*** THE ODYSSEY *** (Christopher Nolan)

202,744 Views | 1906 Replies | Last: 1 min ago by CheeseSndwch
YouBet
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
The Collective said:

So much angst about so many things... I'm just worried about being able to understand most of the dialogue.


I am as well. I just don't have the ear for hard Boston accents and that Kenyan clicking thing that they do.
Peter Piper
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Thunderstruck xx said:

The reason we have these horrid casting decisions is obviously because Nolan must do it if he wants this movie to be considered for the Best Picture Oscar. So basically, you can all thank the Academy for this **** show, and Nolan for caving to this absurdity.

The Academy's rules for Best Picture consideration:

" Representation and Inclusion Standards
To promote diversity, the Academy has established representation standards for films vying for the Best Picture category. Films must meet at least two of the following four standards:
Standard/Description
A1 At least one lead or significant supporting actor from an underrepresented racial or ethnic group.
A2 At least 30% of all actors not submitted for Oscar consideration from at least two underrepresented groups (e.g., women, racial or ethnic groups, LGBTQ+, people with disabilities).
B1 The film's story must focus on underrepresented groups.
B2 The film's creative leadership team must include individuals from underrepresented groups."

Why did you choose to not include all the criteria?

https://www.oscars.org/awards/representation-and-inclusion-standards

Seems like a low bar to meet.

And Oppenheimer had only one non-white actor.
Thunderstruck xx
How long do you want to ignore this user?
CC09LawAg said:

This can't be real


Straight from the horse's mouth:

https://www.oscars.org/awards/representation-and-inclusion-standards

Hope that helps!
Thunderstruck xx
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Peter Piper said:

Thunderstruck xx said:

The reason we have these horrid casting decisions is obviously because Nolan must do it if he wants this movie to be considered for the Best Picture Oscar. So basically, you can all thank the Academy for this **** show, and Nolan for caving to this absurdity.

The Academy's rules for Best Picture consideration:

" Representation and Inclusion Standards
To promote diversity, the Academy has established representation standards for films vying for the Best Picture category. Films must meet at least two of the following four standards:
Standard/Description
A1 At least one lead or significant supporting actor from an underrepresented racial or ethnic group.
A2 At least 30% of all actors not submitted for Oscar consideration from at least two underrepresented groups (e.g., women, racial or ethnic groups, LGBTQ+, people with disabilities).
B1 The film's story must focus on underrepresented groups.
B2 The film's creative leadership team must include individuals from underrepresented groups."

Why did you choose to not include all the criteria?

https://www.oscars.org/awards/representation-and-inclusion-standards

Seems like a low bar to meet.

And Oppenheimer had only one non-white actor.


Those seemed like the relevant casting criteria. Hence why we have unattractive, vapid, and black Helen of Troy.
veryfuller
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Staff
AG
We have been over this, ad nauseam. Those rules were put in place as a virtue signal without any real teeth. Please go back in time and tell us which movies would have been excluded from Oscar nominations because of these rules in the last 10 years. Oh wait thats because:

Quote:

No mainstream movie has actually been disqualified from the Oscars under the new diversity rules, because the standards are designed to be easily met through behind-the-scenes studio operations. The Academy's Representation and Inclusion Standards (enacted for the Best Picture category) only require a film to check two out of four broad benchmarks.

Even if a movie features an entirely white, male cast and crew on-screen, it can easily qualify by meeting behind-the-scenes criteria. This includes Standard C (offering paid internships or training to underrepresented groups) and Standard D (having women or minorities on the studio's executive marketing and distribution teams).



1) the movie would meet these requirement without diversity casting. There are more than 30% speaking parts that are women in this movie, easily. The race of those women wouldn't matter to meet requirement A2.

2) Nolan's wife is his producing partner. She won the best picture Oscar for Oppenheimer. His films will then automatically meet B2.

But that doesn't fit the narrative you want around the movie. It can't be that Nolan just wanted to cast Nyong'o for his particular interpretation of the movie? That isn't a vast conspiracy against the audience, so that can't be the explanation.

M.C. Swag
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
How did Oppenheimer qualify and win then?
Peter Piper
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Thunderstruck xx said:

Peter Piper said:

Thunderstruck xx said:

The reason we have these horrid casting decisions is obviously because Nolan must do it if he wants this movie to be considered for the Best Picture Oscar. So basically, you can all thank the Academy for this **** show, and Nolan for caving to this absurdity.

The Academy's rules for Best Picture consideration:

" Representation and Inclusion Standards
To promote diversity, the Academy has established representation standards for films vying for the Best Picture category. Films must meet at least two of the following four standards:
Standard/Description
A1 At least one lead or significant supporting actor from an underrepresented racial or ethnic group.
A2 At least 30% of all actors not submitted for Oscar consideration from at least two underrepresented groups (e.g., women, racial or ethnic groups, LGBTQ+, people with disabilities).
B1 The film's story must focus on underrepresented groups.
B2 The film's creative leadership team must include individuals from underrepresented groups."

Why did you choose to not include all the criteria?

https://www.oscars.org/awards/representation-and-inclusion-standards

Seems like a low bar to meet.

And Oppenheimer had only one non-white actor.


Those seemed like the relevant casting criteria. Hence why we have unattractive, vapid, and black Helen of Troy.

Or cherry picked to fit your argument.

Nolan could've casted all white actors and still meet the criteria to have the film eligible for Best Picture.
Coog97
How long do you want to ignore this user?


