Kidd to the Knicks.

wow does that mean ramon sessions to the mavs?

Plan D?

It makes more sense for both teams the way they are currently constructed.

wow

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wow does that mean ramon sessions to the mavs?

Plan D?

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Please no.

Plan D? We're down to plan Q or so.

[This message has been edited by TMACsDaMan (edited 7/5/2012 3:59p).]

Sources are saying that the Mavs plan to resurrect the Antoine Walker at point forward offense, which explains their refusal to sign a point guard thus far.

I am playing REM's Everybody Hurts in my head right now. WTF.

Rick Carlisle to announce retirement tomorrow

Is that real life?

i made it up...but the way things are going...would you be shocked???

Which ever way they go, they go w/out Jason Kidd

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/8133070/source-jason-kidd-agrees-deal-new-york-knicks

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Maybe Paul will be next year.

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Why in the hell would Chris Paul want any part of the Mavs?


Hmm, I can stay in LOS ****ING ANGELES with Blake Griffin, DeAndre Jordan, Jamal Crawford, Nick Young and Randy Foye or I can play in Dallas with a 35 year old Dirk, 35 year old Marion, and 85 year old Vince Carter. Tough choice.

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Chandler fell into their lap last year and they let him walk. Good PGs and Cs are hard to come by.

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A bird in hand is worth two in the bush.

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Phoenix extended a qualifying offer to Aaron Brooks.

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Phoenix is getting Dragic, so Brooks is available. They won't match.

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I fully believe that if the Mavericks would have brought back Tyson and JJ and all the rest they wouldn't have won the title this year. I'm not sure they would have even gotten to the WCF. Hell, I bet if you re-ran the 2011 playoffs again, the Mavs don't win the title in more than about 30% of the trials.

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I agree. It was a great cinderella story last year.

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That will be a huge issue for the mavericks moving forward. They draft horribly. I'm not sure if they jsut don't depend on the draft, or are incapable of utilizing it properly, but for whatever reason they miss more than hit in the NBA draft.

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In the last 20 years, only six All-NBA players have been drafted later than 20th. The Mavs don't exactly have a lot to work with since they win 50+ games every year.

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1. Trade Dirk as a package of other junk for Dwight Howard.

2. Pray Dwight re-signs.

3a) If he does, build around him.

3b) if he doesn't, suck and go back to the draft.

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Stupid. You know a great way to make sure a guy won't resign - trade for him and put nothing around him and then tell him your 5-year plan for winning.

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Kidd will re-sign with the Mavs. 3 year 9 mil.

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Or not. He just got picked up by the Knicks.

It's tanking time. Too bad the lottery is rigged and there is no way that Stern gives the top pick to Cuban.

Mavs are gonna overpay for Sessions

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Mavs are gonna overpay for Sessions

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Is it even possible to overpay for someone as amazing as Sessions?

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Stupid. You know a great way to make sure a guy won't resign - trade for him and put nothing around him and then tell him your 5-year plan for winning.

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or do what the nets did and trade for a bunch of horrible contracts but decent players and plant a rumor with Broussard that you can trade for another one to convince him that you're building something. Add in the extra 25mm and it's a decent plan

[This message has been edited by Internetfan02 (edited 7/5/2012 5:40p).]

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or do what the nets did and trade for a bunch of horrible contracts but decent players to convince him that you're building something. Add in the extra 25mm and it's a decent plan

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If I am a stud point guard, I would rather roll with:
Brook Lopez/Petro
Kris Humphries
Gerald Wallace/Brooks
Joe Johnson/Morrow
Me/Farmar

With a few draft picks to trade.

over:
Nobody
Dirk
Marion
Vince
Me

with no bench

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If I am a stud point guard, I would rather roll with:
Brook Lopez/Petro
Kris Humphries
Gerald Wallace/Brooks
Joe Johnson/Morrow
Me/Farmar

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Well then you'd be short-sighted. What were the Mavs supposed to do? They had to stay under the cap to sign him. The Nets didn't. They could make a bunch of not-worth-their-contract moves and still sign Deron. Mavs couldn't. Deron had to come first. The wheeling and dealing via the Haywood amnesty and the 4 trade exceptions and MLEs would have come after Deron signed. We'll never get a true comparison of what Deron would have been playing with, except that Dirk at age 30 whatever is still better than anybody Deron's playing with on the Nets.

