Entertainment
Sponsored by

**The Falcon and the Winter Soldier Discussion Thread**

119,648 Views | 1228 Replies | Last: 4 yr ago by PatAg
Brian Earl Spilner
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
9:50a, 4/26/21
AG
I was looking at all the Cap suits from throughout the MCU, and man, the one from the first Avengers is still so cheesy. It looks like a costume to be worn to a kid's birthday party.

Why on Earth Whedon would throw out the great suit from Cap 1 for THAT is beyond me.
Reply Quote
3
TexasAggie_02
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Brian Earl Spilner • 10:16a, 4/26/21
AG
Quote:
Why on Earth Whedon would throw out the great suit from Cap 1 for THAT is beyond me.
i think it was an intentional gag. it was designed by coulson, who was a Cap fanboy.
Reply Quote
4
Fat Bib Fortuna
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Lex • 10:55a, 4/26/21
Lex said:
I am offended by the poor selection of 'new' Captain America. He isn't attractive and I miss real Captain America.
Reply Quote
22
Lex
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Fat Bib Fortuna • 11:16a, 4/26/21
Whatever. Sebastian Stan is good enough, I guess.

Even he is no Chris Evans.
Reply Quote
TCTTS
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
7:46p, 4/26/21
AG
Reply Quote
2
double aught
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Fat Bib Fortuna • 9:52p, 4/26/21
AG
Fat Bib Fortuna said:
Lex said:
I am offended by the poor selection of 'new' Captain America. He isn't attractive and I miss real Captain America.
Reply Quote
15
redline248
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to double aught • 10:02p, 4/26/21
AG
Ha
Reply Quote
1
rhutton125
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
8:54a, 4/27/21
AG
I ended up binging the series with a friend this weekend, after watching it week to week, and as with WandaVision... binging it is way better, IMO. The pacing is better, the themes connect better, you aren't having to think back to a character you met once 6 weeks ago (such as Yuri or Zemo's butler) when they show up again in the finale. It feels less erratic, where one episode would be so quippy and the next would be so serious.

Even the Flag Smashers are a little better. They still suck, but it's not as bad. Week to week felt like The Witcher, where Ciri showed up in every episode despite having no bearing on the plot at that time. When you binge, they show up here or there so you can track what they're up to, but it feels less like they are stealing valuable screen time from Sam or Bucky.

The only problem is... what am I going to do, not watch new MCU content for two months?


Side note: the Sharon twist still sucks and makes even less sense upon rewatch. My main takeaway was that there has to be some kind of rewrite/reshoot/COVID explanation, and yet there hasn't been any news or interviews to corroborate that. It would explain away a lot of the weaker parts (the writing of Sam's speech in the finale, the FS's motivations, the weakness of the GRC as a plot, the tell-don't-show problem throughout) - but so far it's just that - a fan theory.
Reply Quote
1
TexasAggie_02
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
9:56a, 4/27/21
AG
yeah, sharon does not make sense, unless she stole the real power broker's identity (as had been postulated earlier in the thread)

  • She was recorded as Blipped in Endgame
  • She only had 6-ish months post-Endgame to become the power broker
  • After Civil War, she would have only been on the run for ~1 year before IW. Why not join Team Cap? He owed her and would've taken her in.
  • After Blip, why stay on the run? She was proven right by helping Cap.
  • The scientist that made the serum was a government scientist that was also blipped
  • Zemo knew of the power broker
  • Unless there was a power broker before Civil War, how would he know anything? Prison Mole?
  • If there was a power broker before the blip, what kind of power did they broker?
Reply Quote
Fightin TX Aggie
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to TexasAggie_02 • 10:25a, 4/27/21
AG
TexasAggie_02 said:
yeah, sharon does not make sense, unless she stole the real power broker's identity (as had been postulated earlier in the thread)

  • She was recorded as Blipped in Endgame
  • She only had 6-ish months post-Endgame to become the power broker
  • After Civil War, she would have only been on the run for ~1 year before IW. Why not join Team Cap? He owed her and would've taken her in.
  • After Blip, why stay on the run? She was proven right by helping Cap.
  • The scientist that made the serum was a government scientist that was also blipped
  • Zemo knew of the power broker
  • Unless there was a power broker before Civil War, how would he know anything? Prison Mole?
  • If there was a power broker before the blip, what kind of power did they broker?
Power Broker is a skrull, and when he wants to, he appears as Sharon.

At least I hope that is the case because an evil Sharon is just dumb.
Reply Quote
7
dave94
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
10:44a, 4/27/21
AG
We don't really know how hard she had it post-Civil War. It could be that the government really went after her and she came out of it jaded, needing some kind of protection or group to mesh on with.

They surely have some kind of backstory that will be revealed since she is going to continue on as a presence in the MCU.
Reply Quote
1 edit
rhutton125
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
10:54a, 4/27/21
AG
It definitely requires some explanation. But this is the first time I think the MCU would need to commit an hour of storytelling to explain a dumb twist.

