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Lol wut?

In spite of myself, I'm going to treat your questions as honest.

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2 honest questions: Why did Cuban feel the need to chase Deron Williams? He won a ring with only one bonafide Superstar, why try and get another at the cost of Chandler?

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Dirk is 34. Deron Williams at 28 would have given Dallas it's superstar for the foreseeable future to build around once the inevitable happens and Dirk's game drops to second banana status. Plus, it would have given Dirk a shot at another ring with the Mavs in the twilight of his career without needing superstar-esque performances from role players that would be sent packing, see, e.g. Jason Terry.

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...and why is the popular consensus on the boards that the Mavs COULDN'T sign chandler this year and field a full team...didn't Cuban offer him 20 mil for 2011? His deal w/ New York only netted him 13,107,378 which is obviously less than the 20 mil offered by cuban.

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TC was looking at 4 for $58MM from NYK, and only 1 for $20MM from Dallas with it known that Dallas was going to chase D12 and likely let him go after a year anyway. TC saw that Dallas planned to blow up the team anyway to get leverage to chase D12 and Deron, and consequently saw himself as expendable. Rather than take the cash for one year and risk injury or ending up on a bad team, he took a shot at more years and a chance to play with Carmello and Amare in New York.

In short, Dallas could have signed him to one and been as flexible now, and tried to do so. TC wanted the years, and I think he felt disrespected by Dallas for the way they chased him.

Personally, I think letting TC walk was the dumbest move a Dallas sports team has made in quite some time, but hindsight blah blah blah

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Personally, I think letting TC walk was the dumbest move a Dallas sports team has made in quite some time, but hindsight blah blah blah

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Agree.

I also think that if we had signed TC to the same contract NYK was offering, amnestied Haywood, and traded Marion or some other combination of necessary contracts, that DWill would have chosen Dallas over BKN.

Sucks it didn't work out that way. I am encouraged by the moves that have been made. The roster isn't a total laughing stock and still in position to make another run at some impact FAs next year. Probably looking at another offseason of disappointment but whatever.

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Personally, I think letting TC walk was the dumbest move a Dallas sports team has made in quite some time, but hindsight blah blah blah

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Dumber than signing Dampier to 6y/60mm while giving Nash the finger? Dumber than signing Haywood in the first place to that ridiculous contract?

I agree Judge. I'm really looking forward to doing this again next offseason with Howard, CP3, Bynum, and whoever else is available. Can't wait for more disappoint, more dry powder, and more prepyag laugh cry.

Yeah, because the Damp deal was to try and find TC. And they survived the Damp/Haywood/Nash deals because they found TC, only to let him walk immediately following winning a title --and despite commentary from the face of the franchise that he was the most crucial player on that team-- so that they could AGAIN chase the dream of another center.

Like "off the charts" stupid if you ask me.

But with a 38 year old PG, and 33 year old PF, a 35 year old 6th man, and then 34 year old Dirk and 28 year old Chandler, Cubes obviously thought having TC and Dirk on the same team would keep them from being able to replace Kidd/JET with a top flight PG. So what do I know....

Well, after the Mavs dumped Nash and got Damp, they did make it to their first finals.

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In spite of myself, I'm going to treat your questions as honest

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Well I appreciate it, they were honest questions because I (as a non-mavs fan) didn't know that chandler was offered a 20 mil for 1 year...So I didn't understand why you would waste a year of Dirk in his prime (albeit out of shape for the year) when you could've brought back the defensive player of the year and chased a superstar with Dirk's salary once he retires or restructures.

Could they not have Amnestied Haywood last year and resigned Chandler making Dallas much more attractive for D-Williams? Haywood would've made an average salary of 8,500,000.00...That's more than half of Chandler's salary for the long term deal right there he got from New York...and with very little creativity they could've had Him, Dirk, and D-Williams...because I'm sure having Dirk then Chandler ala CP3 in New Orleans is much more attractive than Brook Lopez and joe johnson

I don't think anyone was amnestied (sp) last offseason. I don't think it was an option.

Could be wrong though.

It was an option. Gilbert Arenas was amnestied by Orlando, Outlaw by the Nets, Baron Davis by Cleveland, Brandon Roy by Portland, and I think one or two others.

Sampsonite? I was way off....

Chauncey Billups was amnestied by the knicks (Huge mistake on their part) last year

I definitely think the TC/Dirk front court with Kidd on the bench was what Deron liked most about Dallas.