I'm sure Deron will appreciate Joe Johnson's 18 4 and 4 when he realizes he's getting paid less than him.

[This message has been edited by Judge (edited 7/5/2012 5:55p).]

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quote:
or do what the nets did and trade for a bunch of horrible contracts but decent players to convince him that you're building something. Add in the extra 25mm and it's a decent plan


If I am a stud point guard, I would rather roll with:
Brook Lopez/Petro
Kris Humphries
Gerald Wallace/Brooks
Joe Johnson/Morrow
Me/Farmar

With a few draft picks to trade.

over:
Nobody
Dirk
Marion
Vince
Me

with no bench

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Then you're a dumb stud pg who doesn't recognize that the nets will be slightly better than the Joe Johnson Hawks while having zero flexibility. You could have joined a championship organization and a true franchise star to build around

[This message has been edited by Internetfan02 (edited 7/5/2012 5:57p).]

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Well then you'd be short-sighted.

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Nothing short sighted about it. The short sighted thing would be signing with a team where the three best players are 34 or older. From his perspective, he has a solid player at 1-4 and a couple decent bench players in the best city in America. That's hard to argue with.

Where else could he realistically go?

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The wheeling and dealing via the Haywood amnesty and the 4 trade exceptions and MLEs would have come after Deron signed.

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But a bird in hand is worth two in the bush. What would Dallas be getting? They don't know. "Something" isn't a great answer. And if no one wants to give Dallas a bunch of players for free, Deron gets to spend the rest of his career enduring a rebuilding campaign. Oh joy.

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Then you're a dumb stud pg who doesn't recognize that the nets will be slightly better than the Joe Johnson Hawks while having zero flexibility.

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The Nets have more flexibility than the Mavs. The Mavs are toast. Deron recognized that fact and chose the better team.

Everyone outside of north Texas understands that. If healthy, I think this Nets team is solidly 3rd place in the East.

Where would:
No Center
34 year old super star
34 year old role player
34 year old has been
Stud PG
No bench
rank in the West?
5th behind LA, LA, OKC and SA?

Yeah, that's a great career move. SIgn up for 5 years to take a 1 year run with no center and no bench then a 4 year rebuilding project. But at least you get to be near your childhood home!


Bottom line:
Mavs didn't have as much flexibility or youth and Deron picked the team that has the better chance to be better for the next 5 years.

[This message has been edited by Guitarsoup (edited 7/5/2012 6:08p).]

Here was Cuban's business plan all along

1) Win NBA Championship

2) Dismantle Championship team beyond recognition

3) ????

4) Profit


the ????? = abandoning the team during this free agent mess for SHARK TANK

"Hey I just won a ring, but this is crazy, so here's my number...so call me maybe."

-Dirk Nowitzki

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Nothing short sighted about it

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Yep, still short-sighted. You have no idea what moves would have been made.

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And if no one wants to give Dallas a bunch of players for free, Deron gets to spend the rest of his career enduring a rebuilding campaign. Oh joy.

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Something you say with 0% certainty.

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The Nets have more flexibility than the Mavs.

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Only if you think half your cap filled with Joe Johnson and Gerald Wallace is flexibility. The real flexibility the Nets had was the one afforded them in the CBA in regards to signing one's own free agents. Depends on how you're defining flexible. 4 trade exceptions and a large amnesty candidate with a GM and owner who have a solid decade of winning by surrounding their one star with role players, the best player on either of the teams (not counting Williams himself) and a respected coach with a ring can be pretty flexible too.

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Where would:
No Center
34 year old super star
34 year old role player
34 year old has been
Stud PG
No bench
rank in the West?
5th behind LA, LA, OKC and SA?

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Yeah, that's a great career move. SIgn up for 5 years to take a 1 year run with no center and no bench then a 4 year rebuilding project. But at least you get to be near your childhood home!

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From the beginning I've felt the best argument for Deron staying on BKN is the cakewalk in the East. Not this drivel about a Mavericks roster that had yet to take shape. The real argument is certainty vs uncertainty - again, created by CBA designed to protect a teams free agents (something I agree with). The certainty of playing with some pretty good guys vs the uncertainty of a proven franchise with a future hall-of-famer and some flexible options to add players to the roster.

