trump is dumb. I just said he is taking his war counsel from people who want regime change war and who are strategically smarter than him. Iran was never going to agree to any of our terms from air strikes alone. Someone told Trump otherwise, and he believed it. But we are bombing them, and obviously we can't just stop without our objectives being met, so it needs to escalate.

Furthermore, and I can't believe this even needs to be said, but you really can't just blindly trust whatever Hegseth says either. We are at war, and he is the Secretary of War. Of course he is going to say it's going perfectly according to plan.

You do not know what Trump was told and believed. And getting continually hung up on"regime change" is nonsensical and practically irrelevant.

We are not escalating as much as we are securing and cleaning up for next steps.

And I cannot believe this needs to be said, but just because you wake up Mad @ Orange Man Bad and declare Hegseth is lying because you don't like him and he is SecWar.

Do you have evidence of things not going as planned?

You need to look at this from a grand strategy point of view, not just whatever Trump says. Our stated objectives went from no nuclear enrichment program last year, then we added no missiles and no funding proxies this year. Iran was never going to agree to any of that. By never, I mean they would rather die than agree to that. This is obvious. So the logical conclusion is- if we want those objectives met, we need to remove the regime.

We threatened escalation last week with the threat of bombing Iran's energy infrastructure. Iran replied by saying they would start bombing desalination in the ME (matching our escalation). Trump backed off this threat when he realized how badly that would mess up ME stability (and the markets) and then came out with this 5 day grace period (conveniently lining up with the markets closing). As this is going on, we are deploying ground troops to the region (Marines and 82nd Airborne).

Trump is saying that he is "talking with Iran" while Iran denies this. So what could potentially happen is Trump can say "oh well those talks fell through again, we have no choice but to use troops".

You really have to look at what is happening more than what is being said.


You need to look at what I laid out as the 3 objectives a couple of pages ago. They have not changed. Trump has been absolutely consistent regarding Iran. You just like to creat strawman of objectives then apply them to Trump and others as faux positions. It's old but if that's how you get your kicks, have at it. Just expect it to be continually shot down and nonsensical.

You need to stop believing what Jake Tapper tells you is happening and whatever Tehran Talking Towlhead is trying to get you to believe.

Iran is down to very few and feckless cards left in their deck.

And quit with the timing coincides with market closure.

Of course it does. This is nothing new. Major announcements and actions Friday after markets close to give weekend for globe to digest.

Trying to act like its new or Trump specific shows an unafamilatrty with history that is… surprising.
flown-the-coop
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AG
Since the cabinet meeting is mostly about Iran, I figure it should be noted hear that Trump has been taking questions for about an hour and shows no signs of stopping.

This after he spent 20 minutes talking about the Art of the Sharpie Deal and pens he uses. Drove the costs of POTUS pens from $1,000 per unit to $5/unit. And people say DOGE is dead.
Keyno
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flown-the-coop said:

Keyno said:

flown-the-coop said:

Keyno said:

flown-the-coop said:

Keyno said:

YouBet said:

Keyno said:

AGHouston11 said:

Nancy Mace walked out of the committee this morning saying she's not supporting boots on the ground and what's being presented was not what was initially presented.


Anyone who was paying attention could see this was always going to be another boots on the ground regime change war. Trump can not come out and say that because of how unpopular that is and how much it betrays everything he originally stood for. It was always going to be a bait and switch.


Ironically, I think you are completely ignoring the usual argument for which you would actually apply to him...which is that he's impulsive, flies by the seat of his pants, and has no strategic plan.

He can't be both this and a calculated, devious strategist that has always planned this.

In reality, I think this is simply him adjusting to the current outcome and reality of where they are in the conflict. Which is exactly how he typically operates.

This is if you assume Trump is ultimately in charge of how this conflict is escalating. Unfortunately, he listens to the wrong people about this war. People with the intention of regime change and who are far more strategically intelligent than him.

You talking points are inconsistent with the Trump cabinet meeting happening right now and available for you to get firsthand information.

Where does the concept of Trump being dumb come from?

Oh, and Hegseth giving a lashing to MSM in the room for lying about the war. Lies we see oft reposted here.

Laughable to think Trump is not in charge. Laughable. Delusional even.

I don't necessarily think Trump is dumb. I just said he is taking his war counsel from people who want regime change war and who are strategically smarter than him. Iran was never going to agree to any of our terms from air strikes alone. Someone told Trump otherwise, and he believed it. But we are bombing them, and obviously we can't just stop without our objectives being met, so it needs to escalate.

Furthermore, and I can't believe this even needs to be said, but you really can't just blindly trust whatever Hegseth says either. We are at war, and he is the Secretary of War. Of course he is going to say it's going perfectly according to plan.