If only they'd sprinkled in a few tidbits in episode 3. Instead we have to infer all these things because at face value it's too dumb to accept.
Reply Quote
2
TexasAggie_02
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Fightin TX Aggie • 11:48a, 4/27/21
AG
Fightin TX Aggie said:
TexasAggie_02 said:
yeah, sharon does not make sense, unless she stole the real power broker's identity (as had been postulated earlier in the thread)

  • She was recorded as Blipped in Endgame
  • She only had 6-ish months post-Endgame to become the power broker
  • After Civil War, she would have only been on the run for ~1 year before IW. Why not join Team Cap? He owed her and would've taken her in.
  • After Blip, why stay on the run? She was proven right by helping Cap.
  • The scientist that made the serum was a government scientist that was also blipped
  • Zemo knew of the power broker
  • Unless there was a power broker before Civil War, how would he know anything? Prison Mole?
  • If there was a power broker before the blip, what kind of power did they broker?
Power Broker is a skrull, and when he wants to, he appears as Sharon.

At least I hope that is the case because an evil Sharon is just dumb.
I think for this to work, the Skrull wouldn't come into play until after Ep 3. Skrulls can only clone brief recent memories, so something would be noticeably off when she meets Sam and Bucky. A skrull showing up at the end would be more believable, as they could easily travel to the US disguised as someone else (down to the fingerprints, not just the cheap digital face tech) and then go back to being Sharon inside the secure perimeter. And this would tie into the secret invasion series.
Reply Quote
1
MooreTrucker
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
11:51a, 4/27/21
AG
re: the cheesiness of the speech - it's Captain America, duh. There HAS to be a level of cheesiness just by virtue of the name/history alone. Star-spangle suit and all, ya know.

"No, that's Captain America" - of course, delivered by the white guy. Also picked up on Bucky calling him Cap.

Sam and Bucky's developing friendship/partnership/co-workerness was fun and funny and enjoyable to watch.

Karli - I think we're supposed to look at this idealistic young kid and get feelz, but it's just not believable that someone like her can run an international terrorist (or whatever) group.

Sharon - a Skrull...I could see that, or something similar. After all, she showed up in the ep in the fancy peel-off mask thing. Who's to say she/it is not wearing one at the end.
Reply Quote
CowtownAg06
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
11:51a, 4/27/21
AG
In Endgame she was recorded as "missing". If she was off being the power broker and not wanting to be found they may have assumed her blipped. Plenty of other holes, but this one can be explained a bit.
Reply Quote
Capitol Ag
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to MooreTrucker • 11:54a, 4/27/21
AG
Quote:
Sharon - a Skrull...I could see that, or something similar. After all, she showed up in the ep in the fancy peel-off mask thing. Who's to say she/it is not wearing one at the end.
A Skrull wouldn't need the mask...
Reply Quote
TexasAggie_02
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to CowtownAg06 • 11:54a, 4/27/21
AG
CowtownAg06 said:
In Endgame she was recorded as "missing". If she was off being the power broker and not wanting to be found they may have assumed her blipped. Plenty of other holes, but this one can be explained a bit.
still doesn't explain what power she was brokering, as the scientist was blipped and didn't go freelance until later

doesn't explain how Zemo knew of the power broker and where to find her from solitary confinement
Reply Quote
dude95
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Capitol Ag • 12:27p, 4/27/21
AG
Capitol Ag said:
Quote:
Sharon - a Skrull...I could see that, or something similar. After all, she showed up in the ep in the fancy peel-off mask thing. Who's to say she/it is not wearing one at the end.
A Skrull wouldn't need the mask...
That's exactly what a Skrull would say...
Reply Quote
15
YouBet
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
12:32p, 4/27/21
AG
The other explanation is that she's hydra now.

Or she's possibly a double agent.

After shield discovers they were infiltrated and corrupted by hydra maybe Fury planted her as a double agent.
Reply Quote
2
1 edit
Claude!
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to YouBet • 12:43p, 4/27/21
YouBet said:
The other explanation is that she's hydra now.

Or she's possibly a double agent.

After shield discovers they were infiltrated and corrupted by hydra maybe Fury planted her as a double agent.
You're forgetting the most logical explanation - she's a figment of the imagination of a young autistic boy staring at a Marvel-branded snow globe.
Reply Quote
8
YouBet
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Claude! • 1:00p, 4/27/21
AG
Claude! said:
YouBet said:
The other explanation is that she's hydra now.

Or she's possibly a double agent.

After shield discovers they were infiltrated and corrupted by hydra maybe Fury planted her as a double agent.
You're forgetting the most logical explanation - she's a figment of the imagination of a young autistic boy staring at a Marvel-branded snow globe.
Certainly plausible.

The other explanation is that this boy is reading a mysterious book and then suddenly realizing Sharon is talking to him through the book and trying to convince him its up to him to solve these racial issues with the new Captain America.

But...that's IMPOSSIBLE!
Reply Quote
5
rhutton125
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
1:26p, 4/27/21
AG
I'd love if Secret Invasion opener with Nick Fury discovering the real Sharon somewhere and learning from her that there are bad Skrulls out there.