It's a tough decision. It's not a giant void between the two unless you just can't comprehend all the facts.

[This message has been edited by Judge (edited 7/5/2012 6:35p).]

http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/mavericks/post/_/id/4690648/dirk-nowitzki-im-too-old-to-rebuild

Dirk saying he's too old to go through rebuilding. Can't say that I agree with him...he's earned his ring...if he wants another...it'll come with another team

Deserves whatever he asks for. Would be really painful to see him in another uni.

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Yep, still short-sighted. You have no idea what moves would have been made.

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Burn Deron has to make up his mind before those moves are going to be made - IF they are going to be made. Remember that most exceptions go away unused.

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Only if you think half your cap filled with Joe Johnson and Gerald Wallace is flexibility. The real flexibility the Nets had was the one afforded them in the CBA in regards to signing one's own free agents.

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Absolutely. It is more flexibility. And with that flexibility, they can still put together a package of two young, proven players, a recent first round pick named to the NBA rising star team, three first rounders and get Dwight Howard. What does Dallas have to offer?

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4 trade exceptions and a large amnesty candidate

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Amnesty is used to get Deron.
There is only one good trade exception - Odom's 8.9mm. The other three are 2, 3 and 4mm each. You can't combine all four to get a player. You have to get a player for less than that money. Are you going to get a difference maker for under 2mm? Unlikely. You could get a difference maker with Odom's 8.9mm, but you still have a hole at starting center. But what team is dying to give away their starting center that makes less than $9mm/year?

He could go with things in place or he could go with "Hey, we promise we are working hard to get something in place once you sign!"

Bird in hand.

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Something you say with 0% certainty.

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Who is out there to be given away? What teams are looking to dump salary that would fit in one of Dallas' trade exceptions?

I am absolutely certain that using those exceptions (other than the Odom one) for stud players that are difference makers is not going to happen.

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Not this drivel about a Mavericks roster that had yet to take shape

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But Deron had the opportunity to chose between Dirk/Marion/Vince/Texas/Western Conference or Brooks/Brook/Humphries/Wallace/Johnson/NYC/Eastern Conference and the choice is pretty simple.

The Mavs may have been able to get one more player. But who are they going to get to make Dirk/Marion/Vince/Deron overtake Harden/Durant/Westbrook/Ibaka/Perkins?

This makes me sad

It's nothing short of amazing how fast the wheels have fallen off of this thing the past 48 hours. From a potential title contender to a lottery team just like that.

This episode of Shark Tank coming up better be pretty damn good.

[This message has been edited by Ag CPA (edited 7/5/2012 6:53p).]

If Dirk asks for a trade,

A) Who would he want to go to?

B) Who is willing to give a Teixiera like package back to the Mavs for Dirk?

What package would the spurs give up?

remember Teixiera like package

The draft picks in my mind would be useless because the Spurs are always on the tail end of the 1st round

[This message has been edited by TMACsDaMan (edited 7/5/2012 7:16p).]

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Remember that most exceptions go away unused.

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I think Cuban could have put together the necessary deals between now and December.

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And with that flexibility, they can still put together a package of two young, proven players, a recent first round pick named to the NBA rising star team, three first rounders and get Dwight Howard. What does Dallas have to offer?

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If we're talking about trades that will never happen, then the Mavs could offer Haywood and 10 first rounders for Dwight.

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Amnesty is used to get Deron.

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When we traded Kelenna Azubuike, it made it possible to sign Deron without amnestying Haywood. It's why it was done.

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There is only one good trade exception - Odom's 8.9mm. The other three are 2, 3 and 4mm each. You can't combine all four to get a player. You have to get a player for less than that money. Are you going to get a difference maker for under 2mm? Unlikely. You could get a difference maker with Odom's 8.9mm, but you still have a hole at starting center. But what team is dying to give away their starting center that makes less than $9mm/year?

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8.9 TPE is all you need. Dirk and Deron are already the heavy hitters on the team. The 8.9 exception packaged with player x y and pick for one player (center). The rest of the exceptions are used on role players (CJ Miles in S&T, Anthony Randolph in S&T - just a couple examples). MLE on Delonte West. Mini-ML on JKidd?

The options were there, and those are without amnestying Haywood.

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the choice is pretty simple.

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Both Deron himself and JKidd have indicated otherwise.