We (Dallas) got screwed when Dwight Howard listed Dallas as one of the 2 or 3 teams that he wanted to play for before he went schizo and opted into that terrible contract with the Magic. Cuban's fantasy basketball boner obscured his vision and he saw D12 in a Mavs jersey and lost sight of the fact that TC was a perfect fit for what Dallas was trying to do.

I think when Cuban got it in his head that he could land Howard, his plan was to piss on Chandler's long term deal desires and save the Haywood amnesty option either to use in a trade for D12 or to get him in 2013.

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I think when Cuban got it in his head that he could land Howard, his plan was to piss on Chandler's long term deal desires and save the Haywood amnesty option either to use in a trade for D12 or to get him in 2013.

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True enough. The 3D plan was all about bringing in both DWill and Howard.

Not sure if keeping Chandler would have been enough to bring DWill in, but it definitely would have helped. Going to play in NYC in a new arena, and for 25 mil more was a lot for the Mavs to overcome.

I think Cuban's treatment of Chandler (and to a lesser extent Jet) has tarnished his reputation as an owner that always looks out for his players. Ironically, in his lust for big time FAs, he may have hurt himself with regards to signing FAs in the future.

What did he to do to Jet?

Not match the Celtics offer and resign him.

I'm not complaining about the handling of Jet like we are about Chandler. I'm just pointing out that Cuban seems to have gone from one extreme (being overly loyal to his players) to the other imo.

Then again, outside of Dirk and Duncan, there isn't much loyalty in this league anymore so maybe Cuban is just getting with the times.

I think you're partly right, just maybe not as severe. Cuban has a longstanding reputation as a players owner.

The problem is that JET is/was a loyal Mav and has been extremely vocal to anyone that will listen (like he always is) about how he wanted to stay in Dallas. He had a quote that was effectively: I wasn't getting the offers I thought I would on the market. Something probably everyone besides him knew. When you've got a loyal, long-time Mav who overvalues his worth and ownership with the "keep the roster flexible" management style, it's going to be hard to reconcile. Despite all that, every quote form JET I've read had nothing but praise for Cubes and the ownership.

Yeah, I don't think the JET thing is a big deal. He got a title here, wanted to get paid a little more in his twilight years, and we didn't want to re-sign and watch his ppg fall off. No hard feelings.

I hadn't even considered the reason he didn't sign Chandler was not only to get Williams, but Howard as well. I guess I just never considered Dallas a viable option for D12. I think Cuban outkicked his coverage so to speak. Had he gone the loyalty route as discussed above, I think he could've pulled in Chandler and williams to play w/ Dirk. What a team Dallas would've had then...

That's an interesting thought, in an odd way Dwight Howard has also screwed the Mavericks by being such a flake. The Mavs could have re-signed Chandler, amnestied Haywood and had a better chance of landing Williams because of it. Not to mention that last years team would have been better. Those games vs OKC in the playoffs were very competitive (3 4th quarter leads), but the series wasn't (0-4). If nothing else Chandler could have swung a couple of those games and made a series out of it. Instead we got to watch Lam-Lam turn into a walking vagina, and now we get to watch Kaman/Dirk try to protect the rim. Hindsight, I guess.

here's a ESPN post from March on Cuban and his interview with Bill Simmons

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Mark Cuban keeps insisting that the Mavs’ summer formula isn’t as simple as significant cap space equals Dwight Howard and/or Deron Williams or bust.

Listen In fact, Cuban has repeatedly pointed out that the Mavs might not opt to create significant cap space this summer, which would mean buying out Lamar Odom, using the amnesty clause on Brendan Haywood and trading Shawn Marion to a team under the salary cap.

“There’s nothing that says we don’t just keep our same guys, right?” Cuban said on Bill Simmons’ podcast, The B.S. Report, last week from the MIT Sloan Sports Analytics Conference. “Again, there’s a variety of options. It’s pure market theory. You’ve got to see how the market prices itself. If you look at it, this year, there’s a ton of cap room. Chances are because everybody’s got so much cap room, it’s going to be inflationary and that’s not a good time to buy.

“So, Deron Williams, Dwight Howard, all these guys that people talk about are out there, but that might not be the best decision for us. It may be better for us to pay our existing guys, keep our existing guys. It may be better for us to wait another year, because in the third year of the CBA, the new tax kicks in with the big escalators and then that pushes down the price of players, so we might be in a better position waiting for Year 3 or Year 4, just depending on what it is, to go out and get that complement to Dirk or the next Dirk, whatever it may be.”

The problem with Cuban’s point: If they don’t upgrade this offseason, they’re missing an opportunity to maximize the potential of the remainder of Dirk Nowitzki’s prime.