But I also think that if she were a Skrull, that would be the postcredits instead of what we got.
Reply Quote
1
Andyzipp
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to TexasAggie_02 • 3:11p, 4/27/21
AG
TexasAggie_02 said:
CowtownAg06 said:
In Endgame she was recorded as "missing". If she was off being the power broker and not wanting to be found they may have assumed her blipped. Plenty of other holes, but this one can be explained a bit.
still doesn't explain what power she was brokering, as the scientist was blipped and didn't go freelance until later

doesn't explain how Zemo knew of the power broker and where to find her from solitary confinement


They need to explain it, but I want to imagine that the original Power Broker blipped or was killed and she assumed the role in the chaos. It makes sense that there was a Power Broker before her since Zemo knew of the PB...by reputation.
Reply Quote
3
MooreTrucker
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Lex • 4:55p, 4/27/21
AG
Lex said:
Whatever. Sebastian Stan is good enough, I guess.

Even he is no Chris Evans.

Chris Evans is really old now.
Reply Quote
Lex
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to MooreTrucker • 5:06p, 4/27/21
39 years

June 13, 1981

Not old.

Totally still wood.
Reply Quote
1
TCTTS
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Lex • 5:26p, 4/27/21
AG
This made me want to look up who else would have been in my "class," as Evans and I are nearly the same age. Pretty good company to be in, all of us high school class of '99, all of us having just turned 40 or are about to...

- Hayden Christensen
- Macaulay Culkin
- Chris Evans
- Ben Foster
- Joseph Gordon-Levitt
- Ryan Gosling
- Jake Gyllenhaal
- Tom Hiddleston
- Zachary Levi
- Rami Malek
- Chris Pine
- Elijah Wood
Reply Quote
Lex
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to TCTTS • 5:39p, 4/27/21
TCTTS said:
This made me want to look up who else would have been in my "class," as Evans and I are nearly the same age. Pretty good company to be in, all of us high school class of '99, all of us having just turned 40 or are about to...

- Hayden Christensen
- Macaulay Culkin
- Chris Evans
- Ben Foster
- Joseph Gordon-Levitt
- Ryan Gosling
- Jake Gyllenhaal
- Tom Hiddleston
- Zachary Levi
- Rami Malek
- Chris Pine
- Elijah Wood


Lots of very attractive men on this list. Hiddleston, Wood, Pine, Gosling, JGL and Evans have aged beautifully.
Reply Quote
JJxvi
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
5:39p, 4/27/21
AG
JJxvi...
Reply Quote
MooreTrucker
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Lex • 6:02p, 4/27/21
AG
I was talking old in terms of the show. Like his character is old, ya know.
Reply Quote
1
1 edit
Lex
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to MooreTrucker • 6:09p, 4/27/21
No.
Reply Quote
Rick Dalton
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Lex • 8:21p, 4/27/21
AG
Yes.
Reply Quote
8
Lex
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Rick Dalton • 8:57p, 4/27/21
PDEMDHC
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Rick Dalton • 7:57a, 4/28/21
AG
blazing7s94 said:
Yes.


No, I don't think I will...
Reply Quote
8
MooreTrucker
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Lex • 9:11a, 4/28/21
AG
Lex said:
No.
The joke
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
You
Reply Quote
3
Gigem314
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to FancyKetchup14 • 9:31a, 4/28/21
AG
FancyKetchup14 said:
Wasn't the best show and had flaws that have already been stated here, but I thought it was fine. Bucky's story arc was my favorite part of the series.
Agreed. I like that he's now moved past his former life and knows who he is.

Sebastian Stan absolutely KILLED IT in this series. Really impressed with the added depth to the character and looking forward to seeing more of Bucky in the future.

Anthony Mackie was the perfect fit for Sam, and we knew he was good coming in. What I've always liked about Mackie is that he does such a great balance of serious and humor. Sam's humor and light-heartedness made him an instantly likeable character in Winter Soldier. I have to say I was a little disappointed with how that was taken away as this series went on. The storyline got a little too preachy and it just seemed out of character for Sam at times. I hope he returns to form in the next movie or series.

I was curious how they would 'transition' Sam from Falcon to Cap. I really like the new suit, it allows Sam to take up the mantle of Captain America but still be a skilled pilot.

As many have said, the Flag-Smashers were a poor villain and not well executed. I think it took a back seat to the other 'challenges' in the show, for better or worse. The villain wasn't much of the focus in this one.

Overall, the series accomplished what I was hoping for:
- Sam taking up the shield
- Getting more of a background on Sam's character (Nice to have an Avenger from the South)
- Bucky leaving his past behind
- Sam and Bucky teaming up and becoming "partners but not partners"

A little too heavy handed at times, but still a fun ride with a lot of great banter between Sam and Bucky. I do like the way Sam gave Isaiah recognition at the end. And it was fun watching Bucky find a 'family' with Sam's family. The scene at the party where Bucky is standing there casually talking while the two kids hang from his arm is such a great visual illustration of how far his character has come.
Reply Quote
12
2 edits
 
×
subscribe Verify your student status
See Subscription Benefits
Trial only available to users who have never subscribed or participated in a previous trial.