You do not know what Trump was told and believed. And getting continually hung up on"regime change" is nonsensical and practically irrelevant.

We are not escalating as much as we are securing and cleaning up for next steps.

And I cannot believe this needs to be said, but just because you wake up Mad @ Orange Man Bad and declare Hegseth is lying because you don't like him and he is SecWar.

Do you have evidence of things not going as planned?

You need to look at this from a grand strategy point of view, not just whatever Trump says. Our stated objectives went from no nuclear enrichment program last year, then we added no missiles and no funding proxies this year. Iran was never going to agree to any of that. By never, I mean they would rather die than agree to that. This is obvious. So the logical conclusion is- if we want those objectives met, we need to remove the regime.

We threatened escalation last week with the threat of bombing Iran's energy infrastructure. Iran replied by saying they would start bombing desalination in the ME (matching our escalation). Trump backed off this threat when he realized how badly that would mess up ME stability (and the markets) and then came out with this 5 day grace period (conveniently lining up with the markets closing). As this is going on, we are deploying ground troops to the region (Marines and 82nd Airborne).

Trump is saying that he is "talking with Iran" while Iran denies this. So what could potentially happen is Trump can say "oh well those talks fell through again, we have no choice but to use troops".

You really have to look at what is happening more than what is being said.


You need to look at what I laid out as the 3 objectives a couple of pages ago. They have not changed. Trump has been absolutely consistent regarding Iran. You just like to creat strawman of objectives then apply them to Trump and others as faux positions. It's old but if that's how you get your kicks, have at it. Just expect it to be continually shot down and nonsensical.

You need to stop believing what Jake Tapper tells you is happening and whatever Tehran Talking Towlhead is trying to get you to believe.

Iran is down to very few and feckless cards left in their deck.

And quit with the timing coincides with market closure.

Of course it does. This is nothing new. Major announcements and actions Friday after markets close to give weekend for globe to digest.

Trying to act like its new or Trump specific shows an unafamilatrty with history that is… surprising.

Yeah I am aware of the additional objectives you posted. But again, it doesn't change what I said. Iran is not going to agree to any of that. So- you need to remove the regime. Which means boots on the ground. The card they do have is a massive army and a country built like a fortress. Bigger and rougher terrain than Iraq.
flown-the-coop
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AG
Keyno said:


Yeah I am aware of the additional objectives you posted. But again, it doesn't change what I said. Iran is not going to agree to any of that. So- you need to remove the regime. Which means boots on the ground. The card they do have is a massive army and a country built like a fortress. Bigger and rougher terrain than Iraq.

What are you basing your assessment on of what Iran will or will not take? If just your feelz or it's what Kimmel said are okay answers and it would make sense if that was the case.

Have you been to Iran? How long have you spend studying the terrains and geographies of Central Asia from both an historical perspective?

Me, I am an overall student of history and given my mostly retired lifestyle I have plenty of times. I've watched 36 hours on history of Central Asia, another 30 or so hours specific to Persia, another 24 hours on history of Islam and conflict, all 3 seasons of Tehran, any nat geo type documentary on Iran and the Islamic regime.

Spoken with an ol boss of mine who I am also friends with. He's the CEO of one of the UAE sovereign companies and has responsibility for beverages in Iran. He's been there a few times a very the past decade, though not in past few years.

I've watched near nonstop coverage of the current hostilities and the ones previous. I've participated actively across multiple threads over multiple years on this subject.

And I am very clearly disagreeing with your take on what the objectives are, what has been accomplished, what is to be accomplished and how those plans will be carried out.

It cannot be boiled down to a made up strawkitten of phrases and talking points about regime change, boots up on the ground, forever wars, and what Irans "demands" are.
TxAG#2011
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flown-the-coop said:

Since the cabinet meeting is mostly about Iran, I figure it should be noted hear that Trump has been taking questions for about an hour and shows no signs of stopping.

This after he spent 20 minutes talking about the Art of the Sharpie Deal and pens he uses. Drove the costs of POTUS pens from $1,000 per unit to $5/unit. And people say DOGE is dead.

Yea I was wondering why the market started tanking.
sts7049
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AG
flown-the-coop said:

Keyno said:


Yeah I am aware of the additional objectives you posted. But again, it doesn't change what I said. Iran is not going to agree to any of that. So- you need to remove the regime. Which means boots on the ground. The card they do have is a massive army and a country built like a fortress. Bigger and rougher terrain than Iraq.

What are you basing your assessment on of what Iran will or will not take? If just your feelz or it's what Kimmel said are okay answers and it would make sense if that was the case.

Have you been to Iran? How long have you spend studying the terrains and geographies of Central Asia from both an historical perspective?