But Cuban swears the Mavs didn’t just have this summer in mind when they let Tyson Chandler and other key cogs from the franchise’s first title team leave in free agency. He hints that he a two- or three-superstar system might not be the best way to build a title contender under the new collective bargaining agreement because of the limitations on teams that are over the cap.

“Now, if you look at the Heat, as an example, because they’re going to be above the luxury tax the next few years, put aside the financial side of it, they can only use the mini-midlevel and minimums to add a player,” Cuban said. “That’s a big restriction, so it raises the question: Is having three stars or two stars the best way to build a team or is there going to be a re-pricing -- particularly in Year 3 of the bargaining agreement when the luxury tax escalates and there’s doublers and all those things -- or will the market for players re-price themselves so a player who might have been a $12 million or $14 million player be a $6 million player?

“So you can have one star and three really, really good All-Stars and package those guys together to build a winning team and still maybe leave yourself some flexibility where if somebody gets hurt, you still have your full midlevel to add. Or do you sign three max-out guys who are going to very quickly be $60 million or let’s just say $54 million out of the $70 million in cap? And those numbers will stay basically relative, and now you have $16 million for the next 12 players on your roster and you only have $2.5 million basically to add another player of any consequence forever more.”

The simple answer: If you have a chance to add the game’s best big man and a top-five point guard in their prime, do it and deal with whatever challenges come next.

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Source

So the reality is that Cuban thinks he's the smartest guy in the room. Hopefully he is and will have the last laugh.

And here is why I think Cuban got rock hard for Howard

http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/mavericks/post/_/id/4677903/dwight-howard-to-dallas

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The Mavericks’ top offseason priority will be re-signing Tyson Chandler, the best big man in franchise history.

Unless they can land the best big man in the NBA.

That’s a topic of conversation today because of the bombshell dropped by ESPN’s Ric Bucher on SportsCenter. He reported that Dwight Howard’s short list of teams he’d want to be traded to includes the Nets, Knicks, Lakers … and the Mavericks.

All due respect to Chandler – and that is a ton, considering the massive tangible and intangible contributions he’s made to a title contender – but it’d be an absolute no-brainer for the Mavs to acquire a 26-year-old perennial All-NBA center if possible. Consider that an extremely slim chance, especially considering that the value of the Mavs’ best young trade chip (Rodrigue Beaubois) isn’t exactly soaring.

However, as noted by the boys on ESPN 103.3’s Ben and Skin Show, the fact that Howard is represented by Dan Fegan gives Dallas hope to get a deal done. The Mavs have an outstanding working relationship with Fegan, who also represents Jason Terry, Shawn Marion and Erick Dampier among others.

Just something to keep in mind once the lockout is lifted.

Now, back to the Chandler and the Mavs trying to win their first championship …

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So the reality is that Cuban thinks he's the smartest guy in the room.

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Was there ever any doubt?

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if you look at the Heat, as an example, because they’re going to be above the luxury tax the next few years...they can only use the mini-midlevel and minimums to add a player...it raises the question: Is having three stars or two stars the best way to build a team

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maybe not the best way, but it seems like a fairly successful way.

When you have two of the top 5 players and maybe a top 5-10 PF, you can get guys at the end of their career that still have some play left on the cheap. Gary Payton, Ray Allen, Shane Battier, Karl Malone, have all rode the coattails of players in their prime.

It was probably the best way under the paradigm of the old CBA. I don't think any of us are smart enough to understand what the new paradigm is going to be. Cuban thinks he knows it and that's the message that he and Donnie have been preaching for the last 6 months. Time will tell if he's right.

I think Cuban is definitely right about the harsh financial penalties for exceeding the salary cap under the new CBA, but it seems like he severely miscalculated how much other owners would give a **** about those penalties. Affect on the player market in the future should be interesting, and if I was a FA I would definitely try to sign a multi-year deal now instead of waiting until next off-season.

So now I'm hearing the Mavs might get Scola as well as Brand? If the Mavs can put together a lineup like Collison, Dantay Jones, Brand, Dirk, Kaman and Scola off the bench. Wow, talk about salvaging the off-season.

I think it's Scola or Brand, not both.

I like Scola, dude.

oh dear god. can you imagine a frontcourt of:

I think birdman is right. It's either Brand or Scola not both. Scola is not as valuable as Brand because he has only one year left on his contract.

Ah bummer, I'd have liked them both. But either is a good pickup.

Both can be had as long as the bids fit under the cap.

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