Mavs have been better since Nash left. Nash has been better since he left the Mavs. Don't know how there would be an argument against it.

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Congrats on winning a lot of games and still not winning a title. Dampier never got the Mavs to their ultimate goal. With the right coaching, Nash turned into a back to back MVP. Dampier got worse and worse every year. He was basically a 6 point 7 rebound player that was average defensively. Nash solidified himself as a top-10 PG all time. Has he been used to his strengths as a Mav, the Mavs would have had two legitimate super stars at once. Who knows what the ceiling of that team would have been.

The real defender in the paint for the Mavs was Diop. He was a much better defender against Shaq and Duncan.

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The Mavs got better when Nash left.

I dont see how losing Nash is a bad mark against Mark Cuban.

How many NBA finals has Steve Nash played in since leaving Dallas?

The Mavs have played in two, and won one of them.

The people hating on Mark Cuban for replacing Nash with Dampier would have a valid point if the Mavs got worse or stayed the same.

Your post deals with a lot of hypotheticals and what ifs.......Im just looking at the facts.

The history books show that The Mavs had 3 of their top 5 seasons in the three seasons after Nash's departure....and accomplished two Western Conference titles....two things that Nash has never done.

[This message has been edited by Kellso (edited 7/16/2012 3:58p).]

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The Mavs got better when Nash left.

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And Nash got better with better coaching. Had Cuban been able to surround Dirk and Nash with a coach that were able to more properly utilize their strengths sooner, how much better could they have been?

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How many NBA finals has Steve Nash played in since leaving Dallas?

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Stupid argument. You have to rely on your teammates. Michael Jordan never won a Finals without teammates like Pippen, Kerr, Pax, Rodman, BJ Armstrong stepping up. Nash also played for a pretty terrible owner that refused to keep together a super talented team - a team that probably had more talent than any Mavs team ever - in the name of saving money.

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The history books show that The Mavs had 3 of their top 5 seasons in the three seasons after Nash's departure....and accomplished two Western Conference titles....two things that Nash has never done.

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Again, that would be fine if all things were equal, but they were not. The Mavs had an owner committed to winning a title, damn the cost. Phoenix has an owner that refuses to pay a dime more than he has to and seems happy to field a playoff team as long as it is profitable. Two entirely situations and your comparing the two as though they are equal is beyond idiotic.

Also Dampier sucks.

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Had Cuban been able to surround Dirk and Nash with a coach that were able to more properly utilize their strengths sooner, how much better could they have been?

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Who knows. And I think that's kind of the point. 2 Finals Appearances > ?

Nash > Dampier

If Dirk doesn't get injured against the Spurs in 2003, we wouldn't be having this Nash conversation.

Dirk needs a great defensive center though. Dampier wasn't it.

[This message has been edited by TheMasterplan (edited 7/16/2012 4:54p).]

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Nash > Dampier

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I don't think anybody has claimed otherwise.

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If Dirk doesn't get injured against the Spurs in 2003, we wouldn't be having this Nash conversation.

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Wait, people actually think that?

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Again, that would be fine if all things were equal, but they were not. The Mavs had an owner committed to winning a title, damn the cost. Phoenix has an owner that refuses to pay a dime more than he has to and seems happy to field a playoff team as long as it is profitable. Two entirely situations and your comparing the two as though they are equal is beyond idiotic.

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Guitarsoup,

Your arguments are stupid....they are stupid because all they deal in hypothetical's.




The Suns had Shawn Marion, Joe Johnson, Amare Stoudamire, and Steve Nash and never made the NBA Finals.

The Mavs lost Steve Nash, and got better with the addition of Erick Dampier, Jason Terry, Devin Harris and Jerry Stackhouse.

I dont understand how you are too stupid to realize that the Mavs where never going to get out of the Western Conference if they did not improve on defense.

Nash was a horrible perimeter defender and the Mavs had no center to defend the paint when he was here.

The Mavs improved their perimeter defense with the addition of Devin Harris, and Erick Dampier.

and made up for the scoring ability with JET and Stackhouse.

How is Cuban a moron for letting Nash go, when the Mavs go 58-24, 60-22, and 67-15 in the three seasons after Nash's departure?

What has Nash won since leaving Dallas? He's played with more talent then Dirk....yet the Suns never made it over the hump.

Having two centers (Diop and Dampier) in 2006 and 2011 (Tyson and Haywood) are two huge reasons why the Mavs won the Western Conference both of those years.
As mediocre as all those guys are....their defensive and rebounding presence was huge in the playoffs.


I dont remember seeing Nash on any of those teams.

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http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-ball-dont-lie/dallas-mavericks-put-together-quietly-engaging-offseason-worth-150631377--nba.html

Good yahoo article on the Mavs

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From that article, it sounds like the Mavs are going to make a run at Calderon. If they get him, that would make the Mavs solid at the point (Calderon and Collison) and front court (Dirk, Kaman, Brand). The wing will still be an issue though. Guess that would leave us with a combination of Carter, Roddy, Do Jo and Cunningham at the 2 and Marion, Crowder and Carter at the 3.

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How is Cuban a moron for letting Nash go, when the Mavs go 58-24, 60-22, and 67-15 in the three seasons after Nash's departure?

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Dude. Even Cuban has said he regrets it. Stop sucking his dick and join us in reality. Even the other Mavs fans on here agree that the Mavs won despite Dampier, not because of him.

