I am a bit confused with WS power levels as well. He was obviously CA's equal when he first showed up in the movies being the Soviet version of CA, but then later in the movies it just seems like he relinquished that power or chose not to use it. They gave him a gun in IW and he just seemed to have reverted to a normal guy even though he was also given a more powerful arm. Of course, my memory sucks and I may not remember certain scenes.

Also, does Stan look quite a bit physically smaller now than when he was in Civil War? He just seemed bigger back then.

Can't wait for this show.

Also, CA being stronger than Spider-Man is dumb. I don't recall where CA beat him in Civil War, but will assume it was a tactical win and not a power win.

He's not Cap's match in the movies in general, but they let him go toe to toe with Iron Man.





He's known as an assassin. They'd why he's got a gun all the time. That's how he almost killed Fury. That's what he used when fighting Falcon, Widow, & Cap until he wasn't. Then it was hand to hand and knives.

Winter Soldier used the gun heavily in Cap 2. When he fought Captain America, it was pretty even, but Cap didn't have his shield. Once he got it, he was able to knock his mask off, Falcon swooped in and Winter Soldier ran away.

One thing Civil War showed was how strong Iron Man is. He was kicking Cap's ass until it became a 2 on 1 fight.

Cap beating Spidey was more of a tactical win for sure. He gets webbed in both arms, but twists and pulls him in, kicks him out of the air, and then throws his shield to collapse some airport equipment onto him. I think.

rhutton125 said:

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Cap beating Spidey was more of a tactical win for sure. He gets webbed in both arms, but twists and pulls him in, kicks him out of the air, and then throws his shield to collapse some airport equipment onto him. I think.

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Yeah, that was it.

How would y'all rank all the avengers on power? 10 being most powerful, 1 is a highly trained human with no enhancements or gear.

10. Wanda
9. THOR, Dr. Strange, Vision, Hulk, captain marvel
8.
7. Iron Man, Spider-Man
6. War Machine, Groot
5. Captain America, Winter Soldier, black panther
4.
3. Star Lord, Drax, Gamora
2. Black widow, Hawkeye, Winter Soldier, Rocket
1. Nick Fury

Where is Wanda on the hierarchy in relation to a Jean Gray/Phoenix?

A quick search online has Phoenix/Jean Gray leagues above the rest of this group followed by Thor and then closely thereafter Hulk. None of the rest were in the top 30 or so as far down as I went.

That was one aspect of Civil War I didn't get. A major plot point was Bucky stealing the serum from the Stark's car to use to make the Soviet death squad super. Did they lose the recipe they used on Bucky or was the American one just superior or did I miss something?

They never said they gave Bucky a serum. All we know is the hydra scientist experimented on Bucky when he was first captured, then hydra did who knows what else to him after he was recaptured and given that metal arm.

There's a chance he was given a derivative serum, which seems to happen a lot in the marvel universe (Red Skull and Hulk were both results of attempts to perfect or replicate the serum), but I don't think anyone in the movies has definitively said that's the case.

Ahh I forgot Cap saved Bucky mid-experimentation. Then Bucky fell to his death and got experimented on some more.

Maybe Bucky was Hydra's only real success, then Shield had a prototype serum that Bucky recovered and brought to Hydra, so the secrets of that prototype died with Howard Stark or something?

Not that Cap's experiment was a walk in the park, but it sure sounded painful when those 5 winter soldiers underwent the procedure. I feel like every one of these experiments has a pretty terrible price tag attached.

Fightin TX Aggie said:

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I believe Cap rescued Bucky from a hydra base during the course of their experiments on him. So, he was the only hydra super soldier.

Then Red Skull is defeated. He had the most hydra super soldier knowledge, and much of it died with him.

Then scientist Zola goes to the US and is apparently a double agent. So, the serum Stark had was probably the only serum.

EDIT: <nerd level 13, unlocked>

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Gracias. Yeah, this was what I was trying to understand.

What about the blue serum in Incredible Hulk. Ross had a few of them.

So I forget..does Bucky just not age now or was he frozen as well?

YouBet said:

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A quick search online has Phoenix/Jean Gray leagues above the rest of this group followed by Thor and then closely thereafter Hulk. None of the rest were in the top 30 or so as far down as I went.

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There's no way Hulk is above SW.

PatAg said:

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So I forget..does Bucky just not age now or was he frozen as well?

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he gets frozen between missions

rhutton125 said:

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Ahh I forgot Cap saved Bucky mid-experimentation. Then Bucky fell to his death and got experimented on some more.

Maybe Bucky was Hydra's only real success, then Shield had a prototype serum that Bucky recovered and brought to Hydra, so the secrets of that prototype died with Howard Stark or something?

Not that Cap's experiment was a walk in the park, but it sure sounded painful when those 5 winter soldiers underwent the procedure. I feel like every one of these experiments has a pretty terrible price tag attached.

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I'm pretty sure that in Civil War they say that there are like 8 other soldiers, and that is the final base they go to to take them out. But when they show up, Zeno had killed them already, showing that it was just a ruse to get IM, WS, and Cap all in the same room together.

Rooting for a Tic-tac sighting.

Rooting for only Winter Soldier, Falcon, & Agent 13 as the only return "hero's".

Brian Earl Spilner said:

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YouBet said:

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A quick search online has Phoenix/Jean Gray leagues above the rest of this group followed by Thor and then closely thereafter Hulk. None of the rest were in the top 30 or so as far down as I went.

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There's no way Hulk is above SW.

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I wouldn't think so either.

World Breaker Hulk is the strongest Avenger.

rhutton125 said:

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Cap beating Spidey was more of a tactical win for sure. He gets webbed in both arms, but twists and pulls him in, kicks him out of the air, and then throws his shield to collapse some airport equipment onto him. I think.

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Remember from Civil War, when Tony goes to the Parker's apartment to meet Peter and May, it is made clear that Peter has only had his powers for 6 months. As an avid reader of the Marvel Tales reprints of the original ASM comics from the 60's, even though Peter was very strong, he still had to learn a lot and over time gets better and better at being Spider-Man. So we have a kid still learning his abilities when he faces Cap. And for those saying he handled Bucky too easily, he also held his own against Cap until Cap got him under the walkway. Plus, he surprised Bucky and Sam as they were in the terminal. Spidey had the high ground if you will. It was Sam using his remote drone that got rid of Spidey. Of course, his Peter Tingle should have helped him dodge that. But, he was still trying to figure that out as well and really didn't start using his Spider-Sense until he had to fully use it against Mysterio. SO Spidey is still very wet behind the ears even to this "day" in the MCU.

Bruce Almighty said:

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Winter Soldier used the gun heavily in Cap 2. When he fought Captain America, it was pretty even, but Cap didn't have his shield. Once he got it, he was able to knock his mask off, Falcon swooped in and Winter Soldier ran away.

One thing Civil War showed was how strong Iron Man is. He was kicking Cap's ass until it became a 2 on 1 fight.

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Tony fought well against a stone wielding Thanos. I know, all of this for a tiny drip of blood but still, Thanos at that point is amazingly powerful given he just is powerful and had 4 stones on top of it. Tony's suit is extremely powerful.

This is gonna be awesome.

It looks really badass.

So six 45min episodes? Basically two movies worth of content?

It'll vary a little. Episode one is supposedly 47 min with credits. If it's anything like Wandavision then it's more like 39 minutes of the actual show.

But, yes, about 2 long movies worth.

The reviewers said that episode 1 is 40 minutes without credits