Me, I am an overall student of history and given my mostly retired lifestyle I have plenty of times. I've watched 36 hours on history of Central Asia, another 30 or so hours specific to Persia, another 24 hours on history of Islam and conflict, all 3 seasons of Tehran, any nat geo type documentary on Iran and the Islamic regime.

Spoken with an ol boss of mine who I am also friends with. He's the CEO of one of the UAE sovereign companies and has responsibility for beverages in Iran. He's been there a few times a very the past decade, though not in past few years.

I've watched near nonstop coverage of the current hostilities and the ones previous. I've participated actively across multiple threads over multiple years on this subject.

And I am very clearly disagreeing with your take on what the objectives are, what has been accomplished, what is to be accomplished and how those plans will be carried out.

It cannot be boiled down to a made up strawkitten of phrases and talking points about regime change, boots up on the ground, forever wars, and what Irans "demands" are.


all that to say basically it's your feelz against his. got it
flown-the-coop
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AG
Informed versus not.

But I know that was a lot of words so maybe you just didn't read.

You are free to be a sheep whilst some of us are more apt at being shepherds.

You do you.
Keyno
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flown-the-coop said:

Keyno said:


Yeah I am aware of the additional objectives you posted. But again, it doesn't change what I said. Iran is not going to agree to any of that. So- you need to remove the regime. Which means boots on the ground. The card they do have is a massive army and a country built like a fortress. Bigger and rougher terrain than Iraq.

And I am very clearly disagreeing with your take on what the objectives are, what has been accomplished, what is to be accomplished and how those plans will be carried out.

It cannot be boiled down to a made up strawkitten of phrases and talking points about regime change, boots up on the ground, forever wars, and what Irans "demands" are.

I have AGREED WITH YOU on what our objectives are. Are you even reading my posts? And I am saying the Iranian regime is not going to agree to them. For them, this is an existential war. They have seen what we have been doing to the ME since 9/11- what we did to Saddam, Gaddafi, Assad, etc. They realize that fate awaits them if they surrender. There is no world in which Iran agrees to our terms and they get to remain in power. Not going to happen.
flown-the-coop
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AG
You seem to be convinced of that. I am not.

What are you not understanding?
Keyno
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flown-the-coop said:

You seem to be convinced of that. I am not.

What are you not understanding?

Do you understand the concept of grand strategy? Do you understand that Israel has wanted Iran neutralized for decades? Because they have regional ambitions and Iran is in the way of that. What happens if Iran agrees to all our terms (unconditional surrender is what Trump called it once)? Iran is disarmed and their air space opens. Then Israel just bombs them at will (see Syria).
flown-the-coop
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AG
Keyno said:

flown-the-coop said:

You seem to be convinced of that. I am not.

What are you not understanding?

Do you understand the concept of grand strategy? Do you understand that Israel has wanted Iran neutralized for decades? Because they have regional ambitions and Iran is in the way of that. What happens if Iran agrees to all our terms (unconditional surrender is what Trump called it once)? Iran is disarmed and their air space opens. Then Israel just bombs them at will (see Syria).

Sorry, forgot it was all bout The Jews. I think I see the misconnect.

No I don't think BiBi is assembling the 12 tribes for great Armageddon between the children of Abraham.

Can we consolidate all the Jewish conspiracy theories into one thread so as not to derail all others on the "it's The Jews" narrative being pushed daily by a select few?
Keyno
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flown-the-coop said:

Keyno said:

flown-the-coop said:

You seem to be convinced of that. I am not.

What are you not understanding?

Do you understand the concept of grand strategy? Do you understand that Israel has wanted Iran neutralized for decades? Because they have regional ambitions and Iran is in the way of that. What happens if Iran agrees to all our terms (unconditional surrender is what Trump called it once)? Iran is disarmed and their air space opens. Then Israel just bombs them at will (see Syria).

Sorry, forgot it was all bout The Jews. I think I see the misconnect.

No I don't think BiBi is assembling the 12 tribes for great Armageddon between the children of Abraham.

Can we consolidate all the Jewish conspiracy theories into one thread so as not to derail all others on the "it's The Jews" narrative being pushed daily by a select few?

Bro- Netanyahu has been calling for regime change in Iran for decades. Are you not aware of that? You just got done writing a screed about how well informed you are.
Slicer97
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AG
Keyno said:

What happens if Iran agrees to all our terms (unconditional surrender is what Trump called it once)? Iran is disarmed and their air space opens. Then Israel just bombs them at will (see Syria).

Not. Our. Problem.
Keyno
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Slicer97 said:

Keyno said:

What happens if Iran agrees to all our terms (unconditional surrender is what Trump called it once)? Iran is disarmed and their air space opens. Then Israel just bombs them at will (see Syria).

Not. Our. Problem.

I absolutely agree. My point was just to convey that IRAN realizes this, which is why they are never going to agree to our terms.
 
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