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join us in reality

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Had Cuban been able to surround Dirk and Nash with a coach that were able to more properly utilize their strengths sooner, how much better could they have been?

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Ha[d] he been used to his strengths as a Mav, the Mavs would have had two legitimate super stars at once. Who knows what the ceiling of that team would have been.

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Guitar, took a Steve Kerr miracle for the Spurs to win. It's not farfetched to say the Mavs would've won that series had Dirk not been injured.

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Guitar, took a Steve Kerr miracle for the Spurs to win. It's not farfetched to say the Mavs would've won that series had Dirk not been injured.

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You can't possibly believe that. The Spurs were up 2-1 with home court advantage when Dirk got hurt. The Mavs got lucky that Bennett Salvatore decided to turn game one into a FT contest rather than a basketball game. Neither team's fans were happy with how that game was called, but the Mavs benefitted greatly from getting to shoot 50 FTs.

Let's be intelligent and not pretend the Spurs were on the ropes. The Spurs had the series in hand when Dirk unfortunately went down.

[This message has been edited by Guitarsoup (edited 7/16/2012 9:56p).]

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Let's be intelligent and not pretend the Spurs were on the ropes.

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Typical idiotic nonsense from guitarsoup.

Kerr got hot in 4th quarter of Game 6. If he just plays merely great, the series is tied. Game 7 to decide it and teams were even for the first six games.

Typical idiot nonsense from Birdman. The Spurs won by 12 because the Mavs didn't score in the 4th. Spurs won by 12, Kerr scored 12. Imagine that, you leave the greatest three point shooter in NBA history open four times and he knocks down four shots. Not exactly revolutionary.

But Kerr still wasn't getting stops and the Mavs couldn't muster 10 points in the 4th quarter.

The Spurs had control of the series when Dirk was history. To say anything else makes you look ignorant and is revisionist.

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OJ Mayo ‏@JuiceMayo32
I will be signing with dallas! ‪#Mavsnation‬

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did not see that one coming

OJ Mayo to Dallas, per his twitter.

Dammit Dan!!!

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did not see that one coming

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Check out the post on the top of page 7.
on 07/09/12

I knew his name was floating around, I just didn't think we had enough money to get him to sign here, or enough assets for a S&T. I figured Phoenix would offer him something stupid after NO matched on Gordon.

Wow. Dallas cleaned up on the consolation prizes. It looked like they were going to go into full tank mode, then they pick up Brand, Collison, Caveman and Mayo. Gotta be happy with that off season as a Mavs fan.

i think they struck a really nice balance between staying competitive, getting younger, and remaining flexible for next summer so they can sign Howard, CP3, Harden, Bynum, MJ, and Wilt.

At first glance I'm wondering where they have the cap for Mayo (outside MLE)

[This message has been edited by simplebay (edited 7/16/2012 11:00p).]

I wonder if Dallas promised Juice a chance to play point guard, which was part of his problem in Memphis.

Had he taken on the Jet, Manu, Harden role, he would have been very solid, but he wanted to play point.


Grizz fans (me) are anxious to see how much his deal is worth.

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i think they struck a really nice balance between staying competitive, getting younger, and remaining flexible for next summer so they can sign Howard, CP3, Harden, Bynum, MJ, and Wilt.

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I agree. Not getting a big name made this offseason look like it was destined for failure, but honestly, we might be a better team than we were last year. It all depends on how the pieces come together and if we can gel.

But I love that we did all this while still retaining the ability to go out and sign a star next year. Honestly, taking Deron Williams out of the equation (and ignoring the move to let Chandler after the title), Cuban probably had one of the best offseasons in the NBA.

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Honestly, taking Deron Williams out of the equation (and ignoring the move to let Chandler after the title), Cuban probably had one of the best offseasons in the NBA.

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completely agree. If we just ignore the things that Cuban screwed up, the Mavs had an excellent offseason.

Most importantly, they went a long way to showing themselves to be an attractive place going forward. That's a lot to pick and choose from to go sign a player in 2013.

If you are keeping tract, the Mavericks have upgraded five positions this offseason?

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completely agree. If we just ignore the things that Cuban screwed up, the Mavs had an excellent offseason.

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Stop being obtuse. The Chandler decision was not a part of this offseason, and nothing Cuban could have done would have changed Williams' mind. For this particular offseason, he did a damn good job.

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and nothing Cuban could have done would have changed Williams' mind

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Williams said that he was kind of shocked or insulted by the fact that Cuban wasn't at the meeting. You can speculate as to whether Williams really meant that, or whether Cuban being there would have actually changed anything, but, at least according to Williams' statements, there's something Cuban could have done to change Williams' mind.

that or trading for Joe Johnson's albatross contract probably would have done the trick.

Apparently this will be a 1 year deal with a 2nd year player option for what they have remaining in cap space, ~4.5mm.

Unbelievable.

Started with 0 assets to work with:
Kaman signed for 1 year
Mayo signed for 2 years, 4.5mm/yr (should easily be tradeable after year 1 for cap space)
Collison/Jones acquired for 1 year
Brand acquired for 1 year

Upgraded at every position and now have 0 players signed after 2014, and only 2 players > 5mm signed after 2013.

Let the CP3/D12/Harden/Bynum speculation begin while the Mavs make another playoff run.

Collison/Roddy/Delonte
Mayo/Dahntay
Marion/Carter
Dirk/Brand/Wright
Kaman/Brand/Wright


[This message has been edited by InternetFan02 (edited 7/17/2012 12:06a).]