Despite my fondness for the Homeric epics, I will honor his request and not see "his movie."
“Things weren’t gentle and politically correct in those days. We weren’t candy asses. Okay?”
-Frank Borman

“Who are you to doubt El Dandy? ‘Cause this guy’s a serious professional.”
-Bret Hart
hunter2012
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
Apparently the "modern audience" is too stupid to appreciate or understand Homer, frankly I find this statement shocking, Nolan has never been concerned with hand holding the audience before, that's what I really liked about him. Thankfully we'll have this dumbed down version for the fly over bumpkins.

https://www.hindustantimes.com/entertainment/hollywood/christopher-nolan-defends-taking-creative-liberties-in-the-odyssey-says-its-for-those-who-know-nothing-about-homer-101783306817028.html
Quote:

He added, "For me, we're making the film for people who know nothing about Homer and this epic poem, and we make it for people who are very interested in that world and love it. You have to make it work for everybody."

veryfuller
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Staff
AG
How is this saying its dumbed down? Its movie making 101. You make it for the broadest audience possible. There are going to be lots of people who have no idea about the story, so you have to cater to them. And he also said he is making it for people who know and love the world. He didn't say anything about dumbing it down.
Tea Party
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Yes the rules are easy to meet, but if the rule stifles part of the entertainment industries audience and the rule isn't even effecting the movies award eligibility over the past decade or so, then isn't the rule doing more harm than good to the industry?

The Odyssey would have one less talking point working against it as shown above.
Thunderstruck xx
How long do you want to ignore this user?
veryfuller said:

We have been over this, ad nauseam. Those rules were put in place as a virtue signal without any real teeth. Please go back in time and tell us which movies would have been excluded from Oscar nominations because of these rules in the last 10 years. Oh wait thats because:

Quote:

No mainstream movie has actually been disqualified from the Oscars under the new diversity rules, because the standards are designed to be easily met through behind-the-scenes studio operations. The Academy's Representation and Inclusion Standards (enacted for the Best Picture category) only require a film to check two out of four broad benchmarks.

Even if a movie features an entirely white, male cast and crew on-screen, it can easily qualify by meeting behind-the-scenes criteria. This includes Standard C (offering paid internships or training to underrepresented groups) and Standard D (having women or minorities on the studio's executive marketing and distribution teams).



1) the movie would meet these requirement without diversity casting. There are more than 30% speaking parts that are women in this movie, easily. The race of those women wouldn't matter to meet requirement A2.

2) Nolan's wife is his producing partner. She won the best picture Oscar for Oppenheimer. His films will then automatically meet B2.

But that doesn't fit the narrative you want around the movie. It can't be that Nolan just wanted to cast Nyong'o for his particular interpretation of the movie? That isn't a vast conspiracy against the audience, so that can't be the explanation.




Either way it is bad. If he really didn't need to make those casting decisions, then what other bad decisions were made in this movie? Or maybe he's just increasing his chances of being accepted for best picture.

Either way, just terrible.
veryfuller
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Staff
AG
I honestly don't think he cares about winning Oscars at this point. He just won a few and had cart blanc to make whatever he wanted. This is what he chose to do. I get the critiques of the casting, but I just don't think his motivation is awards this time around. I think he is making the movie he wanted to make. Just sounds like its not the movie you wanted him to make, which is totally fine. It just doesn't have to be a culture war issue when you don't like his creative choices, thats my point.
CheeseSndwch
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Francis Ford Coppola's Megalopolis was eligible for Best Picture but didn't receive a single nomination from the Academy and I'll tell you why that is, it was anti-Italian discrimination. Disgusting.
FL_Ag1998
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
veryfuller said:

I honestly don't think he cares about winning Oscars at this point. He just won a few and had cart blanc to make whatever he wanted. This is what he chose to do. I get the critiques of the casting, but I just don't think his motivation is awards this time around. I think he is making the movie he wanted to make. Just sounds like its not the movie you wanted him to make, which is totally fine. It just doesn't have to be a culture war issue when you don't like his creative choices, thats my point.


Here's where I'll jump in to say that yes, Nolan is simply making his version. However, his preferred version is what has made this a "culture war". I will add the caveat that the following are assumptions, but assumptions based on a lot of comments from Nolan and the actors.

Nolan's preferred version introduces characters and storylines not in the original specifically to show us a more feminist version of the story. His version made specific casting and dialogue choices to reflect a modern diverse world. You can't deny his choices venture into territory that's ground zero for the current "culture war".

So, its a little disingenious to say, "This is just Nolan's version" then blame one contingent of the audience for making this a culture war issue when in reality Nolan intentionally did that himself with his choices.
veryfuller
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Staff
AG
Talking points against a movie? The movie isn't running for political office or trying to convince of some policy. Its a movie. Why are there talking points against it? Oh, right, because there is an active online campaign against the movie, that hasn't been released in theaters yet and seen by the masses.

Also, I don't see why the Academy's rules have anything to do with The Odyssey. The Odyssey didn't make up the Academy's rules and isn't saying one way or the other whether its actively trying to follow them. But as I posted earlier, its not hard to do. Its not like they are marketing it as "eligible for Best Picture per the Academy's DEI RULES!". You are drawing the connection between the two, assuming that Oscars is what they are chasing, etc. I could argue that you are grasping for talking points against the movie because you want to, instead of just waiting to see the actual movie first.
veryfuller
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Staff
AG
What audience tho? No one has seen it. Its all assumptions.

And you are conflating "modern" with "feminism and woke". We are still talking about the same director who gets criticized constantly for under-writing female characters, right? I just don't understand this at all. Please point to his history of preaching feminism and woke-ism in his past work. Clearly, with the uproar, he MUST have been doing this all along if we are to make these leaps and assumptions.
CheeseSndwch
How long do you want to ignore this user?
"All art is propaganda." - Upton Sinclair
 
×
subscribe Verify your student status
See Subscription Benefits
Trial only available to users who have never subscribed or participated in a previous trial.